Is the Pulsar LSW still the all rounder for Vanu?

Discussion in 'Heavy Assault' started by lolmanlee, Jan 18, 2013.

  1. lolmanlee

    Levelcap, and a lot of other PL2 players seem to love this gun.
    I own it but not sure if its better than the Orion.
    Am I just a *******? :D
  2. MartianDiscoFish

    The Orion gives up alot for a ever so slightly faster TTK (like 0.12s difference)
    Pulsar LSW has better recoil, better CoF, larger mag size, shorter long reload and more ammunition.

    The Pulsar is just better in my opinion.
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  3. TheEvilBlight

    Debating if the all-rounder is SVA-88 or the LSW. The SVA-88 has compensator, advanced laser (or was it foregrip?) and foregrip. LSW doesn't, and has vanilla laser and foregrip. That either means you can't put as much into it or that the gun is fine as it is out of the box.
  4. Syranorn

    no adv foregrip and no adv laser on the SVA. SVA is a LSW w/ compensator and HV ammo. These weapons are so close most of the time I don't know which one I'm using.
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  5. Eyeklops

    The Orion is best suited for situations where you're aggressively pushing forward in close quarters and need excellent short range accuracy from the hip for unexpected encounters. It's primary advantages are a faster strafe speed while down sights, noticeably higher ROF, very fast "mid mag" reload, and tighter COF from the hip during non-sprinting movement. The weapon is hindered by a random left/right recoil pattern that can be difficult to manually compensate for during "down sights" medium range engagements. The small 50 round mag and a fairly long "empty" reload time of 4.6 seconds makes it a dangerous weapon for players who frequently lose awareness of the ammo count and run the mag dry.

    The Pulsar LSW dominates for stationary short/medium range suppression and point defense. When compared to the Orion, the LSW's smaller, up/right recoil, is easier to manually compensate for during ADS engagements. The LSW's 4 second "empty" reload time is shorter than the Orion's (4.6s), and actually very close to other VS LMG's "mid mag" reload time. At 3.2 seconds, the "mid mag" reload time is faster than any other VS LMG except the Orion (2.8s). A 75 round mag combined with a relatively fast "empty" reload time significantly reduces the penalty for running the magazine dry allowing for sustained burst fire all the way to the last bullet.

    The SVA-88 sits somewhere in between the Orion and LSW in regards to stats. The 88 is the only LMG other than the Orion to have an increased strafe speed while ADS. However, the ADS recoil pattern is randomized left/right like the Orion, but worse. A 4.8 second "empty" reload time punishes sloppy players like the Orion, but worse. Firing from the hip is not as accurate as the Orion on longer bursts, but the saving grace is faster recoil recovery. This gives the 88 good hip-fire accuracy so long as the bursts are kept short.
  6. UnDeaD_CyBorG

    If you're interested, here are the stats.
    The Orion has the fastest Killspeed of all LMGs among all factions, but sorely lacks upgrades and magazine size. Good movement thanks to improved ADS speed and decent hipfire accuracy.
    The LSW shoots slower, but has less and more easily controlled recoil, + a larger magazine.
    The SVA-88 is somewhat betwen those two; an Orion with lower firerate, but higher Projectile speed. It has the potential of a great long range weapon thanks to HV ammo and Compensator.
    If you don't might a yet again slightly reduced firerate and a second longer reload, the Polaris might be a valid alternative to the Pulsar, regaining the Orions good hipfire and movement accuracy while otherwise sharing stats with the Pulsar. Long reload, 100 round mag, option of an Adv. Laser.
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  7. TheUprising

    VS LMG's tend to be good in multiple fronts, starkly contrasting NC's arsenal. Also, the SVA and and Polaris are probably more well rounded weapons.

    Like the only reason you would get the Pulsar over the Polaris is if you really hate hipfiring, plan to put a forward grip on your gun, in which case you will enjoy the 50 extra RoF over the Polaris in all ranges. It seems like a more specialized weapon than the Polaris which is good @ medium to long range AND can have a double laser attachment. Did I mention that you lose 25 ammo per magazine using the Pulsar over the Polaris?
  8. Cassidia

    I've read statements like this several times now, and just cant understand how anyone would come to this conclusion.
    The description "random left/right recoil pattern" for the Orion is extremely misleading here. EVERY gun has a random horizontal pattern. Wich obviously cant be compensated. Some guns, like the LSW, also have a underlying continous sidewards movement. So actually for most players the recoil compensation is much harder on the LSW since you have to compensate both a horizontal and a vertical movement. On the Orion its just a pull down on the mouse and you're done with it.

    What actually would be harder to compensate would be a gun that had a continous sideward recoil like the LSW but randomly the the left or right. Not a single gun in PS2 shows that behaviour.
  9. Eyeklops

    Don't confuse the recoil pattern with the random spread induced by COF. Yes, just about every gun has a small amount of left/right hit variation due to COF. They also have up/down variation, again, due to COF. But those are not the same as left/right recoil.

    Random left/right recoil cannot be compensated for on high ROF weapons. For the Orion, the only part of the recoil that can be reliably compensated for at the mouse is the vertical part. Compensating for vertical recoil on the LSW is the same as the Orion, we move the mouse down, however, we also know that the LSW has a pull to the right, so we adjust our pull angle to reduce that as well. Not hard, just requires time in learning the pattern and building the muscle memory.
  10. Cassidia

    Well, i mixed it up because its actually mixed up in the game quite often. Just to make myself clear: shots will variate from where you aim in a circular pattern. Thats the COF. The circle also gets larger the longer you hold the trigger. The circle also moves slightly upwards over time for all guns. Thats the recoil. For some guns the circle also moves slowly to some side. These are the guns that have a sideward recoil.
    But, as i said, there are no guns that will have the circle move sometimes to one side and sometimes to the other. So in that definition, the game has no guns with random left/right recoil pattern. The only horizontal shot deviation the Orion has comes from COF.
    I do agree that the sidewards recoil CAN be compensated, but for casual or less experienced players or those that like to switch weapons often its harder to do since you have to remember both how much to pull AND in wich direction. Directly downwards is something most players can do more easily.

    Just saying: if do guns have the same amount of recoil and same cof but one is straight up and one sidewards pattern, than the straight up one is just as accurate, only easier to handle. So having a sidewards pattern is a disadvantage.
  11. Lucidius134

    Flare is the all rounder.

    It has every attachment availible to it and all 3 fire modes.

    No other LMG has the above and it's that's the determining trait to th other SF all round LMG's.
  12. Eyeklops

  13. Lucidius134

    Why link to vague discussion when you can link him to:

    Some wepaons dont have different types of side recoil.
  14. Eyeklops

    Because I am pretty sure he is aware of that document. And...
    Understanding what the foregrip does, and then viewing the results of my own in-game recoil patterns is what helped me figure it all out. That thread I linked has screen shot examples that show how the recoil pattern changes when the fore-grip is attached. I was just trying to feed him some information and hope it eventually "clicked."
  15. Lucidius134

    Ah I read the first 2 posts and it looked like another "I think this is the case *no evidence*" thread. My bad.
  16. Cassidia

    Short answer: i might be wrong, but its very unlikely.

    I've studied the thread suggested by you, and some of the post there can simply be proven wrong by just spending a few minutes in the warp gate spawn area.
    Rigsta claims, that with a "balanced recoil" weapon in single shot modus the sight would settle in a different spot after every shot. I've tested that with my flare and a 3.4 scope and its simply not the case. With that kind of magnification there was absolutely no difference visible concerning the spot where my sight settled.
    It his however true that the sight will jump to on or the other side randomly before settling down again. I wouldn't want start a discussion if we should call that recoil or cof ;).
    To compare this behavior with a "sidewards recoil" weapon i switched to my LA with the solstice (i dont own a sidewards recoil lmg). It is true also, that the sight of the solstice will always jump to the right before settling down. But more importantly, it wont always jump the same amount.

    So what do we get when we compare both weapons in full auto mode?
    The flare's sight is winding its way up on a snakelike trail when firing full auto and not compensating recoil. The soltice sight will also follow a snakelike trail, just slightly rotated to the right. It will NOT follow a straight line to the upper right.
    All you do when compensating for "sidewards recoil" is pulling that snakelike pattern upright (and of course negating the upward movement). You will still get the same left and right jumping as any "balanced recoil" weapon.

    P.S. totally different topic, but no matter if we call that kind of jumping recoil or cof, it seems to be reduced by the forward grip.
  17. lolmanlee

    I think ill stick with the lsw.
    Thanks guys!
  18. Eyeklops

    Reading comprehension man, it escapes you. Rigsta did not say "the sight would settle in a different spot after every shot."

    Rigsta Quote
    "To test this, switch the gun to single-fire mode (B by default), aim down sights at something distinctive and fire one shot at a time, allowing the sight to settle back down after each shot. You'll see it ends up in a different place with almost every shot, before settling back down to your original aiming point. That's what makes the forward grip a good investment for guns like this."
    End Quote

    The fact that you observed, and then recalled this mechanic, yet it still hasn't "clicked" with you is actually humorous. +1 to a good laugh.

    No discussion needed. You described recoil, not COF. Here is a guideline:
    1. Recoil makes the sight jump around on each shot.
    2. COF makes the bullet not go where the gun sight is aimed.
  19. Cassidia

    Well, if you read it very carefully you'll notice the that this sentence can actually be understood in two different ways. None of wich exactly proves your point.
    The recoil pattern is exactly the same for every type of weapon, just rotated sidewards for some. Wich means if you do a perfect recoil compensation, the resulting hit pattern is exactly the same for "balanced recoil" and "sidwards recoil".
    The random left/right jumping that you claim cant be compensated for balanced recoil weapons is there on sidewards recoil weapons as well.
    I dont like to make to much difference between COF and recoil because in burst and full auto it makes no difference if your shot misses because your sight jumps or because it doesn't goes where youre sight is pointing. The only thing you actually can compensate is the average drift, wich may either go straight up or slightly to one side. Wich is exactly what i've been saying since my first post.

    On a sidenote, i do not like your tone. You may be surprised, but your opinion is not the only one in the universe. Its not like mankind will be blessed when they finally come to see everything like you do. And you're far away from bringing lots of gut arguments.
  20. ReaperLSW

    I don't know what I'm reading here. My reading comprehension must not be up to par because I came out with this:

    The recoil for every weapon is the same, but different.
    CoF and recoil are different, but the same.
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