I was reading a whine thread in general and it made me think a little about the role that infiltrators play in battle. Specifically cqc battles need some adjusting. I think the decoy grenade could be redone a little to be more useful. So here's my thoughts. With recent changes infiltrators are a noisey breed. We make specific sounds wherever we go. Our decoy grenade doesn't make sense. It plays random carbine noises coming from a noisy infiltrator which makes no similar sounds. I propose it changes to making the cloak on and off noise as an infiltrator of the grenadier's faction. This will allow infiltrators to use it for deception. Another thing which could be done which would greatly aid the infiltrator in a deception role would be adding a tool slot item which creates a beacon that makes the infiltrator's cloak noise whenever the infil who placed it cloaks or uncloaks. This would allow us to sow confusion in smaller battles. It would also allow us to give opponents additional beacons on their minimap so friendly infiltrators motion spotters may stay out a little longer. See where I am aiming here? We are portable dart spammers or dead weight stalkers when we go near the point. SMG infils can be pretty good if the player has aim or situational awareness, but they aren't any better off than the same player playing a heavy or medic at killing things. The proposed ideas I have here could give us a more active role, diversion.
i think the decoy grenade should deploy a fake spawn beacon. might only work outside, but it would be way better than the almost completely useless ones you have now.
I tried using them this morning and they actually worked. I accidentally had them equipped after testing them last night. Anyway it was pretty hilarious and they did actually cause enough confusion for me to kill a couple enemies. Reliable? Specifically tactical? Absolutely no way, but hilarious and defo causes confusion. They need some work but have potential. I'll leave it to Rohxer to post the results we found for the Decoys.The finer mechanics of how they work are not exactly how you would initially expect.
Actually Stalker infiltrators can be devastating if played with a GOOD squad. You can do so many things to help your team gut the enemy forces with timed sneaky beacon drops. Pull battle sundies and flank armor. Peekaboo 11 HA's from a terminal hack and sundie up their rear. Sure there is obvious recon roles but I would hardly consider myself dead weight on a point. On hilarious example was a "barn" type point hold where we had many open windows. Squad communicated they would not stand in LOS of it, and I literally sat cloaked in the damn window letting enemy nades bounce off my invisible body. The enemies didn't figure it out. Hilarious , when they tried to max crash us towards the end of the hold, I uncloaked and emp double cookied the bottom door. Boom no medic / engiee support. GG that Max crash didn't get far.. Stalker cloak is perfect for preventing backrage, and regardless of what type of cloak your using, having an infiltrator around permits them to orbit your squad and protect them. No other class can pick and choose their fights like we can. Its not about being more beefy then the enemies its about making the right moves and preventing catastrophe. We are like the good friend in left for dead which is ever vigilant and closes the damn doors behind their group. Anyway I like most of your post, and you have GREAT ideas, but I think people just need to buckle down and apply themselves to learning how to stalker infiltrator better instead of just saying its dead weight. I must admit its taken me a long time but I am starting to feel just as deadly with the crossbow as I would be with the NS-7 PDW as example. I don't think its possible for me to go back to SMG now. So much freedom exists with stalker, and so many opportunities. Its even more awesome if you play with a consistent group of people because of what you can enable them to do.
the wall climbing BS needs to be fixed, but other than that your video had some pretty awesome infil play.
Stalkers are beautiful opportunists - with the ability to hit, run and re-position to generate more opportunities. This is before we consider the advantage of a near-invisible eyes for the squad/platoon on TS and the joy of running rampant along the back lines. Sure, another cloak type can set you up but sooner or later the word will get out and folks will come-a-hunting you. Which is where the Stalker also shines - minimal sound-cues - making finding you a PIA. Stalker, AP Mines, Regen, Nade Bandoleer and EMP - it's a lovely setup that, when used intelligently, is a boon to the platoon.
I appreciate everyone's feedback. I realize that I threw stalker cloaking under the bus in my original post with intent to make a point that it is not generally recognized for its worth in the general squadplay. Quite the contrary to the impression that I gave indicating that they are dead weight, I think many battles have been won through creative flanking and proper defense of the objective with the motion spotter or sensor darts, as well as Intel provided externally by stalker infiltrators. Being that I love to use the crossbow over using the commissioner while I stalk I also hesitate far more often than is necessary resulting in very low cert gain with the set up. It is usually totally fun though so its still worth doing, at least as long as I don't get squad flak for my low killing ability. I just hate to see abilities with great potential being largely ineffective because of beta design decisions which were never updated when it was shown they were lacking.
No worries. TBH I think allot of it has to come down to a larger communities poor perceptions of infil's and to a worse extent stalker infils based on their own ineptitude. If random HA / dedicated engineer pulls one and decides he can't wreck face with stalker then it tends to stick out in their minds as less useful. I honestly don't know how you guys tolerate the general pick up squads. As far as a "working knowledge of Decoys go - The player will throw a decoy grenade outwards like normal... however upon key press there is a dot revealed on the mini map which travels in a line to wherever the nade makes contact with the ground. After the decoy hits any surface it activates "confuse mode" and enemies will see the same little dot take a new direction. Its linear and goes in a straight path, and makes no account for walls or objects in the way. Whats more interesting is that if you have many enemies watching the lure, each person is going to see a different pathway so they can all chase something totally different. Any good infiltrator or player with map reading abilities will figure out soon that its a trick. You might fool them once or twice but prolonged usage tends to be ineffective. This is especially true when trying to trick other infiltrators who have motion spotters. The traveling dot will never be "spotted" so its easy to tell on the mini map that its a fake if you try and use decoys near enemy motion spotters. In general the dot is pretty derpy, you can't control where it goes beyond the initial throw, and just based on the fact it makes in a straight pathway through buildings rocks and trees its easy to determine its fake. Originally I had plans to use the dot to simulate a fake push on a door so my squad could breach in another location. This cannot be done, because even if you tossed 4 nades as a distraction you have abolutly no control as to where those dots will go, or what the enemy will see. So yeah, I agree the decoy nades could use some work. Oh yeah not to mention you give away your position on the initial toss lol.
I agree. Also i would hate if it would make cloaking noises. I absolutley don't want the enemies to start spamming darts and watching for cloaked enemys. xD
I would certainly take a AngryBeaver stalking in any squad i was leading. If a Stalker understands the role and isnt just trying to hide in a corner and ninja a couple of free kills they can provide massive amounts of information that would othrewise be unavailable to the squad. Recon is not just spamming darts or dropping a ground willy its communication.
oddly enough i had a dream about useful decoy grenades recently. -big AOE from impact area -simulates point caps -simulates players on the map in combat -simulates objective hacks -simulates footstep noise -simulates vehicle locations(possibly masking actual locations) objectively speaking it allows an infil to misdirect a bunch of different ways at once(usable in small AND large skirmish). should probably reset duration when another is thrown and keep a long effect timer. maybe one day when i'm running around in my infil night onsie, i won't make as much step noise as a heavy.
