Infantry is Strong vs Vehicles, but few have realized it.

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by a-koo-chee-moya, Sep 6, 2014.

  1. Axehilt


    Is it hard to understand that when the enemy has a short/instant TTK against you and you have a long TTK against them, that you're at a severe disadvantage? You're going to pop that shot off then a tank or aircraft is going to move up and kill you -- the fact that your attack hit and dealt 20% of their health in damage doesn't really matter.

    Infantry are fodder outdoors. An infantry-heavy force outdoors has no chance against mixed vehicles.

    I'm not sure tankmines is worth mentioning in the balance between vehicles and infantry, since ground vehicles use tankmines all the time. Certainly they're not going to do much against an infantry-heavy force, but that force is going to lose the battle anyway.
  2. Lolki

    In my experience most players have developed an extreme apathy towards objective play in this game and are dedicated solely to getting kills for themselves. Not just infantry either, it's everyone.
    I never see any tanks teaming up to destroy a sundy even though 2 or 3 ap tanks can destroy a full deploy shield sundy in few seconds. Some of the tanks might die in the process but destroying a sundy and hindering an attack or defense is far more important than a couple tanks. But since most players are only concerned with their K/D and SPM they're all sitting on hills with HE and PPAs looking for easy infantry farm instead.
    Air is the same way, 2-3 libs have enough firepower to kill anything almost instantly but even the air outfits never seem to team up to like that kill a vital sundy. I only see maybe 1 lib or esf fly by, get some infantry kills and then get chased off or killed by AA.

    In general this game needs more of an objective focus. The devs need to make it so that territory actually means something and there's an actual metagame. But given that the game is almost 2 years old I'm not holding out much hope.
  3. nehylen

    Objectives are an excuses to set up battles, as it's battles that are fun, not objectives themselves.
    In a large battle i'm happy to destroy a sundy, but in a small scale fight, it always pains me a little to contribute to its destruction. It's not about farming so much as just having an enemy to fight with.
    Even if you had outrageous rewards like 200 certs per objective taken, you'd just see people farming for it, zergs avoiding one another to get the most out of it, and possibly a few very organised elite outfits that would make farming such zergs a specialty with ridiculous odds against them.

    The coordination required to achieve the anti-AV behaviours mentioned could only be achieved through people who'd just get rid of any notion of fun, acting in a pure military style. This is simply not fitting for a game.

    Also regarding the opening post, i think it demonstrate perfectly that infantry has virtually no anti-air capacity in lots of situations. On Hossin, anti-infantry air farmers are quasi-gods, because the most effective option against them, lock-ons, can be a virtually non-existent threat (oh! yet another leaf or small tree branch has blocked my lockon line of sight!). Mind you i love Hossin and line of sights can be used against air, so it's not that bad, but killing air vehicles there is incomparably more difficult than in the vast plains of Indar.

    Against ground vehicles, anything not MAX/HA related requires CQC range (or possibly the ability to get above, for LA), so unless there are possibilities to circle said vehicles, and/or little to no infantry surrouding them, it's going to be tough taking down any vehicles without coordination. Coordination, which as i mentioned, would not keep the game fun for anyone if it was widely practiced.

    On a personal note, i don't mind tanks that much: they have to keep their distance somewhat to avoid getting swarmed by un-coordinated infantry. I'm much more biased against ESF with lolpods, which are the two most annoying things to me in this game, with NC MAXes.
  4. NC_agent00kevin


    Id be fine with that if they couldnt all whip out LMGs, Shotguns and SMGs when they get to the base.
  5. cruczi

    1) C4 does not have long TTK, neither do tank mines.
    2) Rocket TTK is balanced by the fact that it's much easier for me to hit rockets on them than it is for them to hit tank rounds on me, which is especially true if I'm fighting from a bit longer distance using Annihilator.
    3) 1v1 balance is not relevant, infantry are supposed to attack tanks in squads or as supplements to allied vehicles.

    No chance? Sure not even a little bit? Just a teeny weeny bit?

    Seriously, it depends on numbers on each side as well as the surrounding terrain, and whether each side is organized or not. If you have numbers, terrain and organized play on the infantry force's side, they will easily decimate a mixed vehicle force.

    Ground vehicles use tank mines now? Did I miss the patch notes where vehicles can lay mines? Tell me more

    Not sure what you're talking about here... AT mines are effective against vehicles, not infantry, so what's your point?
    • Up x 2
  6. jiggu

    You missed the point so hard I'm considering framing this on my wall
    • Up x 1
  7. Iridar51

    That's 12 players dealing with 1-2. Yay. The answer has been found! Numbers solve everything. *with Russian accent*: Veri gud geim.
  8. pnkdth

    Sure, remove the secondanry weapon from tanks, and force them to use a single weapon that is either useless to infantry or vehicles. Door swings both ways. I wager this playstyle would become relentlessly boring though, and people would leave the game, running around being utterly useless half the time.

    However, in the scenario you put forth, if those tank drivers had advanced, moved in and try to capture the base, they wouldn't have been able to. Instead they acted like most people in vehicles, ie, don't give a damn about capturing bases and it is all about dat infantry farm. Those tank drivers should feel bad for being so focused on their own benefit(CERTS!!!!), and you want to punish the players who actually worked together to deal with a larger threat. I am also trying to work out how 6 people managed to footzerg a tank collum over open ground(are you sure you weren't in the VR?)...
  9. \m/SLAYER\m/

    From my experience - you can kill with Lightning much more infantry than MAX with AV. And i will farm way more infantry with ESF before being destroyed, anyway, i can get out of vehicle, and i will be infantry man...
    • Up x 1
  10. libbmaster

    ...What?

    They already do!

    HA's are the only class with ranged av default, and the only other non-MAX class that can do ranged AV is the engie, and they have to drop 1000 certs for it, AND can't use it in close quarters AND are render completely immobile when they do.


    And light assault is the only class that can reliably deliver C4 to tanks, and even then it's hard.
  11. Yeahy

    Obviously infantry TTK against armor is weak because armor has armor.
    Infantry has many advantages such as speed, mobility, spawn shields, and the vast array of anti armor.
    Lancers, ravens, comets, etc can easily beat armor in a long range battle. Especially with the heat and he nerf, it is very hard for tank primaries and most secondaries to hit them.

    Me and OP do it all the time. He pulls a wraith cloak flash, I get in the back with tank mines. We pull up to the nearest biofarm, I get off, tank mine the sundy, and taunt them while sticky grenading myself.
  12. Yeahy

    8 people shoot at one tank. Boom.
    Reload, shoot at another one. Boom.
    5 tanks go down.
    12 is closer to 10. Happy?
  13. a-koo-chee-moya

    1. 8 heavies shoot rocket=one tank
    2. They pop behind cover with the Medics/Engineers watching their back
    3. They reload
    4. Repeat.
  14. a-koo-chee-moya

    You missed the point that there are a lot of them. An HE can one shot infantry, but 8 infantry can one shot a tank, and there are a lot more infantry than tanks.
    • Up x 1
  15. a-koo-chee-moya

    They are too adaptable. An HEAT+AP secondary Mag will lose to an AP+AP Prowler, but and AV HA is on the same footing as an AI HA.
    • Up x 2
  16. Iridar51

    So?
    • 12 people
    • voice communication
    • exceptional synchronization
    All this deal with 1 tank, which is 1-2 players? Not to mention all those 8 shots must be hits, and that better not be a vanguard with shield ready.

    Additionally, this requires infantry to clump up, and we all know what happens when clumped up infantry goes against HE.





    (the answer is lolpods)
    • Up x 1
  17. Vixxing

    Aaaaah, you got a partner in crime... i just slap some c4 on my wraith change to sniper drive it to behind a tank and throws a grenade at it... (thats how i deploy as sniper most of the time...)
    • Up x 1
  18. Shootybob

    Using C4 properly requires teamwork, but the people you are team-working with don't necessarily realize it.

    Approaching vehicles while they're engaging other targets is the most efficient way.

    If they are not engaged they have a much higher percent probability of seeing you.
  19. a-koo-chee-moya

    They can be strung out slightly, and be using lockons/have the skill to hit rockets. Not to mention that they can be revived instantly by medic. Additionally, infantry needs to be clumped up to push anyways, or they wil be picked off by enemy infantry.
  20. Yeahy

    Well, you frogot the rinse and repeat part. Rockets cost no nanites and almost can fire as fast as a tank primary.

    One esf with lolpods cannot stop even 2 or 3 tanks.