Discussion in 'Infiltrator' started by Nehemia, Jan 9, 2013.
"Oh look a sunderer... EETS ALL MINE!"
Slowest XP gaining class in the game too. Realized this when I had been playing this game INFIL only for 2 months and only at BR17(I play casual but still) ....my brother who just started playing, takes 3 days to get to BR 28 playing LA/ENG/MEDIC .... one thing I'd love to see is extra xp for head-shot distance bonuses(ala BF3)..... and prone, and bi-pods....and sway gone in general but I've kinda accepted that infils are going to be the red headed step child in this game. oh well
Whose looking for a /hug from the Devs.
<--- This guy!
Sure thing but you also have to throw in a ACE device and about 20 boomers/mines go with it, and the ability to hack vehicles and cap points (as these aspects are part of the PS1 style of cloaking)
I'd be happy if they just halved the range/volume of the cloak sound, and extended the breath from 2 seconds to 4.
Most of the time you're better off not using the cloak, the sound gets you killed. The inf is already the weakest in short range combat by far.
I'd also like someone to explain to me why the cloak would stop you stabbing someone with a knife, or throwing a grenade.
Ooooookay... So, First, rebuttals.
Everyone who's saying something akin to "Infiltrators are fine", No. Just, no. Sniping is fine. Despite the weird lack of rendering distance for infantry, sniping is fine.
But Infiltrating is not.
It's been said before, we're very limited. Infiltration is overall overlook-able and at most a neusence to the enemies. A quickly dispatched and refuted one, at that. I admit, hacking a terminal and spawning a sundy can be a great platform for an attack, but it's something that can be handled given a few competent enemies. Turret hacking is situational at best and outright useless most other times. AA turret hacking is almost useless too for anything besides scaring ESFs and libs away from killing a sunderer. We need something more substantial, something to make us a valuable teammate.
That said, about the 30 second hack that stays yours for 15 minutes.
People hardly counter-hack anyway. If they do, it's cause they want to take a vehicle somewhere, and they'll switch to infil, counterhack, switch back, get their vehicle, and be on their way. That's only if they're not an engineer who can destroy/repair it (which many vehicle operators are, by the way). And if you did do this hack, again. they'll destroy/repair it. Problem solved. Unless you're planning on making it magically invincible, it's still not going to deter people. Sorry to burst your bubble, bro.
Stalker Cloak? Hmm... I never played PS1. It looks interesting. Wouldn't be for me, but it looks interesting. I wouldn't mind it.
SMGs? If they're not for us, I'm 'effin done. Just, done. There's no other class it could possibly be for for any other reason besides to anger every cqc loving infiltrator who isn't dead-set on stalker cloak. That said, I much prefer to roll with the short-range bolt action and 1-shot or pistol switch (something i adopted in my last mmofps, apb reloaded), which has a fairly low ttk, 0 if i headshot, and can go out to range with my 4x scope. But that's when I'm infiltrating, not trying to be helpful in a battle. I want a gun for that that isn't a sniper. That's what the SMG is. Want. Will have. Or I'll throw a fit and write a strongly-worded email to the devs.
That said, they must have worked their butts off trying to make sure that these SMGs aren't too powerful. I mean they're either going to be op or up for a while. I can't decide which I hope for, given my current playstyle. Also, something almost no one has taken into consideration, are they going to be faction-specific? Or are they going to be omnifactional (whatever), like everything else Infiltrator? If so, TR will most likely be having the same deal as with their pistol: Everyone else is jealous, but every time they get killed by the NC, they'll whine that theirs is really underpowered because of range restriction due to rof/bloom. And the vs will just be sitting there, half of them crying, half of them bragging about the 3 times it prevailed naturally as a weapon due to some special vs thing, when really it's just a meh gun. (This is from an infiltrator's perspective. Honestly, pistols usually mean eff-all to the other classes. reload + killing shots = pistol finish off ttk with almost everyone [p.s. I use the rebel to ensure it's 1 more shot, 2 on heavies maybe?)
EMP nades? Maybe I haven't been playing long enough, but I've never even seen one used, on 4 servers, never HEARD of anyone using them effectively, on 4 servers, never heard anyone gripe about them, on 4 servers. But maybe I haven't been playing long enough.
Cloaking and NV/Infrared? You're kidding me, right? PLEASE tell me you're kidding. IT WAS MADE TO COUNTER CLOAK. Why would you make it ineffective at the one thing it is meant to counter? Making you invisible to those is actually a huge buff seeing as when you don't use them, you're still very visible, provided medium graphics+. Seeeeriously, though. That aspect of it is fine, and perfectly reasonable. Cloaking should be less visible to normal vision, imo, but that's what the aforementioned stalker cloak does, no? I don't know. It's suitable for sniping, but I'm not a sniper.
I hate sniping but love being sneaky sneak ... and thus this post was made in a previous thread:
+1 for SMG hope.
I don't even use the current stealth implementation. The noise it makes cloaking negates any usefulness through stealth. I would however like the terminal hack/recon dart/proximity mine class to be playable as infantry in and around towers and the current automatic scout rifle doesn't feel up to the job. If I could use an SMG that isn't ****, I would gladly start playing an infiltrator on a regular basis.
no love for battle rifles more like it
Honestly, if an INF is capable of marching to your sunderer, and holding "E" right next to it for couple of seconds without being killed, he should be capable of pulling off the grand theft sunderer.
With the amount of mines available, upcoming invulnerable people spawning right next to it etc. It would be fascinatingly challenging.
(I myself always drop mines next to an sunderer, cause thats one way to grant yourself kills, when those pesky engineers run doing an suicide bomber run with AT mines).
Those saying that Infiltrators offer nothing to their squad when fighting in CQC should take another look at the sensor dart. Once upgraded to higher levels it is good. It can completely prevent anyone from attacking your squad from an unexpected angle. holding a capture point is easy if you know exactly where the enemy is coming from.
Sensor darts can be restocked with ammo packs so there is no reason not to have permanent sensor dart coverage wherever your squad goes. The only problems with it are bugs, the high cost to upgrade it to max level, the crowded minimap and the lack of a cheap CQC weapon but that will hopefully be fixed at some point.
Following your squad and fighting alongside them while giving them sensor dart coverage isn't infiltration though. Infiltration would be sneaking past a defended chokepoint to take out key targets, hack things, cripple the base from within, etc.
Aye, sensor darts makes us pretty much "Scouts". The thing with hacking and infiltration is that not many do it, mostly because of the intensives. Many people like to get "as much as experience as possible." And hacking and doing our job "right" currently doesn't provide experience at all. Example, yesterday we had the typical TR zerg from crown to Xroads watchtower. The fight was stuck at the hill between, enemy sunderers being on the other side of the cliff, so we couldnt fire at them. What did I do? Sneak past the enemy lines and make my way to the crown, I hacked the main AT turret facing their sunderers, and blew 2 of them to the ground. Now, this took me at least five minutes, and what did it gave me? 200 exp from random kills, 400 from sunderers, 25 from hacking. The score per hour (essentially certs per hour) is ridiculously low. I hope they introduce small bonuses etc if we kill enemies with hacked vehicles.
Honestly I think many of the people that want a buff for Inf are the 360 no scope folks from CoD that wanna upload their montages to Youtube. They want to have everything for every situation yet I barely see anyone of them actually hack (really great for base fights) or use the sensor dart (super useful actually) or really act like they are part of a team.
I really respect and appreciate the Infs that actually do help out the team. There are some really fine players on TR. I do appreciate Infs acting like pure snipers just taking out NC/VS at range but there are just so few that do more than that, , at least on my server.
Your attitude is the problem man. That's wicked that you actually did that (sneaking past), that's what Infs should do. But it seems like most just care about is K: D ratio and score per hour instead of actually enjoying a team game. You said it was instinctive, so do you want easy gameplay for everything? I wish more Inf did what you just mentioned, if it takes a little bit more exp for them to be that way, then the devs should do it. But I don't want buffs just to give a bigger grin to CoD/BF3 players.
Just wanted to note (and I apologise, but its a snipe complaint rather than infiltrating) that when performing some seriously long range sniping for captures, when the render distance gods are smiling on me, I can suppress activity on 50% of a base with a 60-70% (if not higher) headshot rate, and end up missing out on the capture xp at the end of it because I'm sat the wrong side of some arbitrary radius around the base when it finally falls.
it's not major, I've more than made up the xp/certs in kills, but on some caps where you really feel like you've gone all out and really helped drive the fight forwards, it does feel like a bit of a boot to the head, in that you've got no reason to head over and infiltrate at all, but if you're doing the other half of your job well instead, you can still lose out..
Actually, I barely even look at my K or score-per-hour, I play the game to fulfill my role, and the above example is the main reason I love infiltrators. I play this game with my friends because of its massive team-based combat. And I love it, but as I am currently advocating infiltrators, and my real life job happens to be on the field of marketing. I think of INF as a class as an product I market, so essentially for major population, giving them intensives to actually do something makes them do it, on broader scale. And naturally, I exaggerate a bit on what we should have (as naturally most of those wont be implemented). Some can be thought of as downright buffs (the C4's for example) but others are just alternative playstyles (such as vehicle hacking). I am satisfied with my Scout rifle / pistol combination, but if people had SMG's, more "infiltrators" would appear instead of snipers, which have an healthy population. I agree on the fact that the class shouldn't be "buffed" too much, as that would lead us from stealth based gameplay to essentially killing machines with cloak, which we shouldn't be. We should be used primarily on tactical, stealth based warfare. Vehicle hacking would be an bonus we miss from old days.
In any battle with more then 10 or 15 peeps let me know if you can even see anything with the sensor dart. To much going on in the mini map to make it useful.
Spoiler Alert on SMGs: Everyone else will get them too and that will only make us die even FASTER to everyone else in CQC since our Cloak is so useless and we have less HP's. Mainly b/c half the time they'll start shooting while we're still cloaked like they already do...but with an even shorter TTK than before without even having to aim it. (the primary characteristic of an SMG is how effective they are at Spray&Pray)
^People who obviously never played the class (or atleast adjusted their graphics beyond "1") should probably not bother commenting in this thread.... at all. They just look blatantly ignorant when they do.
^especially this guy^ (lol wut R headshots? <-- cool ratio bro, even baddies manage a 20% HSK)
I feel like we are beating a dead horse here. Recap:
Sniping is fine except for rendering. In large battles players stop rendering making your snipers useless. A high K/D is what a sniper is looking for. Not for the bragging right that I have more kill but to effect the moral of your enemy. Make them think twice before coming out that door. Moral wins wars.
CQC/squad - We are not asking for buffs to weapons. We are asking for better utility to help the squad.
- Options other then sensor dart, ( Please give us EMP dart) grapple, (compete with LA) better stealth at the expense of weapon choice (Maybe 100% stealth but you can no longer carry a primary weapon).
- Stealth is arguably useless in CQC ( loud, and the delay caused by de-cloaking gets you killed)
We can argue that we bring the least to a squad when pushing a base that every other class does better. We want be the definition of an infiltrator and covertly enter a base to perform tasks that matter.
Costs way less and is way more effective to cert into scout radar on one of the vehicles: Flash and the less likely ESF or Proximity Radar on the Sunderer but just like with the ESFs it takes up a rather valuable slot ... still, I am contemplating certing it. Because of their speed relative to the Infiltrator and especially if it has the stealth certed as well, its actually possible to place a just as "permanent" sensor dart in well ... everywhere.
Sorry, Infiltrators still sucking without proper sneak, peek, and sabotage features available to them, the current ones really don't work as intended. I know, I have tried, desperately because I have enjoyed for a lot of entertainment of the sneaking of other games. Our futuristic ninjas suck and that's a damn shame - I poured so many certs into the class hoping that its issues were just something were negated by being dedicated and putting my exp where my intentions were. NOPE.
****, being able to Solid Snake it with a box over my head would be more effective than the current so called cloak, its ridiculous. As it stands right now, I get more sneak, peek, and sabotage out of being a Engineer on a scout stealth flash that I have put camouflage on as befits the enviroment. I can still take those 15 minutes flanking route in uncommon, cobwebbed corners, set up traps, plop down some ammo and bust everything up ... for way more exp and satisfaction in knowing I helped my team out.
Currently, the number one thing that our Infiltrators do best is when we do a sneaky sneak insertion behind enemy lines by HALO we have one volunteer hack a vehicle terminal for a AMS Sunderer, then they switch classes at the deployed Sunderer. They get slightly more to do at a Amp station simply because there are so many turrets on the walls that we can use to mess with the enemy factions so in effect they blow up their own turrets. That's it. That's all folks.
I'll have to agree with this. I have basically played CQC infiltrator nonstop up to BR30. Recently, I started to play Engineer a bit more and am totally shocked at the increased experience and cert gain. It's not even comparable! All I have to do is repair turrets and generators at a recently captured base and I gain way more certs and exp than I possibly could after hours of playing CQC infiltrator.
The options for infiltrators are basically get kills or hack, to gain certs and exp. You have to be so cautious as a CQC infiltrator, your not going to be getting insane kill streaks very often and hacking shuts off after a few terminals, so what do they expect us to do?
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