Is the Lightning Balanced?

yes and no

its got as good as a specialized 2/2 empire tank, but its not so godawful it's unusable. if youre alone it will do okay, especially against infantry

My favourite vehicle by far

Vipers work on anything once you get used to the drop and recoil, AP works on tanks (especially in the back) and for sniping

All the guns have their uses

Combat chassis is where it's at, get that reverse speed going, and combine with front armour.

I think the issue is that there's not enough of a speed/mobility gap between the Harasser and the MBT that the Lightning fits into.

As the game currently is:

Top Speed, Level Ground, Stock
Harasser- 95km/h, 125km/h Turbo
Lightning- 70km/h
Prowler- 60km/h

So the difference between the Lightning and the Prowler is really only 10km/h... not quite as impressive. Even the ungainly Sunderer can reach 70km/h, so 70km/h isn't exactly "fast".

The Harasser, on the other hand, is fairly fast. From a practical standpoint, a Harasser can get out of the "danger zone" of a Lightning or MBT fairly quickly (not to mention that it has Turbo which lets it go twice as fast as a MBT).

But the Lightning's 10km/h advantage on the MBT isn't really enough that the Lightning has a significant chance of escape. Sure in perfect terrain it might happen, but usually the MBT can keep up long enough to lay down fire.

And escaping from a rampaging transport Sunderer? Probably not going to easily happen either.

That's why speed and agility alone are fairly poor traits for a Lightning. It's just not that much better than a MBT or even halfway to a Harasser.

Not to mention that in order to take advantage of that speed advantage you have to expose your *** to the pursuer. At the very least prowlers can literally instagib a lightning when all 3 shots land (2 mains + secondary tube). On the other hand backing with the front armor exposed is just prolonging the inevitable.

Another problem is that the short distances between bases often means AV manas, lancers, maxes and all kinds of **** that is almost impossible to root out and suppresses the **** out of tanks, while harassers are not as affected. On top of that you have things like that ridiculous parking lot on the hill to the east of Indar Ex used to stop every other attempt to push between these 2 bases in its tracks, brutal against tanks in a 300m radius, not so much against much more agile and upredictable harassers.
You are not going to skirmish for **** if you are forced to hug cover in your lightning while harassers are pretty much free to roam.

Indeed there is not much place for lightnings between MBTs and harassers and that's even before you consider the bang for the buck.

When I first started using the (AP) Lightning I was surprised how...incapable infantry were when it came to driving me away from their Sunderers. I could literally drift my tank in a circle around a deployed Sunderer while shooting it and mowing infantry down with my front bumper with absolute impunity. And despite its low projectile velocity (which amusingly is the same as the Magrider's!) I find it makes for a great long-distance precision-bombardment tank. Its low profile is amazing and in theory it'd be good for parking in ditches or behind small ridges, however the turret is so awkward to use when aiming to either side that it isn't really practical.

It's great at darting about, picking off opportunity targets left and right and denying the enemy flank attacks. You can't really 1v1 anything with it without baiting the enemy into some tank mines, unless you have some godly positioning.

The one piece of advice I have regarding the Lightning is always navigate rough terrain in first person. If you go in third, you will fall victim to improbable barrel physics and explode violently.

Lightning was very well balanced, about a year ago. Harrassers have seen several favourable updates since then and now with the new and improved top guns for harrassers and MBTs they have been further disadvantaged by power creep from MBTs and harrassers.

I think a small balance pass on the lightning would be reasonable. Maybe reduced costs or increased speed/agility or more health and/or improved projectile speed would give them a boost to keep them competitive.

I use it more as an artillery platform, stay somewhere relatively safe, usually with some distance, and try to bombard troops where they think they are safe from the main incoming fire.

My NC Lightning HEAT was my very first auraxium.. so, eh, no, no problems with the Lightning..
just pick your battles/engagements accordingly.. You are NOT a big MBT.. you drive a glass cannon
with mostly low DPS..
roll with other tanks, shoot at what they are shooting at.. help them.. don't play lone wolf
Much more fun, more kills, more achievements.. it works fine.

Nanite pricing in PS2 is just weird. I mean in what world would an ESF (a jet fighter) be less expensive than an MBT?

AV-8B Harrier II Plus (1993 model)



Cost (2015 Dollars): $35.9 million

M1A2 (1992 model)



Cost (2015 Dollars): $8.9 million

If an MBT would cost 450 nanites to pull, proportionally an ESF would take 1,815 nanites.
If an ESF would cost 350 nanites to pull, then an MBT should cost no more than 87 nanites.

So what's a reasonable price for the Lightning?

Well the M1128 (not strictly a light tank but close) costs about $5.8 million 2015 dollars per unit. It's a bit more modern than the above two units, but whatever.

If an MBT would cost 450 nanites to pull, a Lightning should cost 293 nanites.
If an ESF would cost 350 nanites to pull, then a Lightning would take 57 nanites.

Lightnings (and really most vehicles in PS2) should have another examination about cost.

And a last little note...
Javelin ATGM launchers cost about $108,000 each, and each missile package is another $230,000. So for the price of outfitting 5 HAs with 1 launcher and 4 rockets each, you could pretty much buy a Lightning. A little more and you could get an MBT!

Maybe there is a problem with the gap between tanks and top speed -- however, in my post I didn't mention speed. I mentioned maneuverability. The lightning is almost as maneuverable as a harasser. It has significantly better accel than MBTs (on par with the harasser), significantly better braking, and significantly better turning. Yeah, a lightning isn't that great at running away from a fight it starts close to -- however, it is pretty good at dodging (again -- in the hands of a skilled driver) and can stay in a field of armor drawing shots from enemy MBTs for a surprising bit. Gives their own MBTs time to hit the enemy MBTs.

So lightnings aren't really supposed to be as good at running away like harassers -- I think they are designed to stay in the fight and dodge to live. They have a little extra HP and some better resistances plus being 1/1 to compensate for lack of the ability to run away.

I think they were designed with that play style in mind. It's also why a good skyguard driver will never get hit by more than 1 Dalton round from a Lib. Once they get hit once -- all they have to do is look up, and use their agility to avoid further incoming shots.

MBTs don't really have that option -- once they are going fast -- they don't stop going fast very fast. lolz I made a funny.

Sorry for digressing -- but ya: I think that is what DBG had in mind for lightnings (especially given how LOW their profiles are!).

Did you seriously compare a 240kph ESF Helicopter-like VTOL to a 1080kph Fighter Jet? Granted the Harrier can take off and land vertically but it has nowhere near the agility. It still relies on fast strafing and striking runs to delivery its payload. We really do not need to have this discussion again

And you can't compare nanites to dollars. Nanites are based around game mechanics, not R&D, manhours, or economic factors.

Just like ColonelChingles said, lightnings should be able to be air dropped onto places that mbts couldn't get to, making the lighting even more versatile. Bases could have a zone around them just like the sunderers no deploy zone to keep people from dropping lightnings on landing pads and whatnot.

Hey, not like my MBT cannon is effective out to 4,000 or 8,000m either... but I don't hear you complaining about that.

Let's not sweat the small details. The closest thing we have to the ESF is a VTOL fighter-bomber.

But the game mechanic here is scarcity. And aircraft should be more scarce than tanks. As it is we have more ESFs flying around than there are Lightnings!

It's a one man vehicle, what do you expect from it? Teamwork's supposed to be rewarded, get a buddy and you'll fight those 2 man vehicles on a lot more even ground. That buddy doesn't have to be another Lightning either, if resources are a concern. A Fury Flash will help chase off any Harassers you see, a MANA AV turret will even the odds against MBTs.

It's not a vehicle for face tanking the opposition, but that's fine. It's still a viable and very enjoyable vehicle.

I have been complaining about the short range of engagement for a while now. I'd love for us to be able to engage out as far as we can see.. even warpgate to warpgate if there is LOS.

I don't think ESF's are more common. They would be if they were more like other vehicles with their learning curve.

In terms of average hours played per day, they are in fact more common than Lightnings.

Hours Per Day
ESF- 2,796.9
Lightning- 2,422.7

It is more difficult to directly compare uniques because the ESFs have two weapons versus the Lightning's single weapon.

Perhaps the learning curve of the ESF isn't as high as it's made out to be... it certainly is a more popular vehicle than the Lightning.

Anchor on a Skyguard wouldn't be a great idea....... or at least not only on TR Skyguards.

Lightning is a great vehicle to cert into. Just because you will always have a solid vehicle option no matter what fight you are in.
One can cert into infantry all day, but there is inevitably going to be a vehicle battle,
and if you have a certed Lightning readily available, you are set for anything.

One of the best things about it is that you dont need a tech plant or anything. You can pull it from any base, and its cheap.
Its also small and nimble, so you wont get hit as easily if you use cover and stay moving.
It can also be outfitted for anything. AA, AV or AI. Fully certed AP reload works surprisingly well.

There is only one thing i dont really like about it.
I have always been using the rival chassis and got to borrow a racer lightning recently. And im really glad i certed rival.
The Lightning doesent have any turning at all, and its already quite fast without racer.
Racer seems like overkill and makes it vulnerable in situations where you want to take advantage of the Lightning's small frame (like doing quick turns out/into cover)
so i would suggest certing rival. Though thats just my opinion.

Its a very balanced tank. Its more versatile than any of the other vehicles in the game because of its cheap cost, can engage all targets and you can pull it from any base.
It also prevents you from getting bored in vehicle stalemates.
I would suggest everyone cert into the Lightning.

oh for F*CKS SAKE SHUT THE HELL UP ON WEAPON STATS PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD!

So, seems that currently the Lightning is called "balanced" only by those using it in solo for AI or for exceptionally rare cases as AV if you are lucky enough to snipe enemy vehicles from safe distance.
Yet, as soon as you are engaged by an enemy vehicle, it suddendly becomes the worst thing possible due to it's low Health Pool, low damage and horrible speed which anyway requires to expose the back to take use of (and get killed for sure).

Seriusly, how can you guys say "it's balanced" when it can be used only if you are not being attacked back? It's like saying the spitfire is perfect but it needs to be invisible and indestructible


I remain of the idea it either needs a buff to be more competitive in its role of light-tank (and for that superior to an Harasser/Sunderer at least) or either have it's Nanite cost reduce to better fit the current role (350 for it is a joke when an harasser can win it for half the price. And transport Maxes and passengers. And generally fit multiple roles as AI-AV-AA at the same time unlike the lightning)

Oh look, a moron who didn't even read the post yet felt the need to write something completely unrelated and useless. Are you proud of yourself?