Liberators are the new ESF

Just make it so you can't switch seats in a Lib once the gear is up. That way a Lib can still be lethal but at least it will require teamwork. Also put in a pitch/roll max to give the ESF a tactical advantage if they can get altitude.

This.

But THIS takes a LOT of practice and skill. Not saying I'm amazing but in general it does.

They simply wouldn't do that. Once again what I do, and what others do (solo libbing) takes a lot of skill and isn't common. So no need to nerf it when players like me have put time and effort into getting good at solo libbing. I dare you to try it and see what happens.... you won't think its so OP then. And why would they put a pitch up and down roll max when that basically would give the lib NO chance of fighting back. Like really.....

Isn't common? I saw more Vanu Libs on indar this noon then Scythes.

"Skill" hasn't stopped SOE from nerfing ESF reverse maneuver so that the craft drains more afterburner when in hover mode

By isn't common I meant GOOD solo lib pilots not being common. Technically they didn't directly nerf it. If you run Fuel Tanks its just how it use to be.

EDIT: You are right about it draining more in hover mode. But you could still USE the reverse maneuver.

Liberators are utter ******** now. Its not even worth pulling a skyguard unless you have 3 other buddies pulling them as well because thats the only way your going to kill a liberator.

Not the only way......there are many other ways and why do you need to kill it? Honestly a threat of a skyguard is enough for me to be cautious and not farm the ground which I rarely do. And lock ons just make me steer away from a base

AND WHY THE **** ARE PEOPLE COMPLAINING ABOUT FLAK ARMOR?????? Ok so If I am right they didn't change the resistance to flak they only added tank shell resistance. So that means its giving the same resistance to Flak as it use to before the update (If I'm correct) so why haven't people complained about it sooner? And even IF I'm wrong about the flak which I might I still see TONS of libs running Auto Repair still which gives NO protection from flak.......so I don't understand. Is it because players who are jealous of the Lib because they can't fly just want to nerf it now? xD And please let me know if I'm wrong about the flak cuss I might be and sorry if I am.

TBH, i would say good to this. Universal weapons are NOT good for ANY CA game. period. It never works in a way that adds depth and complexity, it only serves to simplify, and dumb down all aspects of the game. Players, are players, and will always use the strongest tools, in as many ways as possible. You cannot change player behavior, or mandate a particular playstyle, you can only set up gameplay mechanics, in such a way that there is good asymmetrical balance, and force the battles to play out in their proper methods.

I say this in every thread that devolves into what you just posted. If SOE fixes this game, to require teamwork and THOUGHT, in order to win battles, I will HELP players find the door, if they simply want a mindless shooter.

The video shows is that you are good at killing pilots who fly in straight lines, those arent good ESF pilots.

There hasnt really changed much in Lib- ESF balance. The Tailgun got buffed, thats it. Also why should a ESF be more scarry in AA then a 3/3 Lib fitted for AA?

Enough, did the Lib recive some random ghost buffs i didnt hear anything about? The Tailgun angle got buffed, Dalton got nerfed and the Lib can take now more fire from MBT main cannons. Thats about it. I fly a Dalton with NAR, using no third gunner like most pilots. I got actually nerfed and you guys are crying how strong the Lib is know because you dont seem to have a clue what the patch did.

The ESF update btw. was a decent A2A buff for them. Improved fire supr., nnew very effective A2A gun. The Lib got a A2A Tailgun that is less effective then the already existing Walker and a new angle on the tailgun.

Let´s not do as if the Lib just got a 50% resistance buff against ESF.

The problem is not the vehicle, the problem is the game can't scale correctly with the number of player.

Every vehicle is OP in a 1-12 fight. But because vehicles are big, they can't scale as much as infantry.

The game naturally favor air zerg at low density, folowed by tank zerg. And at last, infantry (max) zerg. Tank zerg were the problem, and the base were made vehicle free thanks to some wall. Now that air zerg is the problem, the base are made air free thanks to some roofs.

The problem with air is that you have to shield completely from it, a partial cover will usually give a greater advantage to air.

Yet you guys continue to pester me in my reaver....

You didn't watch the entire video did you? A lot of those pilots were pretty good ones and would normally own me in an ESF. Do you know who MountaiinDrew is? I killed him and he is one of the better know pilots on mattherson. And are you ******** me? Half the time these pilots weren't flying in a straight line. Yes there were some noobs but even some noobs don't fly in straight lines. And have you EVER solo libbed? This is what I mean player's aren't playing both sides. They have no idea how competitive and difficult it is to be in the air game. And yes I do play infantry, and no Libs are not AS annoying as people are saying they are.

I will agree with that. The lib didn't get THAT many buffs. Only thing they basically buffed was the tail gun angle and resistance to tank shells. Like wtf are people complaining about.

Then skyguards damage to armor and infantry would need to be removed aswell, bursters damage to infantry nerfed, heavies would have to chose between launcher and lmg, medics would have no primary or C4, infiltrators would have no sidearm, tanks would not have access to AA top turrets, sunderers and galaxies would have no weaponry period the list goes on.

At the end of the day, planetside 2 was created in such a way that all classes and roles are very flexible, likely to cater to casual players who can't get a functioning group put together or who just wants to jump into a firefight without worrying about having the perfect squad composition of AA/AI/AT/A2G. Of course having a rigid rock-scissor-paper system grearly amplifies the problems of population imbalance as well.

PS2 is built around soft-counters and flexible setups. For good or bad, it's too late to change the system now.

Personally, I kinda like what we got now. Liberators may be able to overpower ESFs 1v1, but the lack mobility and can't chose their battles. A ESF in a bad spot can always afterburn away, a lib has to stand their ground or die as they flee.
Anyway, ESFs have no right to complain about libs, we're flying lightnings and they're flying MBTs and there is nothing that states we should be their hard-counter.

The liberator is not an AA platform. In its current condition, yes, there are AA setups, however, I do not believe that the Lib should be universal enough to accommodate this. That is why the ESF should be scarier. The ESF is an air superiority fighter. The lib, is the ground attack craft. These should NOT be interchangeable, for reasons that we see right now.

Also, the tailgun got a significant buff (for most weapons), as well as a significant buff to its area of engagement. TheBelly gun is now ALOT more user friendly for shooting down aircraft, as the belly gun has a mush wider area in which it can shoot, and the liberator performance characteristics have changed, making engaging enemy air much easier IMO. So yes, there was a small DPS change in a few changes, but balance is, has been, and always will be MUCH MUCH MUCH more than just shallow DPS stats.

I agree and disagree... The liberator can be a very strong AA platform for fighting other Liberators and ESF's... but if we nerfed the Liberators AA and dog fighting capabilities, then they will be more focused on ground targets and it would seriously diminish the Air vs Air game, which IMO right now is really improving.

More Liberators means more targets for other ESF and other liberators, which means Air vehicles now need to spend more time being aware of other Air craft and it often leads to large air battle between multi-liberators and ESF fighting each other completely ignoring the ground fight underneath them, at least until one side wins...