Do we need a MAX overhaul ?

Discussion in 'MAX' started by Sofloan, Oct 14, 2022.

  1. Sofloan

    Hello there !

    I've been playing since 2012 and I noticed that the MAX class hasn't evolved at all unlike the rest of the classes.

    No new weapons, no new mecanics and due to the new meta and how the game plays maxes feels like a cheat code to win a fight sometimes.
    And maybe this is just my own feeling but as a VS main, I feel like the TR and NC weapons as by far better, I rarely win 1v1 with my VS MAX against other MAX.

    They're a big menace to infantry and thats verry interesting, the fact you have to have an engineer with you to be repaired is even more interesting. But you can spawn them as hordes to take a too easy advantage over a fight, no real strategy involved, just shoot, walk, die, restart...

    In my opinion, this class has a huge potential to be a precious ressource that you have to take care of on the battlefield, it could benefit from some new max only implant, new arsenal, new abilities (jump pack, suicide bomb...)
    Maybe this can go further with new controler (how the MAX walks and behave), make it a vehicle ? (get in and out ), anything is possible maybe we can discuss wether or not an overhaul is necessary, and what can be done to fix the overpop/zerg strat gameplay we have today.

    Thanks !
  2. TR5L4Y3R

    • Up x 1
  3. Sofloan

  4. Liewec123

    i'd say yeah.
    anti-max power creep and no max changes has led to them becoming little more than 450 nanite cert-pinatas.
    ready to be popped for some free xp.

    if i could change max i'd double their health and remove the ability to revive them.

    for weapons i wouldn't change too much,
    but i'd give gen 1 AV weapons much more reserve ammo (like they used to have early on)

    i'd add new defensive implants,
    such as NC having an implant that slowly regens their health while they have their shield active,
    and TR having an implant that greatly increases resistances while locked down.

    i'd also revisit the abilities,
    make the aegis shield slightly larger, FIX THE BUGS (sideways shield, dying while raising the shield locking all action until relog)
    allow lockdown tr maxes to crouch,
    rework ZoE, (i've been asking for this for 7 years!)
    • Up x 1
  5. Sofloan

    Oh I like it, fully accept the fact that it is a sort of vehicle with the removal of reviving And make it a breacher, a choke point holder.

    I would remove one weaponsized arm, rework the weapons and rebalance the damages.
    The second arm could get some support and defensive tools instead, shield, repair gun, heal gun and anything tool like. While keeping an ability slot for the anchor, ZoE, jump pack and anything you can imagine !

    And yeah ZoE sucks, I main VS for 10years and I never used that ability... or even the MAX suit because it serves almost no purpose on a normal battlefield or while solo.

    I just hope the devs read all these threads, and care about the game... because right now it is quite unbalanced and awfull to play when the alerts are played.
  6. VV4LL3

    Until they address & COMPLETE Development, and Fix the NSO Max... not even hopeful.
  7. Mechwolf

    In Planetside 1, I know VS MAXes had jetpacks, maybe if they were just... very slow jetpacks, they could actually make it work without it being overpowered. If you're using something like a long lasting jetpack, with speeds half that of skirmisher with twice the juice, it could be just useful enough to move the MAX, but without the potential evasiveness that the Light Assault class has.

    There would be people complaining about VS having "magrider-like MAXes" though, i can see the cry posts now.
  8. Mechwolf

    As far as Defectors, I liked their ability to capture points, but I believe the time bomb should be switched, honestly I don't think MAX Rush would be as overpowered if it was just for defectors, in my experience, nobody likes time bomb at all. It just feels useless on PS4, then again we don't have construction, and time bomb probably does damage to structures... right?
    • Up x 1
  9. Mechwolf

    jetpacks on a defector would make it ridiculous, given all of their weapons splash and would now have the ground as a consistent backboard to deal splash damage... hopefully they aren't putting jetpacks on defectors... lol
  10. Liewec123

    Timebomb does the damage of a single tank mine, yup you 'can' use it on construction, but you absolutely shouldn't :p

    Defector needs to be finished and made into a proper max,
    give it a big badass model like the Ymir Mech from Mass Effect,
    Give it actual weapons including gorgons, bursters and automatic weapons similar to standard max weapons,
    Grenade Printer can be given a model and included as a weapon choice.

    and then we can experiment with how to make NSO max more unique,
    I like the idea of NSO max having a shield based health pool like Bionics Implant offers standard infantry,
    maybe 1500 shield and 500 hp (instead of standard 2k max health)
    This will give it superior sustain due to rapid regen while out of combat,
    but also make them super susceptible to EMP, which I think fits the robo theme.
    • Up x 1
  11. VV4LL3

    Precisely!
  12. Shadowpikachu

    Defector is a great mortar unit, highly specialized but very good and unique i'd rather play with that then something more generic or as gimmicky as 'emp kills most of your max'.
    • Up x 1
  13. VV4LL3

    The Defector is severely unfinished though.
  14. Shadowpikachu

    How so, it has a little less than the others because it's new but maxes usually lack flexability anyways compared to infantry, or even tanks i believe.

    A lot of MAX guns are alternates or laughable or just farm only, defector got that done in 3 efficiently.

    Not to mention it uses a potentially more destructive base as a weapon, so giving it more means a lot more then it would normally.

    The suit slots seem good, i get use out of the bomb and healing persoanally.
  15. VV4LL3

    The unit wasn't play tested; much of the feedback from the PTR and even up to this point isn't implemented.

    Every other MAX has a much more effective weapon. That's all people ask of NSO Defectors, something competitive/ comparable to other MAXes.

    There isn't even an actual model for the round -- just a lazy rainbow cube.

    The unit doesn't have a passive like the TR siege mode, or burster MAX damage/ deterrent..

    All the rounds require an arc, which means firing from inside is severely limited, compared to other MAXes..

    You receive maximum splash damage, meanwhile a heavy can use a RPG with minimal damage to themselves, popint blank to your face...

    It's the only MAX with min-range (Detonator), that renders it almost completely useless and defenseless.

    It's the only MAX that damages its own shields with splash damage

    Run speed is slower than other MAXes

    Can't melee something on the ground

    Rounds disappear into water

    AI pathing on the hummingbird is terribad

    hummingbird projectile speed is slower than every aircraft cruise/ non-afterburner speed... added lock on speed makes it ALMOST completely useless compared to a burster, gorgon, ...

    Self Destruct knocks people back, stays on maximum cooldown after rez

    Grenade damage on all weapons isn't comparable to other MAX weapons.

    ...
  16. VV4LL3

    FFS:

    They just buffed NC MAXes for something that should have buffed NSO MAXes as well:

    "MAX
    • Burster flak damage from 28 to 34.
    • Zealot Overdrive's Burster flak damage from 31 to 38.
    • Cone of Fire from 2 to 3.
    • Projectile lifespan from 3sec. to 2sec.
    Dev Note: The above changes increase the MAX's firepower against close-range aircraft, while making them less effective at dispensing targets at very long ranges."
  17. Shadowpikachu

    NSO maxes has a lock on weapon and all the weapon's arc lets you hide from further away and lose 0 dps over range.

    Self damage can be fixed but honestly i think their melee's are still a copy of the default knife so you can 1-2 someone, i swear that was fixed but i swear i've done it.

    It's artillery support, i've killed tanks and people over 80m from a unsnipable position and indoors able to shoot doors again in positions i cant be shot back at, mostly with the Detonator as i have a loadout for indoors and outdoors and outdoors houses my prized Detonator.

    NC maxes are the strongest max though imo, at least the easiest to make work in the most situations.

    For specifics, detonator is for outdoors or when on towers, outright can get 100+m out of it and one shot infantry and quickly kill parked sundys

    The min range is pretty good if you are skilled too, able to dodge the self damage then immediately melee to kill an infantry.

    I just wish it had 1 more shot, i know why it doesnt, this thing is a beast in the right position, i wonder if there can be a system that takes more heat when it explodes properly or something.

    Suicide bomb cooldown on rez is fine, it's kinda a crazy ability especially with the no heat generated, ESPECIALLY if you are in a safe place and you use it to constantly keep shooting, free rez, i'd rather see a big cooldown decrease then a removal of it.

    It's 350 nanites meaning at 700 you can chain pull because sometimes you pull a max 6 seconds before the enemy team does an insane push, they are harder to get rid of albeit extra frail due to missing the suit slots to defend themselves which is really where the frailty lies.

    I'm not arguing dont buff, im more saying you miss half the strengths of it seemingly because you cant sneak up to other maxes and win, even though if at range you probably can do so easily.

    I'd rather it be buffed within it's intent rather than removing parts of it that either keep sanity with the high potential weapon to an entire squad rather then chunking through them one at a time or just fun and intended design/positioning.

    I agree the shield hitbox is so big you probably should get greater damage resist to your own shots, or immunity to self damage outright.

    And i agree the movespeed is kinda jank, MAX movespeed is hard to eyeball in the chaos but i swear i've seen other maxes at full sprint ramp up almost outspeed infantry, it doesn't feel like the defector gets that ramp up to speed over a short period as hard.

    The suicide bomb should have a timer on screen using the ability bar, i think it did before or im just schizoing about it because recent lag made it not work.
    • Up x 1
  18. KEVIN CUEVAS


    Yeah VS Max needs better antivehicle and anti-max. The Comet rounds just feel as slow as the lasher, reload to slowly and way too weak. TR Max dominates midrange ground with grenade launchers and even the Mercy Max can kill other maxes. Reminds me of the first game where TR maxes just had such high rate of fire even their anti-infantry functioned like anti-material weapons and they used them to shoot down aircraft. NC Maxes have good shields, dominate close quarters because shotgun spread at close range creates a similar advantage to TR high rate of fire. But the VS max feels more like you want to avoid MAX vs MAX fights without backup because the comet is so slow in all respects, the only viable option becomes Gorgon and the railgun, and I just don't feel like VS MAX role should be dominating only long distance charge shot railgun. They should have a better anti-vehicle/anti-MAX push weapon for supporting a squad against armor - or - their weapons need to be buffed like more rounds or faster reload or faster projectile speed (though obviously not all of these because that would be unfair for other factions).

    Another option you can make the debuffs on Zealot Overcharge less risky because there is no point in doing more damage if you can only fire like 2 shots that cant even kill a Flash with anti infantry, VS MAXes are already squishy so why make them even squishier? I think giving them Jetpacks like before instead of overcharge would at least justify the squishiness. If the VS MAX isn't able to push through even low BR MAXes then it should make up for in increased agility and have niche that isn't hiding just behind rocks getting runover by quads and losing to shotgun MAXes at midrange. It doesn't need to fly like Light Assault but really it needs a role similar to other MAXes in that they have niches in room clearing because they are the armor in most base captures, but are only somewhat vulnerable and slow by themselves. Something about it just doesn't flow, feels like VS weapons are too nerfed but when I switch factions people drop like flies even with basic newbie weapons. Lasher just aint what it used to be and its a bit sad because I almost never see it being used where it used to have a niche.
  19. The Wolf

    That is because the only viable classes currently within the game are actually the Light Assault which are not suppose to have the Rocket gun because this took away from the Heavy Assaults and their RPGs. Then you got them having C4 which they shouldn't have at all its not a front line fighter and wasn't meant to go toe to toe with a Heavy Assault let alone a max or vehicle. Infiltrators have gotten out of hand with the player base as majority play this. Really the rest of the classes kind of become useless other than medic/engineer. Max was suppose to be great for anti infantry/Bio lab or tight space base fighting.

    I remember when we had no walls and had to fight off enemy vehicles face to face. It took a lot of strategy and placement to get things to work out. Plus the player skill to really put it all into a win or loss. I even remember being able to knife Maxes. The other issues are these NS weapons. They take away the point of a factions weapons as we said in the beginning of the thought of them.
    • Up x 1
  20. VV4LL3

    NSO MAX CANT EVEN SHOOT UNDERWATER

    God I despise how negligent the devs are with regards to NSO.