Daybreak nerfs stuff that doesn't cause balance issues, ignores balance issues

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Sprant Flere-Imsaho, Oct 11, 2018.

  1. strikearrow

    Not really - spending 750 nanites to OHK a tank is fair - after all 2 c4 sticks can already do that for a lot less. But your post really doesn't address my point that DBQ lacks the brains to properly balance by changing stats and changing nanites takes much less brains. Simply pull up the time in use vs. kills/damage/exp per time stats on different vehicles/loadouts/weapons and shift the nanite cost based on those.
  2. Ragnarock


    Not the same thing. C4 is a big gamble, yes, sometimes you will get the drop on an unsuspecting tank crew, but 9 times out of 10 you will die a very hot death.

    Though If I had the ability to spend 750 nanites to OHK a tank from the safety of range, that would be a total game changer.
  3. OgreMarkX

    I wasn't aware that DBG nerfed wraith flashes. If so, it was LOOOOOONG overdue. Holy hell annoying and lame.

    Good job DBG.
    • Up x 3
  4. Blam320


    Careful. The Wraith mains will come down on you about how "It's a suicide mission" or that "It's only getting nerfed because the Starfall is OP".
  5. Villainous Hydrosa

    I won't really put out my opinions on the C4 and Flash nerfs, but on a personal note, I've never really had any issues against Mjolnirs. I don't know if the devs plan anything for it, but they have posted the following on the PTS patch notes.

  6. Scroffel5

    In my OPINION, the Flash Cloak and C4 did have a problem. People with Renegades would be so hard to find when they were on that Flash and as soon as they appeared, they were gone. And idk what the nerf to C4 was, but it was very much so needed. This is all just my opinion.
  7. frozen north

    Personally, I think C4 is where it should be against armour. Actually, C4 versus tanks has never been something I have found issues with. Sundies are a bit of a different story, but since they now have that deployed armour thing, their fine.

    Unfortunately, infantry remain the issue, particularly regarding MAX suits. A 0.4 second delay is sadly, not enough against infantry, and about the maximum fair value against armour. Blast radius's have to stay, because of various reasons ( namely engine mechanics regarding explosions).

    But MAX suits still have issues here with getting nuked by C4. Especially TR and VS MAX suits.
    • Up x 1
  8. tommyrocket

    Sure, you'll feel that way when you're not using one/never used one. Now try to be the one using it and see how crappy it feels.

    I've personally seen better reactions to this subject on Reddit than here-- folks actually talking some sense on there. People here just spout "YES!!!!111" without realizing they've never used it before and don't know where we're coming from. Checked your stats and you've never used a Renegade, and only 18 kills with the Fury-F... really not enough experience with the stuff to see it from any different point of view, huh?

    There's a pattern to these circumstances. Folks who like the nerf have never used a wraith flash more than a few times. Look past the pointless bias, and try using some of the things you 'hate'. It's actually pretty fun. Well, it 'was'. It's a PvP game where nothing is fun on the receiving end, so just use whatever you like.
    You don't exactly have much experience with the Flash, either. Yeah, I'm calling you guys out on it. Sorry, but I have to as it's relevant, so don't hate me for it.. :( It's important for people to first test & use said utility/item/whatever after a change before being able to discuss it with any merit. Kind of like how you can't go telling the military/political leaders/etc. what to do or how to change before you've done it yourself for as many years as them, just as an example.

    Of course people who don't use the things they 'don't like' will be super happy about the nerfs. You have to stop to think about how heavy-handed the nerfs are, though. It's not about the OP weapons being used, it's about the cloak nerf by itself. I challenge each of you to try using it now with any of the weapons. If you ditch the bias, you'll agree that 25% cloak drain on use is just stupid.

    What they really should have done was given it the Minor Cloak treatment, where there's a delay before you can fire your weapons after uncloaking. This would slightly mitigate the high-ping advantage some players have when using cloak. They could also make de-cloaking the flash a lot louder, even though it's already plenty loud as-is.
    • Up x 1
  9. Blam320


    I'm sorry, but wasn't the energy capacity also increased, offsetting the activation cost?

    Also, try getting one-clipped by a cloaked Deci+Fury flash from behind whilst in a Lightning or an MBT.
  10. tommyrocket

    Yeah, it was... but the main issue is how long it takes for the cloak to regenerate still. Activating cloak 3 times at the moment is about all we can do. (unless you remain uncloaked for extended periods) Activating at 25 ~ 26% brings it to near zero, so it would end again, so you have to wait a while for it to recharge. The full cloak time is about the same as it was before, but only if you start to cloak and drain it all the way. If you uncloak at any point and re-cloak before letting what was used recharge, it makes the total cloak time much shorter than before. You either get 35 ~ 40 seconds, or like 10 seconds depending on what you do. (rank under max or maxed)

    That's mostly why I suggest the minor cloak-type thing. If you can't shoot immediately after uncloaking, it for sure gives head-on engagements more risk, and sneak-attacks as well so long as the victim hears it. A cloak delay of 3 seconds would seem reasonable-- stuff happens fast in-game. 5 is a bit long tbh.
    Definitely been on the receiving end of the deci+fury combo more than a few times... fortunately it's not a common sight. Still perfectly doable at the moment. The nerf has hurt mostly solo players, deci combo should work fine, just as it does with a cloaked ANT. Even an infil and a buddy with C4 can do quite a bit of instant damage, but that's probably beside the point. If I survive the attack now, they don't get away... haha.

    I mean, we all know teamwork is OP. ;)
  11. Blam320


    How exactly has the nerf hurt solo players?
  12. tommyrocket

    Well, before, solo wraiths had less exposure time due to being able to re-cloak after 1 second. A duo did and can still do devastating damage with a heavy, etc. on the back. Now they just have to make sure they ensure the kill or they both die. Now that solo wraiths have even more exposure time after they uncloak, (plus limited subsequent cloaks) the nerf indeed hurts them in that way. They can't just cloak away and return to do as much or more damage than a duo, without the duo part. I kinda thought this part was obvious, though.

    While this part "They can't just cloak away and return to do as much or more damage than a duo, without the duo part." is a good thing, I do still think it needs to be dialed back a bit as they went too far.
  13. Blam320


    I disagree. While it might feel heavy-handed, the nerf to the combat effectiveness of the cloak was absolutely necessary. It should promote smarter use of the cloak, and hopefully allow other Flash metas to develop.
    • Up x 1
  14. adamts01

    I think the Flash needed some tuning, but this was a terrible change. It was really fun managing your cloak, picking a target, and working with your teammate to get a kill. There just wasn't enough of a chance for the tank. A one second delay per passenger till guns come online after turning visible would maintain that playstyle, but give an aware tanker a chance. This latest change still allows an instant kill on a tank, while managing to sap most of the fun out of the Flash. It's just a bad move. Like most things, the devs never understood this playstyle, and managed to come up with the worst nerfs imaginable. Pretty similar to what they did with tank vs tank combat as well as air and harassers.
    • Up x 1
  15. Blam320


    And you're accusing them of not understanding the playstyles why?