Does the TR have an identity crisis?

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by SinerAthin, Feb 18, 2014.

  1. SinerAthin

    So, I have been thinking about the TR faction.

    One of their faction traits are supposed to be speed(hence the prowler and their ESF being the fastest of their respective groups with default speed).

    But, for some reason, the devs also decided to give the faction that played the most on speed an anchored mode that immobilized them, rendering their speed useless?

    Wouldn't it be better to go all the way and instead give the TR abilities that synergized with their speed?

    What's SOE logic here? Because I don't get it o_O
    • Up x 10
  2. Astealoth

    TR has the slowest, wonkiest ES abilities almost across the board. We don't even have the fastest firing weapons. Our faction trait is having decent default items and the absolute worst high end items.
    • Up x 12
  3. KodiakBlack

    Looking for Logic in TR design is like hunting for bigfoot:

    You're not going to find it, you will go mad looking.

    We have ROF - except for the NC and VS guns that out rof ours
    We have speed - Except when using our faction abilities
    We get standing still and clip size whilst NC and VS get charging mechanics, TV missiles, fly by wire max weapons, disco maxes, shields (I'm not arguing the effectiveness of these, just they actually got something).

    Every time new content drops we get a tweak of something existing, it's literally never something new.

    Oh and BTW, courtesy of the racer frame for the ESF scaling differently for the Mossie than the other 2 ESFs (God knows why), the mossie isn't even necessarily the fastest anymore.
    • Up x 23
  4. Hiding in VR

    If I didn't read the forums I would have no idea what the TR fraction traits were suppose to be. Just saying.
    • Up x 2
  5. teks

    Its pretty simple actually, and a concept that has existed for ages in the real world. Mobile artillery, the ability to rapidly deploy powerful artillery at obscure locations, and move the artillery to a new location before the enemy can respond.

    For example. Lets look at an ideal, intelligent prowler driver.
    Hes got racer, full deploy, full stealth, deploy, AP, and a halberd. (pay attention to this stealth critics)

    This experienced, non-noob, tanker has the foresight to observe the battlefield rather then charge head first like 90% of tanks (behavior all experienced tankers follow). He sees where the enemy is concentrated, and looks on his map for a good way around to a distant hill. Taking full advantage of his high top speed he quickly reaches this hill while minimizing his exposure in the open. There, in the distant hill, facing the sides/flanks of a hefty enemy zerg, he deploys.
    Anyone that has ever used stealth knows that your not revealed on the minimap from a certain distance (which you are surely beyond). This means the prowler, the lone intelligent prowler, can take out a slew of enemies completely uncontested and single-handily force the enemy tanks to reposition. Until the enemy tanks begin to notice where the threat is coming from they will melt.
    Now, the prowlers speed comes in a second time. Once the intelligent prowler knows his welcome is over he undeploys and bugs out BEFORE he begins to take a bunch of damage. Hes maybe killed 2-3 tanks or even more without even taking fire, so there little reason to extend this much longer and risk death. Instead he will seek a new location, preferably one that allows him to attack the pursuers from yet another unexpected angle.

    Some additional notes about the above scenario
    • Stealth will not reveal you on the minimap after you fire at this distance (something I shouldn't even be sharing)
    • ESFs have a much harder time spotting stealth tanks. A good thing considering they are your biggest threat.
    • Prowlers get the biggest boost from reload certs since it was changed to a fixed number. Use it!
    • If your not using AP, you can never complain about losing tank fights.
    • Considering all of the above, this prowler should be able to beat any tank he fires at considering that he has landed 2 deployed shots at the enemies rear. Even shielded AP vanguards. By the time he turns, sees you, and returns fire, its already too late.

    Now I know 90% of you will say how this isn't a likely story for whatever reason, well, 90% of you aren't good tankers too. This is the exact same strategy I use in a lightning, resulting in kill streaks vs. vanguards even, so if you think this is some freak story, or circumstance that cannot be repeated. You are wrong.
    If you think speed and deploy aren't a perfect couple, you are wrong. They are a match made in heaven.

    Do I think its the most powerful ability? no. Thats the shield without a doubt. But, it is a good ability that rewards skill, and thats not something the TR should throw away so quickly.
    • Up x 10
  6. Logri

    I find myself playing my VS alt more often lately, then again she's a hot spandex sniper chick :p
    More then once have I raised an eyebrow over my beloved TR, short end of the stick sometimes comes to mind.
    For a military oriented faction they sure feel amateuristic and under developed.
    • Up x 4
  7. teks

    Tr abilities are larger clips, high horizontal recoil, and long reload time for infantry weapons.
    Top speed and DPS for vehicles.

    Its actually pretty simple. Since lockdown greatly enhances DPS, and the prowler's top speed can be used to position/reposition, it actually fits the TR quite well. I think the prowler is ugly, but I think its a great tank in function, and I'm pretty jealous of it as a VS player since its really everything I wished the magrider was.

    The scaling first only mitigates the mossy advantage with racer, and not by a large enough margin to remove it completely. I think they found it too much that stock mossys could run down racer 3 everything else.
  8. huller

    The TR have sidegrades of NS weapons as "empire specific" weapons and our ESHW, a minigun, doesn't have enough RoF to outgun some carbines, plus it is gimped with a spin up mechanic, on top of having a terrible CoF by the time it is spun up resulting in a sup par weapon with less range than your average shotgun.

    Whose idea was it to have a minigun with spinup that is useless at any range bar point blank without burst firing for crying out loud? And to have that weapon supposedly being the flagship weapon of the faction is just rubbing salt in the wound.

    Also, don't forget about how the prowler is a long range tank yet is equiped with empire specific secondaries with the shortest range of them all with the exception of the canister.
    • Up x 14
  9. teks

    The vulcan would be pretty intuitive if XP was properly shared. If the deployed prowler let loose targets, and the vulcan took care of flankers/blitzers. Sadly, no gunner is going to sit around all day waiting for a what-if scenario :(

    Fortunately, as is true for all tanks. The halberd is pretty much the best AV weapon anyway.
  10. sucoon

    the tr faction traits are less useless as the vs are.

    at all weapon, where you need the no bullet faction traits most, it isnt present:
    - sniper, because its op
    - slug shootguns because its overperforming
    - mbt main weapon, because of why?
    at all other automatic weapons no bullet drop isn't usefull
    • Up x 1
  11. Hiding in VR

    These are hardly "abilities".

    Not unless you described the ability to detect peanuts via an extreme allergic reaction , as an ability ;)
    • Up x 4
  12. Matixzun

    Actually, It affects both Scout Rifles and Battle Rifles, so it isn't useless.
    • Up x 2
  13. HerpTheDerp

    No, the TR trait was supposed to be DPS first, everything else later.
    • Up x 1
  14. Aesir

    Actually ... Speed never was the TR trait in PS1, the Prowler was the slowest of the 3 MBTs, but it was quick to reach it's maximum speed. Vanguards went faster but took forever to reach that speed, which is why Vanguards relayed more on their speed than the Prowlers, which had the same health as Vanguards but way more firepower. Magriders were the only MBT with lower health.

    And than we have anchor down, a PS1 TR MAX ability ... of course it doesn't match. The TR were about staying in your face, winning through firing more stuff your way than you could take. Vanguards were hit and run, Magriders were kiters/snipers, the Prowler at hearth a brawler/infighter.

    We are mixing a trait from two different factions here, PS1 TR was different than PS2 TR ... The main difference is trading protection for speed.
  15. teks

    They are more then the vanu has.

    And they are the Tr's flavor.

    Another important note confusing many TR players. Their flavor is NOT rate of fire, never has been.
  16. JonboyX

    I think it's pretty simple. Your faction trait is the colour Red.


    Other than that little nugget; seems you guys just get more ammo so you can afford to miss more often.


    From the original game of course, the TR trait was rof (iirc, "fill the air with lead"). Which most of your guns adhere to, to be fair, even if NC/VS have one or two in a similar bracket.
    NC was hard hitting (but we now seem to have elements of "most absorbant" given the aegis and vang shield developments).
    VS was versatility and ease of use. Bit rubbish now ammo is universal, there's no water to float on, and everyone gets jump jets.

    I think each faction has been diluted to help sell more guns.
  17. Hiding in VR

    I agree, the Vanu doesn't have any "abilities" like these.

    Not sure that's what you meant though ;)
  18. Matixzun

    We are the RoF faction, Yet we don't have the fastest RoF weapons. Do you see the problem with SOE's logic?
    • Up x 3
  19. huller

    So what SOE has been saying for the last 10 years is a lie just because you say so?
    • Up x 5
  20. Aegie

    7F and Serpent are two guns with 845 RPM and yes, it's true TR does not have an 845 RPM carbine.

    They do have the 896 RPM Armistice- the fastest in the game.

    Outside the 7F and Serpent, they have the fastest ROF in each other category. Within carbines, TR have the highest average ROF, just like in all other classes.

    TR also have the most ammo in the mag, such that outside of LMGs, all TR weapons have larger mag's than VS/NC and within LMGs they have the highest average mag ammo.

    In all categories but SMGs, I believe, they also have the highest DPS. Outside the SAW, the have the highest damage per magazine.

    These are traits. They are very much there. Anyone can play the kind of "our faction trait is watered down/stepped on" game, trying to compare who has it worst in this regard is not a productive area of discussion.

    Lockdown does seem at odds with certain play styles and that is why it is so unfortunate- basically, if you want to use that ES ability then you have to play a very narrow and fairly boring role (standing still and holding LMB, essentially). So yeah, that should be reworked, or hey maybe everyone faction gets 2 abilities and think of one that would have good synergy with Lockdown.

    There are a few places where the choices for TR, like damage tier / ROF, are more limited than other factions- like carbines- so yeah, making a few new weapons for each category could be a big plus if it can help round out certain areas. Of course, the same is true in other areas for other factions (NC MAX, for example).

    By making this discussion TR only you alienate people who have similar long term complaints about other factions and the attitude that comes across is, I believe, more likely to be interpreted in the negative than the positive.

    In other words, focus on a positive attitude (e.g. we should do this kinds of things because it adds to the game) rather than a negative one (e.g. the sky is falling but I have no constructive input on how to prop it up).
    • Up x 6