Holy crap, I just realized, the Air game is pretty perfect right now!

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by DashRendar, May 10, 2014.

  1. Sebastien

    There's two that can do that. Which one is it.
  2. Badname707

    Either/or. One has better alpha damage and can sustain fire while taking damage, the other one can chase down any vehicle in the game.
  3. Brahma2

    Power outages?
    • Up x 1
  4. Sebastien

    The best counter can't be itself. That's terrible balance because it means you can overpower everything so long as you get enough of them.

    You know what good tankers do when they see a Lib vectoring in on them? "Oh ****." The only thing they can do is run, or hide, there's nearly no way to fight back, and it only takes a second.
    So that leaves just one thing that has the capability to counter, but the Lib isn't as powerless as the Tank when it comes to counters.

    Spontaneous Combustion.
    • Up x 2
  5. Badname707

    Except for AA. AA thins out air faster than air can thin out AA, provided the air isn't specifically going after AA (thus nullifying its presence against everything else). Air HAS to be able to hurt AA, because AA can put itself where it can't be reached from ground. Make AA much stronger against air and you can create AV nests that no vehicle, ground nor air, can have any hope of assaulting.

    The thing is, air plays by different rules than the ground. Air flies. The thing that can most easily stay in the engagement range of a flying object is another flying object.
  6. Sebastien

    So you're saying AA is a counter rather than a deterrent?
    • Up x 1
  7. Badname707

    It can be. It depends entirely on how much AA is operating in the area. In the same way, assault rifles sometimes deter MAX's, but concentrated fire will kill it before it can escape.
  8. Sebastien

    That's not a good argument. You could have 48 HA shooting Decimators at a Lib. 3 of them are bound to hit, but the payoff doesn't outweigh the investment.
    • Up x 2
  9. Badname707

    Right, but you could have 48 HA's shooting decimators at a tank at the same distance, and if they are all perfectly accurate, the tank can reverse 10m and evade them all. It's all about using the right tools for the job. AA is nice because it can attack air units where it won't be attacked from the ground. For air to attack ground, it must make itself vulnerable to things on the ground, as well as the air.
  10. Sebastien

    You misunderstood the point. The Lib is moving, you have 48 people shooting at it or where it's going to be in their opinion. You fill the air with enough rockets, some of them are bound to hit.

    But, for something to be a Counter it requires you to expend less effort than if you engaged them on equal ground. AA is not a counter as Aircraft can outrun said AA. It's a deterrent because most times, it won't actually kill the Aircraft, just drive them off.

    It seems your problem is that AA can hide in spawn rooms where nothing can reach it. Unfortunately you only find AA around bases because they're useless for everything else, and nobody want to use AA. Nobody pulls AA because they want to, they pull AA because they ******* hate you guys more than they want Certs.
    So really, it's only a problem when you're farming a base.

    Your last point isn't exclusive to Aircraft. Tanks render to Infantry before Infantry render to them. Infantry need to get close to tanks if they want to secure a kill with C4. Both of these things are vulnerable to Aircraft because they don't have enough DPS, or because they can't target.
    • Up x 3
  11. LibertyRevolution

    The payoff WOULD outweigh the investment..
    Rockets cost you nothing, and shooting a rocket into the sky takes about 1 sec of time..
    Libs have cooldown timer and cost resources..

    If people would actually just spam dumbfire when they see libs, the libs would run..
    I know I would run if I ever saw even 20 rockets coming up from all over the base..

    Convincing people to do this is like trying to convince people to spam at ESF with their LMG..
    12 guys lighting up an ESF with LMG will make that ESF afterburner out there faster than shooting it with a walker!

    Air likes to farm, if you put up resistance threatening to take down their plane, they will go find easier farm.
    • Up x 1
  12. MostlyClueless

    If 12 people fire a dumbfire rocket at a Tank it dies. They get XP. This is why people fire rockets at Tanks.

    If 12 people fire a rocket at the Lib it just goes away (Or Zephyrs them all) They don't get XP. They probably get killed. This is why people don't fire rockets at Libs.
    • Up x 3
  13. LibertyRevolution

    So instead they just run around in the open and let the libs farm them... that seems to be working oh so effectively for the infantry..
    As a lib pilot, I am far more likely to leave a base and go find a farm where they are not shooting rockets at me..
    But that is fine, you can continue to be farmed, because god forbid you "waste" a free rocket trying to deter the death from above..

    Seriously.. this is what wrong with planetside players.. "I'm not shoot at it because I won't get XP unless I hit it"..
    Well you ain't going to be making any XP if you are dead and stuck in your spawn!

    I give up on you all.. just enjoy being farmed by libs.. maybe one day you will learn to play, or quit, so I don't have to listen to you cry!
    • Up x 1
  14. MostlyClueless

    I do shoot libs with Rockets. Since they're 400 meters away and move faster than an MBT the hit rate isn't exactly very high. Most of them just try Zephyr or Bulldog me and I praise the Flak Armour gods as I run into a building.

    "My counter is 10 HA's and even then I don't die" is a ridiculous situation for anything to be in.
    • Up x 3
  15. z1967

    There are several ways since you ask so nicely.

    Infantry on high ground will usually have a sunderer so lets put that as the priority target. The super easy mode method involves 4-6 Liberators with either full gunners or 2/3. All the Libs make a pass on the Sunderer, all taking turns TBing it whilst one or two use the Shredder or Zephyr to remove engineers trying to repair. Then, target all the medics you can pick out from the crowd (white backpacks) and blast them (shredder kills infantry instantly upon a direct hit). Leave and re-arm/repair. Come back and finish mopping up.

    A less air reliant tactic involves two steps. First is the saturation stage, which is removing infantry from the area (HE is like a mortar so you will be able to hit the troops there), use 6-10 tanks with HE/HEAT to remove the infantry from around the sunderer and two support sundies. Bombard the Sunderer primarily until it is less than spawnable on. Next, use your AV weapon of choice to remove the sunderer, 12 MANA AV turrets are cheap yet effective and you are already in range to use it so no problems there. Once the sunderer is removed just continue to saturate the area until they are all dead. Feel free to put some infantry up there to verify they are gone for good.

    Harasser zerg? Well I assume 2 things , that this is a platoon effort and that this is not on Esamir. The fastest and easiest way (again) is to use Liberators and just follow the zerg. Few run walkers or Rangers so no worries there. The next best is ESFs, and the non air method is an AT mines screen (since you imply zerg they are all moving in an uncoordinated fashion towards an objective). Finally, after they have hit the AT mines just open fire with AP tanks or Sunderers with Basilisks. MAXes with AV or HAs will also suffice if you want to refrain from using armor. Simple stuff. Racer AP lightnings can easiliy catch up to harassers and no doubt that any aircraft will outrun them.

    Try again. I have literally binders full of tactics* for taking out different combined arms units.

    *That is a joke, I don't actually have a binder full of tactics just a small wall of papers with macro strategy and micro strategy. Fun stuff.
    • Up x 1
  16. current1y

    Being new to libs all within the past month or so I have to say they do feel a bit op. I generally fly with a team of them 2-3 and sometimes with mossy escorts and I can say we pretty much **** on anything that isn't those huge 48/48 fights with massive tons of AA or other aircraft to deal with. They also do seem OP even when I go out alone (no other aircraft) like this 40 min 40,000 point run twitch.tv/current1y/c/4246269

    I wouldn't mind their HP reduced more and the bulldog do less damage to other aircraft.

    The idea behind HP reduction would make it more vulnerable from ground as well as air. The lib dog fights other ESF too easily for being a bomber.

    The idea behind the bulldog being less effective against against other air (ESF in particular) is that its an air to ground weapon and not intended to be anti air (i assume). Its too easy to hit shots and deter aircraft with it. If a lib pulls tankbuster, dalton/zef and bulldog you you must assume they are going full air to ground. That set up should be considerably more vulnerable to equal or slightly less skilled solo ESF pilots. There should be a penalty for pulling that set up when currently there isn't much of one for a good lib crew.
    • Up x 1
  17. Inex

    So, you honestly don't see any problems with the idea of having over a dozen HAs dedicate themselves to AA duty.

    Nothing like, say, the fact those HAs aren't actually defending a base cap anymore because they're too busy pointing RLs at the sky?

    My video skimming is strong today. Managed to pop basically right to 25:50 - 26:50 where the problems with the Lib are laid out pretty plainly.

    Maybe the people in the base you were farming should have pulled a Burster Max so that you'd run away and find a new farm.
  18. Camycamera

    yeah, sure it is. /s

    and even if it is, the thing still handles like a flying whale.

    that composite armor buff against tanks was put in because tanks were too effective at taking out libs. well guess what, i have still managed to take down plenty of libs WITH MY TANK.

    a liberator is to tanks, as tanks are to MAXes. they are supposed to dominate infantry. it is their job. and to get rid of them, pull an equivalent, its as simple as that. infantry should not be able to counter every vehicle in the game, only deny them. we already have tanks running away from c4 fairies such as myself, do you seriously want the same thing to happen to libs, thus making this god damn infantryside?

    no, you dont.
  19. MostlyClueless

    I've taken down plenty of MAX's with the SOAS-20 this doesn't make the SOAS-20 an effective Anti-MAX weapon.
    • Up x 3
  20. MostlyClueless

    Do I want Light Assaults to have a jetpack that'll launch them into the sky so they might duel the Liberator on their own terms?

    HELL. YES.
    • Up x 3