[Suggestion] Improving faction diversity.

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Demigan, May 1, 2022.

  1. Demigan

    PS2's faction diversity has quickly devolved for all 3 factions. TR became speed and Dakka, NC became shields, shotguns and high damage profiles and the VS got hover tech and a whole lot of ammo shenanigans.
    And that is a shame, there is a lot or leeway in the lore to improve faction diversity without overpowering one or the other:

    VS discovered and activated the Rebirthing grid and have the most understanding of nanites, they are the scientists of the bunch, they could expand on their antigrav sleds and knowledge of existing technologies in the game.

    The NC is a guerilla force who uses a mixture of experimental weaponry and any industrial equipment they can get their hands on, which is also how they invented the MAX by adapting a heavylifter suit. They are build up out of the workers, security forces and mercenaries that the corporate groups send with the expedition. And yes there is the notion that if you could have put a bigger gun on it, you should have.

    The TR is officially a military group, but for more than a century they functioned as a heavily armed police force. Their weapons are based on the tried and tested technologies combined with the training and experience of quelling small rebel groups and guerilla's both in space and on the ground.

    These traits can easily be added to the 3 factions to enhance their ammo, weapons selection, gadgets and utilities.

    weaponized nanites can disassemble living and moving targets as they move through, or semi-randomly alter their structure to hamper the operation of infantry and vehicles. Nanites could also be used to buff friendlies for a short period of time as their bodies and vehicles are streamlined.
    Their antigrav technology could be used to push and pull objects, like an item that pulls in and eats one enemy grenade to protect people around it or reducing the bullet drop on weapons equipped with it on the ammo.
    As scientists they would also have the besr knowledge about electronic warfare, hacking into enemy gear and vehicles to hamper their functioning.

    NC would have a lot of repurposed industrial equipment. Welding equipment and plasma cutters could be altered into flamethrowers or shooting a cone-shaped explosion in front of you, industrial chemicals like Phosphoric cleaning agents coulf easily be weaponized (and even the ****'s thought it was too dangerous to try with their tech). The NC would also have copious amounts of industrial explosives, which could be cheap with alternative detonation methods like timers, fuses or red-barrel physics where you have to shoot it to make it go off.
    Experimental weaponry can be powerful but have potential backlash to the user. A weapon shooting electricity could have an increasing chance of arcing to the user if you dont let it cool down for example.

    The TR are harder, they could have things like tear gasses to nerf enemies, chemical warfare like mustard gas, utility ammo like the 12-gauge FRAG slugs (both an HE and a HEAT variant for light AV duties exist!), a variety of quick-deploy barricades and cover and more of that kind of stuff.

    The goal wouldnt be to make a massive variety of new guns and gadgets (at least, not in the short term), but to give each faction a selection of unique choices for their equipment. If each faction can select some unique ammo for ALL infantry weapons and even some to vehicle weapons you can greatly change faction diversity.
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  2. Johannes Kaiser

    Nice ideas, but it'll probably end up lopsided one way or the other, as something finds its way into the meta and the other factions don't have that thing.
  3. Demigan

    Small, iterative updates would be key. Like every month you take some part of the game that needs adressing and change a few values. A week after you either keep the change or revert it depending on how bad it was, or adapt it further.
    Construction, infantry balance, G2A vs A2G balance, infantry AV or lack thereoff etc could all be adressed.
  4. vonRichtschuetz

    Would love to see more faction flavor, but first I'd like to have TR faction flavor put in a working state. Things like rampart shields, kcap ammo, the dragoon compared to the obelisk, the butcher having no attachments while the betelgeuse and godsaw do, the palisade having 3% more rpm but 20% less damage than the basilisk and additionally being punished with a ramp up time, the chaingun still being the least useful heavy weapon, don't give me much hope TR will ever get any faction flavor that's working well.

    If I had to vote, I'd vote against more faction flavor, despite wanting it, just because I fear TR will fall back even further.
  5. Tycoh

    The TR just got access to frag rounds on the HSR-1 Battle Rifle, with its really fast reload speed and moderately high fire rate it pretty much is a poor man's Lasher. You should check it out when you get the chance.
  6. DarkStarAnubis

    I think it should have been the way but the rest of PS2 hasn't been designed accordingly.

    Faction diversity is good as long as there aren't specific and carved-in-stone contexts in which the factions must always confront each other. Otherwise, the faction with the weapons more adapted or better suited to those contexts will always have the upper edge.

    In PS2 we have many continents but nobody fights on the continent. All the fights are inside bases. If PMBs would have been integrated into the design and game-play then the situation would be different, but at it is today nobody cares about desert or forests or ice or plains or rivers or caves or mountains, only the bases are important.

    Bases are copy-paste work with less than 10 "basic" buildings arranged differently to convey the illusion of diversity.

    Fighting in bases mean CQQ. CQB means weapons with good hip-firing traits, high RPM and short reload time are the best whereas good aim-firing traits, low RPM and long reload time are the worst.

    Kiss faction diversity good bye.
  7. RabidIBM

    I would love more faction flavor, and would be willing to tolerate some balance griping to get it.
  8. Demigan

    Its exactly why we should be introducing faction flavor for all in the first place. Its not like TR has a monopoly on lack of faction flavor. The Prowler has speed and firepower. the Magrider has maneuverability, its shape and booster to enhance it all. The Vanguard has extra health which cant really be leveraged beyond facetanking and then double down on more health with the shield. And when something new is introduced its almost always a shotgun or something shotgun like for the NC.

    We shouldnt stop adding things because some stuff hasnt been updated enough yet, its exactly why you should ask for more stuff!
  9. Demigan

    Why does everyone always think that CQC is king? Do shotguns, SMG's and other CQC weapons get picked the most? No they dont. Because fighting inside bases is still a versatile thing where ranges wildly differ.
    The most basic of combat in PS2 is from one piece of cover to another piece of cover. And thats rarely a few meters apart. Players fight from a doorway, and when that doorway is compromised they fight from the back of the room or the next doorway.
    It even makes sense for how battles progress: a CQC fight is over quickly with one victor, and the terrain won or lost. A longer range fight takes more time, requires more distance to be covered and your allies will make more of a difference. The big battles are where people have to cross a distance to reach the enemy. By the time the fight actually enters CQC players are overall still holding the much more versatile mid range weapons which have plenty of CQC power.
    I mean if you ask anyone their first response is "aim for the head" not "take a CQC weapon". And which type of weapons would be better at aiming for the head I wonder, an accurate weapon or an inaccurate weapon that has to be used in CQC because of it?

    But lets ignore all that and assume you are right. That still leaves the question of "how much will the imbalance be and can it be fixed?".
    You can always scrap the entire thing if necessary, or better you change its function and mechanics and tbe function and mechanics of the faction counterparts, or you change its stats and that of its counterparts to balance it all out. Its not automatically a disaster that destroys any chance of faction diversity.
  10. Liewec123

    Great ideas Demi,
    I like the NC ones :)

    We do currently have issues with faction diversity,
    Mostly because NC and TR don't really have anything beyond stat tweaks.
    "NC? Oh your weapons deal 33 more damage but shoot slower"
    "TR? Oh your weapons have 100 more RPM but deal less damage"
    "Oh VS?...[Deep breath] your bullets don't drop with gravity, your weapons have infinite ammo and no reloads oh and you can use an ammo on many of them that turns them into AOE suppression weapons, and another ammo that makes your bullets larger like hitbox-hack, oh and your tank flies, can strafe and has no recoil."

    It's like every interesting faction trait always goes to VS.
    Heat mechanic, bullet drop, unstable ammo
    And now the new Lashing Ammo seems very interesting allowing VS to have mini Lasher's on multiple classes.

    It's about time TR and NC got some faction traits as unique as these (and more useful than the stupid piercing bullets that NC have on a few slow firing weapons.)
  11. TR5L4Y3R

    ... while i did ask for faction diversaty myself before i still would rather have I-V-A gameplay be balanced first ...