Heavy assault rifle usage.

I have always been confused why the heavy has access to using smgs, shottguns and lmgs but not the rifles. Why can't heavy use the guns the medic has access to? Medic has some really great guns but the rifle type of gun has no class crossover whatsoever.

Any thoughts here?

Engie would be great for rifle usage aswell.

Why not rockets on infiltrator?

The Sniper Rifle and the Scout Rifle also have no crossover. For that matter neither does the LMG. Although they're officially tools, the Rocket Launcher is Heavy-only and the soon-to-be-released Rocklet Rifle will join its rank as an LA exclusive weapon/tool. Let's not forget the Heavy Weapons themselves.

The Carbine holds the distinction as the only primary weapon category possessed by more than one class. (Of course, I'm not counting the universal Pistols.)

Edit: I've also long wanted to separate the Carbine from one of the two classes and give the now-lacking one their own unique primary type. At this point, sadly, the work of constructing a whole weapon category as fleshed out as the current ones would probably be astronomical. I also don't want to start a fight between Engineers and Light Assaults over who gets the Carbine and who gets the hypothetical new weapon.

I asked the same question when I started.
The only response I got was that it'd be OP, except that the only thing that could even be considered slightly more powerful is the CQ ARs that have higher dps than the heavy's closest range LMG, but I'd consider that stretching it at best.

It's for balance reasons. Assault rifles are the best automatic weapons in the game. Medics can outgun heavies due to the sheer superiority of ARs over LMGs. Likewise for light assaults/engineers and cqc dominating carbines. If heavies could equip assault rifles and carbines, why would anyone use any other class in infantry combat?

Same for engineers having access to assault rifles. As much as I feel my favorite class got shafted by sharing a primary weapon class with light assaults, I also understand why giving the best automatics in the game to a class with infinite ammo can be sorta broken.

Ammo logistics seems like the smallest issue to me. I think crossing more weapons means people will gravitate to 1 FOTM weapon, instead of a wider arsenal. Right now you need to unlock about 6-8 weapons to cover all ranges on all classes. If they change that to just 1 or 2, it would cause people to not use/buy the others (unless they're directive junkies).

Also, diversity is nice, but weapons overlapping could be nice. Have a new LMG type of weapon for Engie's and a new Assault Rifle for Heavies.

Because balance. ARs are arguably better than LMGs.

Same for the rest. Its most likely about balance.

Using a rifle instead of a LMG on a heavy would trade the large clip for more accuracy. I do not see how that is totally insane. Engie has no jetpack and plays more like a medic than a light assault being that it is almost purely a support role. SMGs also have crossover. It makes no sense that a heavy can drop his LMG for a SMG but not a BR. Even if we dub the BR in the hands of a heavy to be OP i still don't see why the engie should not be able to use this as he does not have the LAs ambush capability.

The only thing the BR has over the LMG is stabilty. There are no differences in damage or rate of fire.

Using as Cyclone on a NC heavy will get you hate tells.

I like the way you act as if this game has any kind of infantry balance.

ARs are much better than LMGs. Higher DPS, higher accuracy, lower recoil. Literally the only disadvantage is the mag size, but AR mag sizes are still big enough to chomp through two or three baddies easily, followed up with a lightning fast reload. So it's a fairly negligible disadvantage weighed against three massive positives.

So really, the OP's question comes down to 'do we want to buff HAs?'.

Because it does. It's not perfect but in my honest opinion, after overshield rework, the classes are balanced. The meta favoring some classes over others is either player driven or a result of base design.

Are you part of the 'heavy OP' crowd?

Okay then, riddle me this; why are heavies allowed to use SMG's and Shotguns and why is that not considered OP given that the class is objectively better than any other class wielding the same weapon?

Except it's not. Other than heavies with Cyclones, which is more a result of the weapon being broken, infiltrators will be infinitely better with SMGs and light assaults will be infinitely better with shotguns.

Quick edit: Despite that I do agree that heavies should not be able to equip SMGs.

i can only speak for the NC since its the only faction where i have a lot of use on medic guns and HA guns. the medic guns are limited guns than the heavy has. (not less powerful, just limited)

the Reaper is an absolute monster of a gun and is FAR better than the gsaw and saw at short to medium ranges... but it has only 24 bullets on the magazine. same with the carnage and the EM1, same gun philosophy but limited lane sustainability and repeated reloads.

the point is, as far as the NC goes if the heavies had access to medic guns, why would they use them? they are limited variants of guns that don't have a synergy with their role.

the reaper is a beast a short to mid ranges, same with the Carnage, gr22 and tross. all guns have Heavy variants with extended ranges... so why use them?

i have some use on TR medic guns, and the same pattern seems to apply, and even when i have zero hours of medic as vanu, vanu is vanu.. all guns are just the same gun with a different name so i expect that the same applies.

main point is, you cant think of guns in a vacuum, the gun and the class have a synergy. like the dude above says, no one can use a shotgun better than a light, simply because no one can create the situations where the shotgun is superior as often as a light can. and no one should be holding mid to long range lanes but heavies, and medics should be doing support with skills and fire from behind the front line.

Or shotguns, see if this game was well balanced then Heavies would be limited to lower DPS weapons (LMGs) or support weapons (Battle Rifles, Heavy Weapons (except the Jackhammer which is just an objectively better shotgun)) to make up for the fact that they are the heavy class and have inflated HP compared to the other classes (HP * DPS = balance).

Not to sound condescending but I don't really care either way. Shotguns are just as much niche weapons as battle rifles are. They're extremely aggravating when camping corners but outside that 8m range, the shotgun (unless jackhammer or baron to a lesser extent) wielding heavy is free certs.

There's a reason good players rarely put shotguns on their heavies.

Apart from the obvious balance issue already mentioned, I believe the HA was originally conceived as a kind of close support class - supporting the LA to take objectives and then being able to hold them once taken - and the LMG is basically a squad support weapon in this concept. Although things may not have panned out that way in practice HA is still the most widely played class so I don't see the need to make them even more powerful/popular.

Medic, HA and Infil all have their unique weapon as well as access to a general pool. LA and Engineer share the carbine as their class weapon. I heard that infils used to have access to common pool shotguns as well as SMGs, like the other classes, but that this proved OP in combination with the cloak.

It's the same with grenades, each class has one or two specific to them but they can all carry frags instead, if they choose.

Regarding AR users, let's not forget that the designation is Combat Medic.....they are supposed to fight as well as heal and rezz. I think that having a better weapon but less shield is part of what balances them with HA in the combat role.

Remember a while back when people complained that Heavies were too strong in a 1v1?

Imagine a class with an overshield for more HP that can 4-dink your skull from 50 meters away.




Remember when people complained that the Orion was super-OP due to it's x.75 ADS speed?

Imagine a pre-nerf Orion heavy with even higher RoF and better accuracy.


That is what you would get by giving Heavies AR's.