infiltrator class is to strong

Infiltrators aren't all that hot unless it plays to its advantages. There cloaks, whilst incredibly handy aren't perfect making them easy pray when spotted. Especially if they're moving through a crowd of enemies or going head on.

Sure they can cloak and capture points and be a nuisance but that's all they are tbh. I've never seen a single infiltrator manage to capture a base on their own (its maybe possible in a tech plant or amp station environment but i've never truly seen it) but i guess that's the point. Bypass shield wall, hack a console, spawn a sunderer, let everyone in via a cheap redeploy trick.

But even if they were to sneak into a base and flip a point, how long do you think their luck will last? chances are they'll get gunned down pretty quickly even if they were able to take maybe one or 2 people with them.

Infiltrators to me aren't OP, more of an annoyance than anything and nothing is more annoying or cheap as an infiltrator with an smg sneaking up to gun you down. Sometimes you catch them early enough and you wipe him out or you die.

TBh i've been playing Infiltrator much more often now and there's nothing more satisfying than sniping people. Especially other snipers or high level players who are probably better than me in a stand up fight because of experience. There's some perverse turn on annoying other players sometimes, but i certainly feel sorry/guilty constantly sniping same low level player. But other snipers or players who have been giving me grief killing me? Eat lead.

Then perhaps you ought to just stick with LA then. In some ways the jetpack is a better cloak than the cloak is itself. Especially when given the fact that most players don't look up.

Almost 90% of players in PS2 seem to be completely unaware that cloaking and decloaking makes a sound. Even less so capable of tracking said sound to the stationary source.

Besides, I don't think you're playing a SMG infiltrator right if you're not constantly moving.

Infiltrators are already of one the most powerful classes, with weapons able to OHSK anyone at any range, powerful auto and semi-auto weapons to dominate short to mid range combat, and some of the most powerful CQC bulldozers that aren't just shotguns. A cloak that is near-perfect when crouching-still, and that still provides the effect while moving at short to mid range, while being completely invisible at long range, even while sprinting around in circles.

Infiltrators have only two disadvantages: cloak sound and slightly weaker shields. The infiltrator class in not weak in the slightest.

90% very unlikely and it might just be from my experience of never really having issues with infiltrators they are the class i have the easiest time dealing with no matter what they are doing. They are good no doubt but i believe anyone who argues that they are overpowered or somehow better than other classes are just people that have bad situation awareness the cloak makes a loud sound and is also an obvious shimmer within 30 or so meters. The infiltrator has one thing that it can do better than the other classes and that is the ranged one hit kill but any experienced player knows that if you never stop moving the odds of this happening are quite low as hitting a moving target at ranged is not easy and very few players can pull it off even less if they dont move in straight predictable patterns(my main thing is sniping and i consider my self skilled in this area).

My main point being that statistically Infiltrators have no outstanding advantage only subjective ones such as people that arnt experienced at seeing through cloak.

80% of players make up 20% of the skill in the game. The former is probably a low ball estimate, the latter a high ball estimate.

Most players don't know to listen nor hunt the flarping sound (or the whistle) of the cloak/uncloak action. Most people aren't looking for shimmers. Most people don't even know how to follow tracers back to their source, and most people certainly make no effort to counter snipe. These are the simple things to do. Others including checking corners, approaching doors appropriately, and looking up towards and even avoiding perching points for Batman ***holes with carbines and C4. Hence all the tanker-C4 rage, but I digress (more bad play decisions resulting in less than stellar play experiences, who'da thunk?)

Conversely, most cloakers make the mistake of assuming they're completely invisible in CQC. Most infiltrators make the mistake of remaining stationary when someone spends more than a micro second looking in their direction. On the long range front, most snipers remain stationary while picking away at targets. Heck, some don't even bother to cloak and uncloak. Worse. 99.9% of infiltrators don't use their sensor tools.

I don't care how stealthy you think you are, DEPLOY THAT $#!%. Whether it's moving into CQC or sniping from long range, the radar is the cloaker's primary means of survival, not their active camo. Yes, most people are idiots that can't follow a tracer, but someone inevitably will. You can fear dropping a sensor or dart at your feet will help them zero in all you want (that search light called a bullet is already an arrow pointed directly at you) but in conjunction with cloak, that infiltrator has two advantages - he/she/it is still somewhat harder to target precisely AND they can see exactly where their would-be assassin is on the mini map. Unless said assassin is also a cloaker, knows when they're being hunted, and drops a sensor themselves too. Then it's a very scary game for both parties.

Y'see... most cloakers are just baaaaad. They don't know how or even to use their best tools, because think they're some elite sneaky little $#!% because they can go partly see-through when they might as well be stomping around in a MAX suit armed with a crowbar. The cloak is active camoflauge, even deep cloak (straight up, it freaking fails, don't rely on it. Ever.) It's perfect if not broken OP in tandem with sniper rifles for long range work, and an attention mitigation at best in CQC. A lone cloaker is a dead cloaker, period. It sounds counter intuitive, but when people are worried about the bodies in front of them they can clearly see, the moving shimmer they don't have time to confirm as an immediate threat is subconciously the least of their worries next to the medic and HA raising their firearms against them. Mostly, no good infiltrator stays still, nor do they move in when no allies are present. Unless it's a tower. If they can get to the upper floors it's like watching sheep blissfully offering themselves to this guys' farm. Of course, people still don't understand there are dudes dropping on top of the tower, and I know we can't be getting very many new people, but I digress.

Finally, within 6-15m (both party's weapon and SPA depending,) unless the bloke you're shooting with your SMG has nanoweave or is a heavy assault, you have the exact same life span. Do the math. Just so happens the 400 shields simply means medium range (uncomfortable for either SMGs or bolt actions) is the worst place an infil can find themselves.

The infiltrator is a welcome addition in infantry fights in my book, just as I feel HA (some retuning IS necessary however) and MAXes are great for spicing up game play encounters, while medics and engineers are boring standard issue COD-depth cannon fodder. I do feel giving OHK sniper rifles to a class that can go invisible was an atrociously stupid idea (name another FPS, even TPS, that has allowed that... and is still running) but it is what it is.

You've clearly played long enough to see just how unfortunately stupid so many players are. 90% is not far off the mark.
(Not to sound like an elitist or anything!)

The infiltrator class' one true hard counter is experience and intelligence. Only players that have been playing for a while ever seem to suspect when an enemy infiltrator is around, but those same players are the ones whom hear jetpacks, ES gunshots, check their minimap, et cetera.

The infiltrator class is just as viable as any other class. If it weren't, we wouldn't be seeing so many SMG infiltrators around all the time; there would just be snipers and maybe the occasional stalker playing for fun.

Now up to 4/10. Good work so far OP

- perhaps an empire specific cloaking sound wich is loud enough to be heard over 300m away (and thats proven check youtube) and to wake up the death (thats not proven).
- ALL classes have access to SMGs. And funfact: all SMGs share a ttk of a 750rpm weapon and they have to be used cqc to be effective. The cloak only allows to come close enough to the target. And all classes (except for the HAs do have weapons with over 800rpm and there are also 0,75ads carbines and ARs with at least 750rpm and they have a lot better range and accuracy than smgs.
i would never touch a SMG with any other class than the infiltrator because i dont like to use ****** weapons but its the best the infiltrator gets.

I mean disadvantages specific to a "SMG cloak." And it can only be heard from such a catastrophic distance when there is no other noise pollution in the area. Though technically, the dead can hear it.

--Just because all classes can use something doesn't mean it isn't good.
--Just because it does not have the highest stats doesn't mean it isn't good.
--Source & calculations?
--Shotguns have to be in CQC. SMGs rule in short to CQC ranges, and can still kill at longer ranges than that.
--SMGs are CQC beasts, and are certainly not ****!

The cloak does not physically push players away from each other if they come too close. It may be imperfect, but you'd still be more visible without it.

Sure, having to start a fight with 20% less shield points than the average classes ( let's not even talk about HAs ) is definitly not a damn problem. Mainly when a loud "Hi,i'm here!!!" sound is following you. Totally easy.
20% is not "slight".

So, Devs are supposed to nerf Infis because 90% of people are too lazy to use in game informations ?

Infi weapons ? Most of them have a damn recoil, very low rof, small clips, and you'll have to stop moving while using them. While other classes have lower recoil, higher rof weapons with larger clips.

That 20% is a single automatic bullet less to kill an infiltrator. If that single bullet makes a difference more than every 1/20 times, you're doing something wrong, methinks.

As previously stated most players don't seem to hear/care about the cloaking/decloaking sounds played, when they can even hear them. Explosions and gunfire are louder than the cloak sounds, and happen very often in a battle.

Most of the infiltrators weapons are bolt-actions and/or are meant for long range. Both of which require their user to be stationary by design.

All of the 1x-4x semi-auto and full-auto rifles are basically more powerful battle rifles, all of which can be used effectively while moving. SMGs are by far the easiest to use and the most powerful short to CQC range weapons. (Barring CQC BASR headshots)

That 20% is the reason infils are the only class that can be 1 shot by a crossbow.
And i think carbines beat smgs in the short to CQC range smgs are just hipfire weapons much like shotguns but most people tend to use shotguns instead unless they are on a class that cant use them. Dont get me wrong SMGs arnt **** weapons but you dont see the other ambush class aka light assault running with them too much they usually pick carbines and shotguns instead because they edge them out slightly in either pure raw power in CQC or versatility with the carbine. (slightly)

And a commissioner, but neither happen very often. I can't even remember the last time someone even killed me with either as an infiltrator, let alone with a single headshot.

I don't know... My silenced GD-7F is pretty great in CQC, but its damage is just so low outside of ~12ish meters even with SPA, and its horizontal recoil alone makes it very inaccurate despite having a forward grip as well as having so little time before it runs out of ammo in its magazine. My Cyclone on the other hand does well up to ~20ish meters and does almost as well in CQC. The only major downside is that it doesn't like heavy overshields very much, whereas my GD-7F just keeps spitting on them until they die.

Personally I hate shotguns in PS2 because at their effective range I might as well just use a Carver. That way I could have a decent primary weapon and still keep my very CQC OHK.

Well Cyclone is cyclone many people use that on heavy as well. Most of my experience is on TR with the Armistice and well you can see for yourself what the factions look like http://ps2oraclestats.com/?stat=kills&weapon1=27000&weapon2=28000&weapon3=29001 i have no doubtt that as NC your experience with smgs is well a bit more positive than mine.

Perhaps, but that still does not make SMGs any less powerful.

Also, that website is comparing the wrong VS SMG, I believe. Shouldn't it be the Eridani?

Noppe. I was comparing the ones that perform the best among each faction Vanu use the Sirius more.
No Nanoweave TTK:
Eridani: 7 shots to kill, 0.480s TTK
Sirius: 8 shots to kill, 0.497sTTK
Nanoweave 5 Target TTK:
Eridani: 9 shots to kill, 0.640s TTK
Sirius: 10 shots to kill, 0.639s TTK
Likely do the the TTK being almost identical they go with the weapon with the larger mag

Ah, I see.

Though this information really proves my point. A weapon that can kill in half a second (with body-shots) does not belong with a cloak, nor is it a weak weapon that is inferior to carbine.

Only balancing issue that is missing from the infiltrator class is that

They SHOULD NOT be allowed to cloak while they have a sniper rifle equipped, cloaking should only be for close range.

You already have the advantage of accuracy, power and long range distance why should it make it even more easier for you and be allowed to cloak? There is no downside to that specific loadout.

DBG really needs to change that.

it's called infiltrator for a reason......

it's not call heavy assault
light assault
etc
etc

the clue is in the name.

if you think this class's primary role is killing, you're an idiot.

now that I have played both infil (BR30) and combat engy (41) I have a total appreciation for the infil class.

I play with 2 roles:

1) ejector seat drop into secured bases ready to capture or disable key supply lines. If the countdown is already on at a node, I guarantee you I am already at the next node prepping for capture and hacking terminals.

2) on the battlefield I am a spotter and killer of engineers.


I have learned how to troll and cause havoc as an infil by flipping capture points, literally seperating squads as people can't resist running back towards a flashing letter. While they are running around trying to find me I am marking them. Then if I have flanked I will use the xbow.

What people don't seem to understand is the layout of a capture point is crucial. Some control points are just not a good place to hide..but if you step out of the capture radius like I do....it causes chaos....

yes lets leave cloak only for the one situation it is borderline useless (easy to see in CQC). Any time I think the devs are idiots when it comes to balance someone like you comes along. threads like these make me happy they only read reddit where peeple aren't this bad...

and there are a few downsides. but you obviously don't know enough about the game to know them...