LA Nerf List...

Discussion in 'Light Assault' started by RogueComet, Apr 14, 2013.

  1. Marked4Death

    That's good to hear. I wasn't thrilled by the sound increase, but the explosion sound was just terrible. Terrible for the LA player to put up with it, terrible on the battlefield for other players as it sounds like an actual explosion. One of the starting sounds is kinda like a high pressure nozzle flaring then tightening up, that's my preferred JJ start sound if we have to have one.

    A lot of the main "nerfs" to LA are the indirect ones IMHO. It used to have a clear role on the battlefield, but that can now be filled by other classes.

    Things like other classes being able to climb towers & the increases to terrain climbing for ground classes eroded the LA's edge. SMG's for Infis mean and Infi is now often a better choice for getting up close in a tower etc. AV turrets for engis and new max weps made them a real AV threat, where it used to really be just heavies or LA's with C4.

    Those changes were good for other classes and probably good for overall game play. But the LA is clearly lacking right now for sure.
  2. Hagestol

    Wrong wrong wrong. Do I have to post my video again?
    Team play is based on class function and utility. A competent LA player will be better playing a different class for teamplay. That is quantifiable, it is objective.
    Why would a platoon ever need more than two infiltrators (one extra for safety) and two LA for gen cap and LA roof control? Tanks are fast and it is better to leave them to HA unless the drivers are baddies and we can't get sundies anymore.
    Your opinion is just that, subjective. And yours differs from mine, and they cancel each other out. However, the objective statements does not.
  3. bulletchaser666

    i personally don't think they should of nerfed C4.... its C4. i have to say though that i've played as a LA and apart from the jet pack which are really only usefull for walls and falls, i feel like the LA could use a tool or something, the LA doesn't really shine unless you've got a ton of certs into it, now that i think of it i think they should have a jet pack option that instead of the JJ regenerating fatser, they last longer... that would make LA's with this certed able to get far beyond any other class, which would make them more likable as there JJ are pretty limited.
  4. ArcKnight

  5. Ruar

    I'll address your replies in sequence so as not to create a quote pyramid.

    How exactly do you counter a LA with silent jetpack armed with a shotgun flying down from a level above and OHK someone with a point blank shot from a direction no other class could approach? That's pretty much the definition of almost impossible for other classes to counter. When a jetpack makes no noise, every objective requires you to move into close range, and a classes weapons are all designed to be the best at short range then it's pretty darn tough for anyone else to counter that combination. Mobility, stealth, lethality, and the equal armor (excluding HA shield of course). So they added some noise which is still being tweaked, that's balance not a nerf. You still have mobility, lethality and the same defense. The main difference is now your prey has the chance to at least hear you coming and respond instead of just being a sitting duck.

    Also, I would guess the reason LA isn't overplayed is because not everyone likes the playstyle. I've tried it a few times but I don't like flying and I'm not good trying to coordinate flying, shooting, or CQC combat. I prefer open field fights where HA is the better option.

    And I would be correct. The defense inside buildings is the ability to fly up and force the other person to deal with hit detection as the LA hovers around. I've seen LA go from the ground to the ceiling, just zoom, with no possibility of tracking the flight upwards and being able to reliably hit. LA is the only class that can do that which makes it better at 1v1 than any other class because of the mobility combined with hit detection issues. If my rounds actually hit when the LA flies up then I could see your point, but even with my reticule on the target and I'm tracking their movement the rounds just disappear with no hits tallied.

    I never said anything about one shotting a Sundy. When a sunderer is parked up against a rock or building to provide cover then a LA coming over that piece of terrain is nearly impossible for someone inside the Sunderer to hit. Heck, with the way hit detection works I'd say someone on the outside would have a hard time hitting the LA in time to stop two bricks of C4 from being deposited and blown up. The only counter I know is stop the LA before they get close to the cover, which is very often not feasible due to the necessity for the cover in the first place, or limits the defense to one dimension requiring even more people to provide defense for the sunderer.


    You can not claim your video is objective and quantifiable because it's merely your interpretation of the data. You have your own bias which influences your opinion. I think LA is the single best class for team play because I'm a huge believer in flanking operations and using off angle attack approaches to surprise the target. You need a mix of each class for a platoon and I would rank LA at the same level of importance as medics. Send the HA in the bottom floor while your LA come in from the top. Classic pincer that no other class can make happen.

    Nothing about your opinion is objective, but then again neither is mine. While I believe mine is more accurate due to my theories on combat tactics for a came like PS, I'm sure you think yours is just as accurate based on your experiences. In the end it's fine to push your opinion, but it's incredibly naive to think you are being objective about the subject.
  6. Hagestol

  7. Ruar

    Based on your final remark you probably won't listen but I'll give it a shot anyway.

    Your entire premise is based on "facts" which I'm assuming you are pulling from the spreadsheet I've seen floating around. The problem with your opinion is that the stats can be interpreted many ways and there are way to many variables to make a lot of the assumptions you are making.

    However you seem convinced you are right so be all means continue thinking you know what you are talking about and calling other people bad. It simply shows your ignorance.
  8. Hagestol

    Well, you seemed unable to leave the LA forum and stop with the nerf herding but I'll leave you with these words: I have multiple university semesters of math and statistics, but here I don't need them. There aren't many variables, there are three. You're grasping at straws.

    I can easily deduce that LAs never fit your criteria of being "OP" and you simply being a nerf herder and forum crier because of said stats. I do this by using the fotm : power rule that has been pretty much constant since daoc, and since SoE has been so kind to release said numbers I can accuratly tell you that you're wrong.

    But for the sake of even more simplicity - every "op" weapon in this game, every "op" class and vehicle was pulled more and scored higher. Why? Because they weren't balanced. If, and only if the LA class was ever "op" it would have been pulled more and scored higher and have killed more than the HA by many multipliers. But it never did. So you're wrong.

    Numbers are facts, you sound like a politician when you dispute that. Calling me ignorant for quoting numbers when your opinions are just that - opinions, is not only ignorant, it is blatantly wrong and you should look up math, statistics for dummies and logic before coming back here.
  9. Epic High Five

    If you can't kick *** with a jetpack and quick, close-mid range guns in a game that's 90% positioning and surprise then just give up.
  10. lilleAllan

    nerfs are not synonymous with "bad Things"
  11. Ruar

    Lol, I enjoy the attempt at trying to build up your argument, but your statistics have too many variables. Cert cost, SC cost, starter weapon, and a host of other variables corrupt the statistics for PS2. Yet you want everyone reading to believe your opinion because you think pointing at numbers taken out of context reinforces your belief.

    Didn't any of your statistic classes point out that the way a question was worded, or asking certain questions to specific groups, can greatly alter any group of "facts" to create pretty much any argument you want to make? If not then you might need to go back to class.

    The stats you keep referencing are full of holes and are a cool metric to look at but are in no way an indicator of OP, UP, or relative class capability. There are just too many variables to make the kind of argument you are trying to prop up.
  12. Hagestol

    Okay seriously. You've obviously never used statistics in a proper way. There are not many variables, the alert system alone nullfies your claim. Playing just a few days without killing a single guy will award you enough certs to get all the required basic skills required for LA play.

    Also what, out of context? Out of context means twisting numbers to mean something different than what they mean or presenting them as such. Presenting an increase from 190 to 195 on a scale of 180-200 instead of 1-200 is lying with statistics. Yes you can manipulate statistics to say almost whatever you want them to say.

    Presenting RAW numbers to scored/hour, pulled and kills is presenting the numbers untouched. You can't lie with raw numbers, but you can choose to present only the numbers that are advantageous to you. In this case all numbers are widely available and you've failed to find even one that supports your argument. Seriously, you have no idea what you're talking about now.

    The numbers are in context. We're worse than other classes, consistently, pre and post nerf. You're so wrong it hurts my brain, my statistics professor would probably rip your fingers out one by one :D

    I'll repeat my argument: If the FOTM : BALANCE rule of MMOs is in effect (and it is, look at podders, pre-nerf tank users, phoenix-users etc etc), then LA would be scoring higher, be used more and have a higher kill count.

    But they don't. So you're wrong. Do you have an actual counter argument and not just a "lol stats are wrong, you're lying with numbers to prove your point" - because I didn't touch the numbers. Hell, I didn't even post them, you read them yourself.
  13. Ruar

    The numbers in no way provide an indicator as to why LA is pulled differently compared to other classes. The raw number or users vs class vs time played doesn't provide context as to why the different classes are pulled.

    You are making the assumption that class being pulled more = higher relative power based on your additional assumption that FOTM influences an unknown portion of the population to migrate to believed to be OP classes.

    You can't prove why people choose to play LA or choose to play something else. Variable

    You can't prove how much of the population is influenced by FOTM and how much plays the class they like regardless. Variable

    How many times is LA pulled for a specific situation with a high kill count and then something else picked for different situation? Variable

    How many bases/towers/objectives are easier to assault with a jetpack compared to an infiltrator and influence class choice? Variable

    As I stated the several times already, your belief that the numbers you keep pointing at are reliable is a misguided notion. Too many variables you can't account for and too many assumptions on your part.

    But even though you've had all that schooling you can't seem to grasp the immense number of items that go into each fight thus changing the context in which the data can be interpreted. Just pointing at score, kills, or times played isn't enough because there are too many factors influencing why a player chooses which class and weapons he uses. You know, those variable things I keep trying to get you to think about.

    Anyway, keep posting, this has become a waste of my time. You seem convinced you know what you are talking about, enjoy your delusion.
  14. Evil Monkey

    The OP made me o_O

    C4 despawning when you spawn = was an exploit

    Death field around spawn room = whaaaaaat? you can't spawn camp as effectively!? :eek:

    PA shotgun is a NERF to LA? = wtf :eek: - they're the class who abuse utilize them most!

    Pretty much everything else was a nerf to EVERYONE not just LA.
  15. simmi1717

    For all the morons saying that hey it's a nerf to all class obviously don't play LA class. Those ******* don't realize that LA class is the one that made the best use of C4s. We used them most effectively to their fullest extent. Also the other nerfs he said affect all classes hit LA the HARDEST. It's not ****** rocket science ****heads! I'm shocked to see how easy it is to play HA and get great xp/hour with it. AV locks ons. AA lock ons. OP shield that wins all 1v1 fight if you know how to use it. I played HA for a while just for the heck of it and was doing as good as my LA from the very start. Just buy locks ons and put some certs into forward grips and you are good to go. It takes a lot more skill and creativity to play as a good LA, but the ******* cry nerf all the time cz they dont' look straight or slightly up. They probably have their crosshair looking at the floor while they are walking like zombie noobs with no reflexes. They can't follow the direction the fire is coming from to see where an LA is perched. Even if some ******* do realize where an LA is perched they try to shoot him down, but die without spotting the LA so the LA is able to get 2 more kills before moving from that place.

    When an LA is shooting at me, I kid you not I instantly know where he is perched. Maybe it's because I play LA a lot. I can kill most LA or spot them all before I die so someone else finishes the job. Idiots choose to ignore that we are an underplayed class with low xp/hour and keep crying nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf !.
  16. simmi1717

    If I play LA a lot and get a certain xp/hour and then I start to play HA for a while and start doing way better with it than LA in terms of xp/hour, then I don't need to look at the statistics to know that LA class is harder to play than HA class and harder to get xp/hour with it. It doesn't need anymore nerfs on it. And when that experience is the same for all LA players, then obviously there is something wrong here. I don't play HA even though I could do way better in terms of xp/hour because I love playing LA. This game is the LA class for me and that's why I play. The creativity side of LA is what entices me.
  17. Van Dax

    To those saying light assault has no team abilities has never tangled with [DIG] hunters squad.
    seriously those guys are crazy-we give em a target and they give em~5 bricks of c4.
  18. Charlychop

    sorry, but i can do the same thing with a SMG, carbine, shotgun even with pistol and knife. being inside a tower, building or objective does not mean you can just stop and snipe whenever you want or simply assume you're 'safe'. if you're in a tower you KNOW lights are coming one way or another, there are ways to deal with it and some severe counters. the fact that you don't want to dedicate yourself to hunting them doesn't mean its not counter able. Ive spent countless hours defending towers and buildings from lights and infils, and i love hunting them. easy targets if you know what you're doing. hell, double APmine or the classic AP/AT trap works wonders if you place em on the common spots.

    if you know you re facing a LA shouldn't you expect him to do some weird ****? just because its CQC doesn't mean you have to get into a knife range fight. Most LA will simple jump up, engage the jet pack a little time then drop down or just go straight up and in the same direction attempting to make a circle around you while flying. i hardly see that as 'hard to predict' and even then, LA loose 1v1 if they dont get the jump on you.

    and why was that LA able to get into an elevated position to begin with? where were your LA trying to defend? where were your engis looking constantly for enemies? where are your infils dropping darts to see if the hill is clear? where is your Overall sundy Defense??? don't blame LAs for exploiting the stupidity of your team. my Outfit constantly asks for people to defend the sundies, and as a LA i usually go and defend from the places i would attack the sundy from. it takes well over 4 seconds to drop 2 blocks of c4 and then press the button.....4 times as much needed to kill an LA, specially if you had any defense.

    there is no such thing as objectivity on forums.
  19. Charlychop

    i certainly consider me killing snipers entrenched on the towers or HA dropping hell on my allies as teamwork. i still remember when i went into tech plant to the west of the southeast WG and we were assaulting the tower outpost. i killed well over 40 snipers as an LA... can you blame me for exploiting the stupidity of those dudes? how hard was it to drop mines if there were so many infils around? where were the recon darts? the medics certainly knew ppl were dying left and right... where were they?
  20. RogueComet

    Added the nerf to the flash radius on flash grenades for GU09. Really sad they did this since I never heard a single person complain about it before the nerf. They weren't excessively used either so it really makes you wonder, "WHY?"

    *sigh* Sure does seem like there is a nerf which effects LA in every single game update doesn't it?