Cloaking takes away the fun

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by McMansikka, Oct 19, 2021.

  1. brutes359


    That's what I was suggesting. The anti cloak trap though might be a bit useless. if your talking about it acting like a mine....then your better off just using a mine. But a persistent field? much better. Good for fortifying points and getting a good counter to cloakers on the offense. That still leaves a counter to snipers though, and that is more complicated. I do like the idea though of anti cloak granade launcher rounds. it would offer an interesting alternative ammo type.
  2. Somentine

    Monthly Infil thread quota being met.

    No, darklight is not a counter, at all.

    No, adding band-aid mechanics to 'fix' the infil issue is bad.

    Old game with a relatively small dev team; the game probably isn't going to get big mechanics changes, which unfortunately means the best you do get are those bad band-aid mechanics.

    The biggest problem is the idea that cloak is a good mechanic in any PvP game. If you could somehow compile and sort through all the posts for complaints/balancing on invisibility, stealth, or cloak, it would blow any other general mechanic out of the water. Either it is not fun to play as or against and/or it is too strong/weak. It's honestly just a bad mechanic for PvP (and even some PvE/single player games) and just a general balancing nightmare.

    There are a lot of problems with Infil, and how they can basically make or breaks fights as much as Medics (which also need to be looked at), but for cloaking specifically it needs to be changed to be an out of combat ability; it should be an ability that gets you in place safely.

    The first thing would be to make cloak infinite, but have a large number of downsides:

    Buffs:
    - Infinite cloak time (or make it pretty long ~30 secs)
    - Remove health reduction
    - Make all visibility as if they were staying still, crouching
    - Fix NSO cloak, as it sticks out way more than others
    - Allow hacking while cloaked

    Nerfs:
    - Long CD after de-cloaking (10-15+ secs)
    - Taking/dealing damage disables the ability to cloak for a short time (1-2 secs), (dmg doesn't break cloak)
    - Device that requires you to activate cloak (switched to), and has a short held activation/de-activation time (1.5-2 secs)

    Re-works:
    - Stealth slots need to be re-worked completely.


    What this would do is remove client side bs, remove the absolutely obnoxious defensive repositioning, and introduce real counter-play (even with client side delay) to infils. It would also remove a lot of the inconsistencies in invisibility states, and have it truly function as an infiltrator. It still allows hill-top snipers, or for an infil to get into a good (read: boring but safe) position, makes infils less squishy by default, and also give infils the time to pick targets in CQC.


    For vehicles, I really don't know what to say other than delete cloak for them. You either need to re-balance a whole wack of stuff, or just remove the most broken aspect. Seems like a very easy choice to me, as cloaked ant and flash add basically no value to the game.
    • Up x 3
  3. OneShadowWarrior

    I’ve been saying for years that infiltrators and cloaking are way out of hand. They were better in the first Planetside. Hacking, sneaking around laying mines even the wraith had no weapons but it stayed invisible even when parked and you put stuff in the trunk, emp nades actually jammed vehicles where weapons were inoperable if a cloaker didn’t hack the vehicle and drive away with it. Even the sniping and submachineguns is overboard. Funny how they removed shotguns right away in Beta testing with cloakers. What a world it would be if you could actually see the person trying to snipe or knife you. We used to have darklight implants in first PS to counter these sneaky beasts.
  4. Exileant

    :( The cloaking times WERE increased. Our cool down is far too long as it is. That is part of the reason Flashes have turned to going after people. If our Cloak were instant, we would be far more inclined to hunt larger pray. I used to relentless stalk M.B.T.s. It took a while to kill them, but it was possible. NOW, however it is just not possible to battle a tank in a real fight anymore without an INHUMAN amount of skill or help. :confused: It takes way too long to cloak and you are an easy one hit kill. It is not over powered on any of the vehicles. For one thing, you have access to them too; and I guarantee if you tried to use them, you would be beyond dead so fast and so often, the respawn tubes would try to ban you for flagrant abuse.:D Hahaha! Flash riding is not an easy task. :) Granted, T.R.s flash is the best, BY FAR, but even it is one shell away from a sad death.


    o_O If they weaken the Wraith anymore, that is ALL I will use it for, I swear. I will strictly target and run over people with it, because that will be all it would be good for. Cloaking, and staying cloaked. Every Flash driver from here to Nessus will follow suit; and the only person you will have to blame, is yourself.
  5. BlackFox

    One Infiltrator is not really a problem - when they get used like the NC does on Miller it's a whole other story. It feels like those are their main combat class... and fighting 10 to 15 infiltrators in one battle IS impossible, no matter how many friendlies run around.
    • Up x 1
  6. JibbaJabba

    LOL and the "debate" continues. By debate I mean rational players from all classes including many infiltrators contend the cloak is broken.... and people that crutch on it contend it's not.

    This status quo will continue forever and by that metric the cloakers win the argument.

    Dev giving that crossbow to infiltrators was a clear communication from them that they don't see a problem.

    I hope they fix it. I really do. This has been my game for a decade and I've forked over money continuously all that time. I would love to come back. But I'm just not dealing with that BS another second.
    • Up x 3
  7. Exileant

    :confused: It is like you have to be spoon fed answers like babies, :eek: WORK THIS STUFF OUT ON YOUR OWN!!!!! :D By rational players, you mean those who cannot seem to put two and two together because they are too slow to notice the obvious and avoid it, right? Right. So by your logic, if I start saying Heavy assault Crutches on their extra shield, because it makes more resilient (even though it makes them glow like a Search beacon, even at high noon), or the fact that Engineer has a mobile battle turret stronger that a human, (even though it takes an hour to set up and can be fooled or stunned) or a Medic that can self heal at double the speed of an average person, (Even though this only helps if they have time enough to rest and recover) or a Light assault can fly, SPRAY, and can easily kill Maxes and vehicles, (even though the MASSIVE FLAME AND NOISE attracted even the lowest B.R.'s attention and draws their fire) I would be justified to whine? You all turn my stomach, regularly.... :confused: An infiltrator cannot reasonably carry the new bow because the dang thing has an exposed firing chamber and it GLOWS. That means the second you fire at something they will know where it came from AND even if they tried to cloak and run, people could just follow the wisp or dull glow on the ground. o_O You would know this if you all actually PLAYED with the Infiltrator, instead of getting your butts kicked by them and pitching a fit.... I swear you all, see my signature motto and heed it--->
  8. Somentine

    You play on PS4.
  9. Exileant

    :mad: Yes, and it is MADDENING that we get caught up in P.C.'s stupidity. They do not just adjust the whining platform. They screw the game up for everyone. Here on P.S.4-5, we know how to handle basic situations. The enemy rushes with heavy assaults, counter with Engineers and Infiltrators, if you are dealing with 14 of 15 infiltrators, why are you going to be silly enough to call something that can be killed by one? Call a few of the one thing an Infiltrator cannot kill because it has no real weapons to handle them, MAXES!!!! Always have a few medics to revive. If you do not see one, BE ONE!!!! This is BASIC stuff! You learn problem solving in Kindergarten! So many people here just turn off their brains when they turn on the game, and because they do, P.S.4-5 get blindsided by garbage fallout!

    :eek: We already have a watered down version of the game, that the techs ignore to the point of us not getting Turret upgrades, Weapons on sections of our Colossus and holiday horns.... We even suffered through 5 second delays on our Flashes when NOBODY HERE COMPLAINS ABOUT THEM. WE KNOW WHAT TO DO FOR THEM. WHINE WHEN THERE IS AN ACTUAL ISSUE, NOT BECAUSE YOU ARE LAZY AND DO NOT WANT TO ADJUST TO THE BATTLE SITUATION.

    o_O Those who refuse change, DIE, and deserve it.
    • Up x 1
  10. UberNoob1337101

    One thing I'd like to mention is to equalize potato and ultra settings (to be specific, Graphics Quality), I can see cloakers up close while crouched standing on ultra, but can't see them at all on Low. Visibility should be equal on all settings, and cloak visibility on higher settings needs to be toned down a little.

    Visibility of cloak also needs to be drastically increased when infils are behind the skybox, they're completely invisible even at point blank for some reason.

    EMP grenades could cost 50 nanites but not be instant, instead sticking to a surface and pulsing after half a second. Less of an i-win in a straight fight, but more cost effective for flanking big groups, and something you can expect/react to.

    Cloak delay of 0.1 seconds would be pretty good, still gives the advantage if you drop on the target, but isn't as good in a straight 1v1 and gives time to react. Also no "fire while cloaked from my POV" BS.

    My personal fav is having an Engineer in the back with 5 mines or 4 C4, kill every sundy or 2 tanks per pull. Switch class to heavy afterwards and combo Fury + Decimator. Good times.

    Flashes need a TTK rebalance honestly, most rocket launchers, lock-ons and AV base turrets don't one-shot them, and they could use some slight extra damage from Kobalts and Basilisks. Afterwards if cloak took 1-2 seconds to completely cloak your vehicle after activation I'm sure it would be deadly but weak to counters.

    Not the biggest fan of Phoenix launcher flashes as they have really low DPS but nice burst in groups, but Decimator and Renegade flashes are my jam.


    I wonder if IR scopes still seeing cloakers, as well as a reasonable implementation to vehicles would be a good counter. Lock-ons having IR scopes too would be neat.

    This is how cloak works in Battlefield 2142, and it's pretty balanced. AFAIK you also made a fairly loud noise while cloaked at all times, cloak was kinda visible to infantry up close but completely invisible to vehicles. Actually required brain usage as you could only ambush them unaware if you heard them but they didn't hear you.

    Bruh, Miller NC is the pinnacle of cancer. I remember one fight on Hollow Pass, 20 infils redeployed there, pulled a MAX because they have no good way to deal with it and had some good engies in the fight, they got crapped on, then they all pulled 20 A2G ESFs to counter it. There's also half a dozen CQC snipers every time I fight NC.

    Entire faction might as well be a PS2 sweatshop.
    • Up x 3
  11. Exileant

    :confused: If cloaked worked this way, what would even be the point of having it? :D Cloak is not even that bad on Destiny....

    ;) Exactly how the game is supposed to be played. :D Well done on using your brain.
  12. Somentine

    For literally only once in all the posts i've read of yours, I actually agree with some of what you said. Not the rant about maxes or w/e but how PS4 and PC play differently.

    That being said, they should have different builds, and PS4 players shouldn't be on these forums talking about PC changes.

    If only.
  13. Somentine

    There already is a cloak delay, and i'm pretty sure it's already longer than 10 milliseconds. With clientside, you'd need to increase it to almost a second to two for it to be a noticeable delay on the other player's screens.


    Yeah, there are a number of different ways to tweak or change it, as long as the idea that it isn't able to be used as a direct combat mechanic is kept.
    • Up x 1
  14. OneShadowWarrior

    The knifing is annoying because your dead even when you do react as they come running straight at you. I can understand if you gave your back and was caught unaware, but head to head?

    It’s the same with cloaked vehicles, I run people over with a cloaked ANT all the time, the wraith does the same. There is no defense in terms of reaction time.
    • Up x 2
  15. InexoraVC

    Playing infiltrator during non-prime time is a "cancerous" play:
    1. get a flanking position. Quite easy since you can get cloaked to where you want with a minimum risk.
    2. get an easy kill. For me it is just Va-39 Spectre (VS) or SV-99 (TR) is needed with suppressor and aim stabilizer (ballistic computer). Choose targets that are 20..30m away and are busy shooting at someone.
    3. change your position, move 5..7 m, reload, proceed to #2. Restore your shield health behind the nearest rock if required.
    That is all. 4..8 kills streaks per life. An easy mode.

    Does it requires more or the same amount of skill as an HeavyAssault for example ? NO!
    Is it low risk and high reward mode ? Yes.
    Should it stay in the game ? The answer is obvious.
  16. JibbaJabba



    Sorry, not hearing it. The PS4 version has single handedly ruined the PC game balance with their ****** aircraft controls. If you want your own special version where they don't fix anything that's perfectly fine with me. The PC needs the cloak fixed. Period.

    I suppose I agree.

    The changes you suggest are all towards a playstyle that if others found fun they would have already done. The remaining adaptation here is to quit and play another game. That's the one I've chosen.

    Planetside is the one that needs to change before it dies.

    This status quo with the cloak and similar longstanding imbalances is failing.
    • Up x 1
  17. Pandora's Lunchbox

    My original pet hates for cloaks are the flashes and ANTs because there's no vehicular counter to them even though there should be in the interest of fairness. Dropping a few mines and hoping for the best isn't my idea of a fair challenge, especially when it comes to the flashes. We have torches for infantry cloakers that we can actively use to hunt down sneakers. We have headlights on most vehicles that are 95% useless (generously speaking) but they could fill in that niche.

    I know of one player in particular who almost exclusively plays with a cloaked ANT, generally farming huge fights where it's nigh-impossible for them to be stopped by anything. It's incredibly annoying even though it's just this one unemployed 5head bottom-feeding for pad kills.

    One of my more recent pet hates is the Deep Operative implant. Infiltrators were fine before it—you needed some element of skill a lot more to sneak around taking kills here and there without being stopped. This implant just enables even the worst infiltrators (unfairly, I'll add—they should learn from their mistakes to get better) but, more importantly, it gives experienced cloakers a ridiculous crutch to rest on despite the obvious advantage of active camouflage. They were hard to fight in the first place but this implant makes it unnecessarily harder to fight them without ganging up on them.
  18. Exileant

    :rolleyes: Hearing that even less. :confused: P.C. Players on Youtube are and have been for a LOOOOONG time, flying Valkyries with actual HELICOPTER CONTROLS. P.C.'s balance was ruined long before PlayStation got a hold of this game when it comes to aircraft maneuverability. o_O What seems to be the issue is not unlike the one in Destiny. There are weapons people do not use, because they do not agree with the tactics; when they keep getting beat with a certain thing, instead of them going on ahead and using the same thing, or the WISER solution of, taking the time to actively search, ON THEIR OWN (NOT BY BEING A NEWTUBE JOCKEY) for a suitable counter; they think it is acceptable to whine repeatedly until something gets nerfed. Because of my mind set, honestly, in my heart of hearts I do not care how much you nerf something, I will find a way to kill you with it, and I could care less how cheap I have to be in order to do it.

    :confused: The problem with Nerfing is you have people like me. You flat-line the cloak on my flash to the point I cannot fight vehicles, I will attach C4 to it constantly and will not bother with shooting you passed a few shots to ensure the kill. I am still killing tanks with it. ;) You stood a much better chance with me playing hide and seek with you. You could have killed me, or delayed me until a friend could have helped save you. You kill the Cloak on my infiltrator, I load up on sticky I stay mid range well out of rage of a Max or anything else and pelt you with Crossbows and other Mid range snipers at a distance you cannot see me and lay mines in between.:mad: You kill the Cloak on my A.N.T. I will attach C4 to a jet and double up on Nanite boosters and vehicle cost reductions. I play to kill the way I want to kill, but if you start forcing me to kill the way you want me to kill, I will resist and kill you the easiest way I can out of spite.

    My enemy is choice. If you flood the field with too many awesome options, it becomes less about efficiency, and more about style and comfort. Destiny understands that in SPADES. Everything is deadly, and with everything deadly, nothing is really abused. You have "Popular Weapons" but all to often people find out a "Meta" is worth a pack of chocolate smokes. Especially when they get gunned down by the so called worst weapon in the game according to Newtube. Nerfing does not balance, it only forces people to become cheaper. That is why governments do not rush to put out new battle-tech. o_O You put something unstoppable out, your enemy has to counter it. If they cannot they go cheap.
    Insults, to fists, to knives, to swords, to plagues, to guns, to tanks, to planes, to nukes, and right back to insults when everyone is too scared to think straight because so many are dead...

    Wrel understands the art of war.
    • Up x 1
  19. Scroffel5

    How was this the most logical, sensible post you have ever made?

    Exileant makes a point. No matter what you do, there is always going to be either something better than what you like or something cheaper, and people will find a way to use either. Y'know why? Because they have the choice to. You can continue to hate on whatever it is in the game that you wish wasn't there, but because people have choice, because people try to push a meta, because people are gamers, they will always find a way to annoy you.
  20. JibbaJabba

    Sorry, I'm going to interrupt your mental 'bating right there. If all you can do is cheese band basically grief vehicle players then that's pretty pathetic but you do you. People have their own playstyles and there are people far better at this cheese than you doing it already. So spare us your threats about what you'll do next.

    I just want the cloaked fixed and I'll return to the game. Not holding my breath.
    • Up x 1