If an infiltrator chases an enemy, they die. Nobody runs from an infiltrator in close range. People take cover from snipers, not stalkers. Also, Light Assault's Drifter Jets allow them to surf along the ground, much faster than sprinting, even with AP. What is a jump cooldown? You want to put a timer on jumping?
The only buff stalkers need is the ability not to be detected by motion spotters, and perhaps some small speed bonus when wielding a knife (people run away when they hear a ripper). The latter one should be applied to every class ofc. Other than that, it's no, the infiltrator is balanced right now.
Regarding Evasiveness: The new knife mechanics allow players to begin attacking with knife process from a sprinting state. What I mean by that: In the past when you clicked the key you had a delay while the client would drop you down into a walk FIRST, and then you would begin the swing animation. Developers said "Screw that noise, lets make knifing more responsive so the attack happens when the player hits the key! <3 YAY <3 FINALLY <3 GOODJOB <3 You will not remain at sprinting speed during the stabbing attempt (animation), but that moment of "walking" during the animation is so incredibly short it doesn't negatively influence the outcome of the attack in majority of cases (I question this aspect of the buffs) however I think it was done for technical reasons (Netcode). Basically: Nerfing jumping by adding delays to subsequent jumping attempts not the answer. It doesn't solve any issues regarding evasiveness, or prevent the attacks from happening while the enemy is in a mobile state what so ever. Frankly why should an enemy who is hugging their target not be able to stab them while sprinting? Its not like the enemy is 5 meters away here. Because all players can begin the attacking sequence directly from sprint, the benefits from Jump + Aerial Knifing have been decreased substantially. In the past a jump into the air + stabbing reduced slowing down at the BEGINNING of the attack, and had the potential to reduce the recovery time at the END. Recovery time at the END was only significantly faster if the stabbing attack happened at the apex of the jump, and not towards the landing. (Which is incredibly hard to do consistently for the record) With the changes to knives there is very little benefit to jump + knife, and it only really shines when your trying to move from enemy to enemy and only if the attacker can nail the appropriate timing. Why did we go through the trouble of Jump + Knifing in the past? -Simply because detection was so bad (for multiple reasons) it was the only way to be sure you could snag a kill. This is no longer the case because of the melee revamp. The developers litterally took the mechanics which made knifing viable, and standardized them. Now anyone regardless of their ability to jump + knife attack can reliably take on enemy targets provided they are at the ideal range to do so and are accurate. Aerial jump knifing is no longer necessary, but can still be helpful if moving on uneven ground provided you get the timing right. If a new player was asking how important it is to learn jump + knifing today? I would rate it very low because sprint + knife attacks are nearly identical in terms of results, and normal sprint + knife attacks are more precise since the attacker can change direction and tail the target without having to commit to a direction of travel while they are jumping. You see, jumping mid air knifing had more downsides, and was more balanced because you were committed to going in that direction. The attacker could not suddenly change their minds. (This is why I question the shorter animations. Anyway rambling I will get back on point.) A side effect of the ability to attack directly from sprint greatly buffs the effectiveness of Pump. Only increasing a delay PRIOR to an attack, or increasing animations time (when we are walking) would lead to significant changes to evasiveness. Which obviously the developers won't do because the problem with delays and netcode player tracking were making knives so bloody unreliable. Longer recovery time AFTER a knife swing only reduces knives effectiveness on multiple targets, and adds a penalty to missing, but offers nothing on a case by case attacking basis. Think of the delay to being able to sprint again (or in the misguided logic of jumping) like a reloading mechanic. It ups the risk on multiple targets and makes escapes more difficult. Again which SOLVES NOTHING for evasiveness during the attacking process. The ability to attack directly from sprint, and shorter stabbing animation time is directly responsible for impacting a players ability to dodge/ escape a swing. Again nerfing jumping is just faulty logic because the issue boils down to the removal of the DELAY / and shorter animations. Reduction of the recovery time to begin sprinting again simply is a quality of life feature and helps to distinguish the different types of knives. Adding perks to some and drawbacks to others like the power knives. I wrote a pretty tongue and cheek response regarding the removal of delays prior to an attack and what could possibly happen if they took things too far. The Reddit Thread in question was asking for the ability to stab and CONTINUE sprinting / while having NO DELAY. Obviously that is a pretty unbalanced idea and I pointed out the faulty logic there too. What we have now is a nice mix of risk versus reward, and considering what Reddit wanted, the developers didn't overbuff. Thankfully you still need to proceed through the stabbing animation (which is still walking speed) and there is still a recovery time between being able to sprint again. This allows victim to get some distance if the attack fails. (Which prevents blatant power knife abuse) The recovery time is important since, like reloading it punishes missing and is much longer on the power knife. The potential for abuse from knife attacks are incredibly minimal due to how short the range still is. Coupled with wielded knives needing to be so precisely on target I strongly doubt anything will be nerfed or adjusted soon. Even with the Pump chasing down moving enemies doesn't often work out very well. You will get seen and destroyed by other players watching. Pump is more viable now with power knives, not only for rare moments when your tailing a kill, but also because it helps to reduce the longterm downsides from having slower sprint recovery time. Once the player does start sprinting again it helps to make up for that negative consequence. Allowing to make up the difference in distance covered during an escape. Its not a perk that immediately removes the consequence, but over time its worth mentioning since the sprint speed will eventually outweigh the drawback allowing the pump user to catch up to where they would have been otherwise if there was some kind of imaginary escape race happening. (Which is part of the reason I would recommend "considering" running the pump with power knives now - simply because this perk helps after each and every knife swing.) We don't often consider the downsides to being slow after an attack or how it affects our movement while bailing.
Regarding Flat Movement Speed Perks and OP specifically: Being faster with every single weapon / knife / loadout combination without having to trade for anything seems like a missed opportunity for diversity in our loadouts. I understand your logic in that we as infiltrators are lighter, have less shields. However we do have access to the pump already as a suit option. As seen above the meta for the AP and power knives have been improved making them more interesting choice. I think its fine as it stands. You do have the option to run the AP with any loadout if you wanted to use it. I don't think you should be able to stack AP in addition to another perk though. Example if I want to power knife, I should be seriously considering nanoweave, or AP ect. Each suit slot has their strong points now. PS: Motion spotter changes are coming soon. Tighter radius, and instead of "dildar" its a long lasting "dildart" for your allies. You will still see precise information within the smaller radius, but your allies will only see dots at intervals (similar to RDD). Max Units : Are being changed to behave like vehicles and auto spot themselves at a certain distance for us to see. RIP stealth maxes but this effectively means we can choose to run either darts or motion spotter in squads since being able to identify max from motion spotter will no longer be a requirement.
? ? It's wise to back away from a power-knife or decloak noise so you have enough time to fire primary/secondary before in range of being oneshotted while aiming toward the Infil. That doesn't really matter if the Infil's always faster. They're sprinting toward a target that most likely isn't facing the opposite direction unless they have audio off, which dooms them from the start. Also, lag. No one's getting rid of that. The power knife is difficult enough to avoid already, it's balanced with no need to push it more. Increased speed with no strings attached harms both the Infil's skill and the prudence of using audio against them. Drifter is what, up to 20% faster than unmodded sprint? Estimating at warpgate. Don't forget that it's also a constant jetpack noise in stereo. On topic, OP compares the Infil's speed to the class that has the oh-so-tanky-win-button overshield. Which does something oh-so-surprisingly relevant when used. Lowering movement speed. I didn't make that up, surprised you didn't know about it. Jumping 2+ times lowers your movement speed for several seconds. Go ahead and test it now on live. To clarify my suggestion, lift that restriction from Infil to give them the suggested movement boost indirectly, more oriented toward crossing non-flat terrain like the Magrider. All sorts of indoor and outdoor obstacles become more valuable. That's a just barely reasonable-enough buff, pushing it with no downsides. Now if you reeeeaally insist on a straight movement boost being necessary, then I suggest at least merging it with Adrenaline Pump. Cost that slot, simply increase the upgrade's effect.
I know this isn't directed at me but... Just going to step in here and explain. Normally we don't JUMP + Knife and follow up with additional Jump + knife attempts. They are usually spaced out considerably. Part of that has to do with the requirement to tap the sprint key again on landing. Its just uncomfortable during a jump + knife attempt to smash that many keys (back to back) while tracking your enemy, planing escapes, ect. Mentally you are focused on engaging sprint at the soonest possible moment, and picking a new target or deciding to leave. Not fox jumping from person to person. You only need a few steps to counter the initial jumping penalties which would easily be achieved during the landing, thinking, and sprint mashing process. By the time you line up the next target the negative penalties have usually subsided. At least that is how it felt for me in the past. I am very aware of jumping penalties and movement mechanics. However the mental process might explain why someone wouldn't feel jumping penalties were an issue, simply because the targets were spaced out between their actions.
I don't think infiltrators need a buff to their base movement speed. Infiltrators have cloaks, that more than outweighs -100 shields. Also, they have adrenaline pump (which maybe could be buffed a little bit) which is what you should use for extra speed.
No idea about that jump knifing thing, I was only talking about sprint+knifing. The jump suggestion is completely separate, only meaning to offer an alternative mobility buff.
Sprinting makes cloaks very visible, everyone knows that. And radar is almost always present, and the enemy will notice unless they have their UI turned off, which dooms them from the start. If an infiltrator gets the jump on anyone, it doesn't really matter if they have a power-knife or not, sneak-attacks win. If the enemy is aware of an infiltrator in the vicinity, they hunt them down. Because it's unwise to hide from a hidden enemy. 20% is a lot more than what the OP suggested. Don't forget that footsteps make sound as well. If you're gonna nitpick audio. Heavies can still attack while using the overshield. Cloaking disables all actions besides movement and adjusting weapons. I knew about that, I didn't think it was an actual cooldown, I assumed it was implemented to prevent wall-climbing. Nothing to do with jump-knifing (Which I've honestly never heard of until now). Removing the "cooldown" isn't a barely reasonable buff, it would be gamebreaking. It would allow scaling of nearly vertical surfaces. Besides trees or walls, there isn't any terrain or obstacles that require constant jumping anyways. Only if it increases crouch and walking speed.
1: Your character model sure as hell changes. If same person still, perhaps different armors give different augments for carrying their weapons and whatnot. Even then, a loaded SMG still has a bit of weight to it. 2: BEGONE, NECROPOSTER
Cloaking doesn't disable actions when it's off. It makes a noise when it's turned off. There are threads for how overshield has too many downsides or the opposite, I'm only talking about how they're required in general. Don't lump all upsides and downsides together. Footsteps require walking, which has no timer or cooldown. They also are inconsistent and made by literally every infantry, are quiet and short-range relative to jetpack and most importantly don't indicate a specific class. It's not for everyone, however trivial to find an enemy LA with a quick check if the jetpack audio source is allied. Everyone makes footstep noises nearly the entire time they're on an infantry class. (except the stalkers that sit around) If they're jetpacking, they're going somewhere jetpack is needed and you can clearly see if it's an ally and otherwise realize it's an enemy. That explains how the specialties are balanced. Downsides don't need to match those of unrelated classes/abilities for that. There's an idea! Simply apply AP to the other stances. That way AP's value on Infil increases for the full demographic. Nothing to be confused about, just say "are you talking about the old jump+knife trick?" (no) and everything gets cleared up. Maybe this was a particularly stupid thread for Walrus to necro.
"The only buff stalkers need is the ability not to be detected by motion spotters" best post Ive ever seen. Cause it makes since to cloak only to have motion darths pick u up.....
It has infiltrator complaining that they should run faster. Infiltrator is the class that has more advantages of all. It's like all classes in one. Can be invisible, has proximity sensor, uses mines, has the best long-range weapon, uses knife 1 hit also and still feel wronged? When an infiltrator is invisible, he should not even run. I would have to crawl to be more correct.
That's pretty Wrong. Engineer profits the most. They can everything (C4, Tankmines, AI Mines) Turrets Lay Ammo (Infinite Ammo) Rep Vehicles A Grenade And still have a Primary and Secondary... I as Stalker have a Cloak which can be negated by a 100 cert Darklight on a Pistol, EMP or just be seen because of many bugs... Also i have got: -Motion Spotter which got nerfed -Emp Grenade which got nerfed -And the ability to hack terminals (nerfed because they delete several Terminals) And Everyone can Equip a Powerknife.
