Hi, I would like to give a sugestion that maybe many would probably agree to be a good idea. The art of capturing a base should be something to be played as a team in order to be fast and efficient, as well as it should have its own sort of challenge even when roguing around alone, that is why I think it would be intereresting to add some somewhat weak but still effective automated turrets around the base and inside places such as the capture point room. These automated turrets would be special: - Have especific places for them inside the base - Have weak, but still effective damage, simmilar to the engineer automated turret, but with shorter range; - Attack both visible and fast moving invisible (cloaked) units; - Automatically respawn in a period of 1m, getting a 30s speed boost each 1/4 of objective/capture time hit (in the whole base). - Can not be manually respawned by an engineer, but can still be repaired (while spawned) by them or hacked by infiltrators; - At each 1/4 of objective/capture time hit, more automated turrets would spawn aroud other especific places of the base (but never at the same place) - The extra turrets spawned at each 1/4 of 'base capture time' remain active for at least 1m after the mark has been lowered bellow their especific trigger point as a result of an "allert" mode. - Equally, once the base is completly captured, all automated turrets switch to the capturing team side and stay active for at least 1 min as a result of an "allert mode". With these in mind I guess that base capturing should become something more interesting in any kind of situation, giving more ground of notion to what exactly is going on to the defending team, while also giving a great new set of tactics to be tested creativelly around for both offensive and defensive teams, still stimulating teamplay in order to overcome any sort of situation in order to win.
Or give engineers something like the spitfire from PS1: Smaller, better damage, no beeping that can be heard 50m away, the ability to place more than one if certed. (and if you really wanted to be mean.... cloak it.) With a resource cost, of course. The current spit just sucks, imo.
Not a very good idea. Just some random killturrets isn't going to be a good addition to the game, what you want is to make taking a base more of a team effort with goals and tactics, so how about these kind of things: Have multiple mini-generators across a base, these can be destroyed with small-arms fire and other weapons (some could be in places where air or vehicles can better take them out). These generators power a variety of objects. Shields on doors. These prevent enemies from entering through them, but not shooting through them. This allows the defenders more freedom of movement and guides the attackers into more chokepoints until the generator is destroyed. Non-automated turrets. Have for example the Xiphos anti-infantry turret placed overlooking the pointroom. This would give the defenders a mighty tool to keep enemy infantry out until the generator powering it is destroyed. Environmental hazard switches. We already have something similar on Esamir with the lightbridges, pushing a switch will cause an environmental hazard nearby, either as an aimed weapon or a local static effect. Think electrifying a floor to cause damage to anyone passing through, having a local light mortar that can be fired, the recycling tools of Tawrich Recycling being used on some infantry etc. Local support tools. local radar, permanent faction-wide droppod beacons, faction-only teleporters and jumppads etc could be powered, meaning the attackers need to disable them in order to reduce the defender's advantages. More you can think off.
Yeah! That's a great idea! Giving the engineer a turret that can 1v1 any other player is totally not going to be an OP weapons design especially when the engineer sticks around to defend the turret making any engagement with an engineer basically a 2v1! And it's like a ranged automatic mine as well! What could go wrong with a design like that! /s Learn to use the current spitfire, it's massively useful if you don't just randomly dump it down anywhere and don't expect it to be an automatic kill just because you placed it.
The problem with the spitfire is that it cant aim, if you just slightly step to the side while firing at it it will never hit you that combined with its low RoF and low damage per shot makes it one of the least threatening things in the game, I fear vanguards more when Im playing NC than I fear enemy spitfires.
Hah it's always fun to read these kind of posts. Easy to poke holes in your arguments though. So "slightly" sidestepping to the side will prevent it hitting you? Not in my experience, but even so that only gives you an argument for faster rotation. So someone needs to get up close to the Spitfire and then start dancing to prevent damage against it? Let me show you what I see: - A guy sprints to the spitfire. He's not firing at you or getting into tactical positions. He's a target that can be shot and killed. - The guy starts moving around the spitfire to prevent damage. He's unable to lay down a lot of fire towards you/friendlies. He's a target that can be shot and killed. - The guy starts shooting at the spitfire. He's not laying down fire to you/friendlies. He's a target that can be shot and killed. - The guy kills the spitfire. He's down bullets, unlikely to be able to kill anyone else unless he's got a LMG. He's a target that can be shot and killed. In all cases you're able to shoot and kill the enemy. If you or friendlies are not around to directly damage the enemy, you're either doing something wrong or you're using the secondary function. It's a great spotter for you! You can hear it fire, softening up the enemy as well as pulling them out of positions. Those are a lot of things it does all at the same time. That is tactically very strong. You're talking about a game where people are already calling weapons OP when they have a 2% difference in effectiveness, and this thing does so much more! It can easily add 10-50% damage on a target, which is already insane if compared to the small differences that individual weapons have. And again, it spots, damages, gets the enemy out of position and generally costs time. This time costing function is really invaluable. That you're fearing friendly Vanguards more says more about your inability to see the tactical applications of the spitfire than showing the spitfire is weak. I have to say no against the automated turrets. This game is (was) all dictated by players themselves. Each plane you see crashing, each grenade you see flying and each sundy spawn point is setup and used by the players themselves. It is a player vs player experience. But as Demigan mentions, you can still implement the idea in a different form. There are a lot of things you can do to improve teamplay without resorting to automated defences. Doors, utilities and other mechanics can be used to make teamplay more important in taking a base. That way you keep the agency for all players, but still get the teamplay you want.
You can just AD spam them at range and they'll barely be able to hit you whilst you kill them. You don't need to run up to it to dodge it. Also if you're HA (the most common infantry) just use your launcher and instagib it from peeking out of whatever cover you're behind, or use your shield and tank it cus it's damage range is worse than your shield activation cost lol. If the spitfire is doing 50% of the damage to a target you have a very very bad aim. It doesn't spot anything, Infiltrators dildar is what you use for that which is far far more detailed, has more range and doesn't need LoS. It also doesn't get the enemy out of position since they are coming through the door anyway. It sits firmly in the trash spot and robot technician puts it into barely into the UP spot. If the server is ******** itself it becomes even more useless.
Really, this just tells me how incompetent you are with it. "It doesn't spot anything"? Sure it isn't like the spotters, but you sure as hell know something is there when it starts shooting. You don't always have the option to have darts or want to fire them, especially as an engi, but if you're for example camping in a tank somewhere, these things can easily "spot" or even deter/kill people who try to kick your tunnel visioned *ss. You can ADAD from a distance? Well great! You can still be shot and killed while doing that. You're distracted! Instagib it with a RL? So you leave yourself open to whatever other enemies are still around, having to switch to your main weapon and such? That isn't an advantage you say? Tanking the damage of the spitfire won't give the enemies any advantage either? The distraction it causes to kill it? I mean what are you trying to waylay here? Are you trying to say you're better off without the spitfire? And if you put it in a trash spot, it's a mistake of you? I have no idea where you're going with this half argument. I'm saying you can get really good advantages if you know what to do and you're just here practically saying you would be better off without it Again, if you're not seeing or using these advantages it's not a reason to buff it. Its a reason for you to get better with it. It's like saying you're horrible with snipers as you always miss, so you want a full auto minimum COF version so it becomes effective in your hands. That's a big fallacy, as a lot of people are already good with it and you just suck with it.
Oh yeah, and you're Mr amazing with it are you, Mr 18 kills with it. Unfortunately it has no ability to tell what level of threat is coming at it. Is it a stalker infil trying to circle and hack it or it is a HA who will just gib it. I have to go make that assessment myself, which really limits how useful it actually is. Not to mention it only covers 1 room when there could multiple entrances. A cloaker can also just cloak right past it. You must a toddler if a spirtfire is enough to distract you from killing the actual threat of the engineer. Either the engineer engages at the same time as you see the turret cus he was looking at your entry point anyway or the spitfire dies. You then have the knowledge that an engineer is possibly nearby but the engineer only knows of your vague location. This is in contrast to dildars who will know exactly where you are and where you're going. No it's not. At most you bought yourself 2 seconds from a HA having switch to his primary. If the heavy chooses to reload his rocket then it's up to 6, but he can still swap to side-arm pistol should you choose to engage him. If he's just running up the stairs or into the room before changing to his primary then he's probably not very good anyway. That the spitfire is not very good at all. It was even worse when you had to go to terminals to get another one. Considering I have to give up the AV mana turret for it, sacrificing mid range AV damage, most of the time yeah. Those advantages aren't that useful I'm afraid. Oh yeah? Name them. Show me who is amazing with it. It certainly isn't you.
Hah you're at the end of your rope aren't you? A - this isn't my main account and B - I got nearly all of those by hacking a spitfire. Using personal stats to disprove efficiency with it is a weak tactic, even more so with the spitfire. I'm telling you the spitfire aids me in killing, and is not the killer. But besides that, you don't need to drive a car to be a traffic engineer. That is something you quite don't understand. But also your gems like "You then have the knowledge that an engineer is possibly nearby but the engineer only knows of your vague location." I mean what!? The engi can be anywhere while the target of the spitfire can only be in a certain radius, as well as the placement of the spitfire can suggest most probable directions. I mean what kind of tactical genius are you? And the fact you call the advantages bad or not useful just shows your tactical insight. None. I can make use of all of those advantages to kill people much more easily and efficiently. If you cannot, then that's your problem and not of the spitfire.
The Recon Dart is a terrible weapon! It doesn't get any kills whatsoever! Or what about the AOE regen of Medics! No kills at all! It can't be tactically useful in any way now! Oh noes! Oh wait all those have purposes that don't necessarily involve killing. Spitfires can help you warn of enemies, Spitfires add DPS to an enemy if you remain close (and similar to a MANA turret, AOE regen, Dildar, recon dart etc, being relatively close is kind of the only way to effectively use it), Spitfires soak up 2000 damage worth of bullets which is a hefty price for any non-LMG weapon that makes them extremely vulnerable and Spitfires can finish off wounded enemies that targeted you first (assuming you were more or less equally skilled as your opponent). Again, if you can't use all of that, how do you even load up the game?
While it is weak that beeping is quite good for watching your back. I sometimes play a Minor Cloak + Robotics Tech Engineer to hold a point, having the very noticeable spitfire drawing the attention means you can get comfortably behind 1 or 2 enemies with an auto-shotgun and end them. If you have mines strategically placed you can hold a room for some time if they don't come in more than 2s and 3s That said I'd not be opposed to an alternate model eg Hurricane (in keeping with WW2 era British fighters) that was essentially a PMB module with a Kobalt on top. Something fixed that wouldn't auto repair but would be able to take all but a decimator or tank round. If such turrets were fixed base defences you could even have them controlled by a hackable and/or destructible AI terminal. You'd have three options: Assault the position directly and destroy the turrets, relying on numbers and medics to res your fallen. Destroy the AI terminal disabling the turrets allowing them to be destroyed at your leisure. Capture the AI terminal turning any active turrets on the defenders. This would lead to some interesting dynamic plays as attackers would likely wish to hack or disable such turrets before pushing into choke points or point rooms they covered.
