[Suggestion] Fallout 4 Inspired Improvements for MAXes and HAs

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by ColonelChingles, Jan 9, 2016.

  1. ColonelChingles

    After a hiatus from PS2 for Fallout 4 shenanigans, I figured there might actually be interesting mechanics from Fallout 4 that could fix problems with PS2, namely with the never-ending balance issues around MAXes and HAs.

    But first, some background for those who haven't played FO4 yet.

    In FO4, you get Power Armour, which is a lot like a MAX suit. They are heavily armoured and allow you to carry more weight/weapons. And you get one within the first 10 minutes or so of the game.


    This is unlike previous Fallout games, where Power Armour is an end-game item. So in terms of game balance, how do they give early players such a powerful advantage while keeping the game challenging?

    That's because in FO4 the Power Armour requires "batteries" to use, in the form of Fusion Cores.


    As you move around in Power Armour, the Fusion Core depletes. Once it's all gone the Power Armour becomes crippled. Unless you have another Fusion Core, your Power Armour is mostly useless and is likely to get you killed. Thus Fusion Cores are essentially the limiting mechanic, balancing out an otherwise OP item.

    Oh, and Fusion Cores can be shot, which causes them to pop out and explode (often killing the occupant of the Power Armour). So they also serve as a balancing weak point.

    How does this apply to PS2?

    MAXes have a problem where they seem to be able to run independently of squishy support units. The ubiquitous "MAX crash" is one of these instances. In general there's not much penalty for "MAX heavy" squads, which leads to a ridiculous amount of MAXes running about.

    One change that could fix this would be to give each MAX a limited power battery, like how the Fusion Cores work in FO4. These Fusion Cores could be upgraded as a suit slot, and allow a MAX to operate independently for 30-60 seconds. Once the Fusion Core is depleted, however, all MAX operations (moving, reloading, turning) are greatly slowed down. Fusion Cores may be recharged by a friendly Engineer.

    What this does is it would force squads to be more balanced. A "MAX heavy" squad would soon find itself with sluggish, vulnerable MAXes, while a more balanced squad with enough supporting Engineers would be able to field more effective (if fewer) MAXes. Additionally this opens up counter-play, as taking out squishy Engineers would be a viable tactic to crippling a MAX.

    Heavy Assaults
    The chief complaint about HAs is that they seem to have an unfair combat advantage over other combat classes (usually Light Assaults and Infiltrators), and the counter to that is that the HA is meant to rush into combat and so needs to be tougher. Ideally, as long as an LA or Infiltrator has flanked a HA (using their class specialty), then they should easily win. But in a face-to-face fight, the HA should win.

    HAs could be changed such that they have a "Fusion Core" on their back. This makes sense, as they are supposed to have Power Armour which allows them to carry heavy LMGs and rocket launchers. Unlike a MAX, these Fusion Cores are unlimited and do not require Engineer support. This is because HAs are lighter than MAXes and so the Fusion Cores are not drained.

    However, what the Fusion Core does is serve as a OHK weak point for HAs. If the HA suffers direct damage (not indirect damage) to the Fusion Core, the HA will die in a small explosion.

    What this does is it keeps the HA as a frontal assault unit that can take a good number of hits from the front, but also rewards LAs and Infiltrators for flanking. If a HA is flanked and takes a bullet to the Fusion Core, that HA is out of the fight. There is no spinning around with the iWin shield and tanking hits.

    As such, HAs will be more vulnerable to flanking and will require teammates to provide protection. Likewise, stacking HAs in a mob might be an explosively bad idea. This freshens up the tactical value of lighter flanking units, allowing them to counter HAs with tactics and planning.

  2. haldolium

    Nice try.
    • Up x 1
  3. Azawarau

    Im gonna have to disagree

    Max suit solo isnt really viable

    Its possible and even efficient alot of the time

    But without support its just not viable

    Its reliant enough on allies and easy enough to kill that none of this is needed
  4. SarahM

    aka "Skyrim with guns" :p
  5. Obscura

    How about..

    No? lol

    Maxes already are slow, clunky, and lacking in needed mobility. In PS1 MAX units had a travel mode where they could run around as fast as vehicles, for 450 resources why in the hell would anyone want a max suit with batteries that run out as you run around?

    Honestly, suggestions are appreciated, but a mechanic like that is not meant for a game like this, it complicates fundamental gameplay like being able to move around as any class.
    • Up x 1
  6. Cyropaedia

    C4 fairies and tank mines are already very effective counters to Maxes. Or bullets (+Archer). Pick your poison here.

    If you make an argument on Max Crash (numbers problem), you could raise the same issue for any equipment-heavy Zerg like Tank columns, Harrasser squads, and Air zergs.

    HA nerfs are in progress though.
  7. AxiomInsanity87

    Maxes are easier to kill than ever now though.
  8. Mezinov

    So that is where you have been. I've missed sortofbutnotquite agreeing with you.

    Not so long ago I showed that Planetside 2 is actually set in the future of the Fallout universe - reinforced by the fact TRay did art stuffs for the Fallouts too.

    To save you having to look at my post history I will just quote myself;
  9. Liewec123

    if you give maxes a "limited power supply" you might aswell remove them from the game, currently...
    • they cost the same as tanks
    • they're far slower than tanks
    • do less damage than tanks
    • have far less health than tanks
    • can't be exited to repair like tanks
    • can't capture points like tank drivers can
    • can't resupply allies ammo like tank drivers can
    • can't be exited when its about to be destroyed like tanks can.
    • can be OHK roadkilled by a 50 resource quadbike...

    maxes are literally slower, weaker, squishier tanks for the exact same price.

    go further and compare them to liberators, which are the same as tanks only flying and suddenly your 450 resource cert pinata looks pretty ridiculous.
  10. Taemien

    MAXes are currently 450 resource units. 450 resource units are things like Liberators and Main Battle Tanks. Why is the MAX so much? Especially since it can be gibbed by a blast from a rocket followed up by some rounds fired from a carbine.

    Well it can operate in areas those other units can't. Around control points and other objectives. Indoors.

    Because of its high cost.. it doesn't make much sense to tether these things to spawn rooms. In fact I'd have to say REMOVE the nanite cost entirely and make them a normal class if they had a core to keep powered. I mean 30-60 seconds a core? That Removes the MAX from some fights on some bases as it would take them too long to traverse.

    MAXes are also limited in mobility. They can't operate vehicles and can't even get inside most of them.

    If you really want to limit the usage of MAX suits. Resource revamp stage 2 is the answer. Not some arbitrary battery. I know people who just want it to be LA vs LA with everyone else supporting them will go crazy over this idea. But in reality many of us have spent good money on the MAX, we don't wish to see it crippled to being just AA in a spawn room.

    As for Heavies. That's just playing with my emotions. In the Army I was one of (many of, you'd be surprised how much firepower our small satcom platoon had, out of 14 of us, only 2 had rifles, the rest LMGs and Grenade Launchers) the Machine Gunners in my platoon. I was expected to carry my LMG, 1000 rounds, an extra barrel and at least a 60lbs (more depending on what we're doing) pack. All while wearing armor and helmet.

    I know game mechanics trumps realism.. but I have a realistic expectation that my character who is pretty damn fit on nanites and other performance enhancing technologies, to carry at LEAST what I was capable of.

    With that being said.. the HA is getting its shield slashed in an upcoming patch. Its TTK is going to be drastically lowered. Its shield is probably going to protect less against damage than a Medic Overheal in a straight up fight. I think a 450 shield is going to be well inline with ammo from engies, heals from medics, LA's jump pack, and the Infils Stealth. If we were to add core's that can be shot from behind to HA's. We've got to add them to everyone else? I mean why not? All that listed equipment has to be pretty damn heavy right?

    Nah.. lets not and say we did. As I said.. lets not play around with my emtions. Already I can't hit sh-t with my weapons with shots that I could easily make IRL because of unrealistic CoF. Lets not add in mechanics such as destructible cores to classes that really don't need it, especially for some lore reason of weight. Judging by the thighs and arms of the soldiers, both male and female. I think can handle it without power armor.
  11. ohknoh

    Heavies' shields should ramp up, 1.5 seconds to reach max, then 2 seconds before they start depleting. You can still reactively mitigate damage, but they don't charge fast enough to out pace the dps of most weapons. There fixed the heavies.

    Maxes? Are okay. The deaparity between each faction's max is my onlu real problem with them. I'd like to see ZOE get revamped into something useful, it's beyond lame that it hasn't. Imo make it cause your AI weapons to aoe like lashers or something. Idk, but anything ia better than actually making it easier for your enemies to kill you.

    As for killing maxes, yeah that's really not hard if you have the right tools. I've actually seen a few landmines cripple a small max crash.