Carbine Balancing?

This is exactly the point that needs to be driven home.

I look at the TR carbines and the first thought that comes to mind is "Where is my shotgun". For range options my thought process goes "Where is my shotgun with slugs"

On my VS I have the option to use my Pulsar C (which is a damn fine gun).

I think your hypothetical scenario where both players see each other at the same exact time and start firing is an extreme minority. I would say that the overwhelming majority of encounters go one of two ways. Either I crush my enemy taking very little damage in return, or I get crushed and deal very little damage in return. Almost no amount of increased damage would help me either way.

I submit my performance with the Solstice and the VX6-7 as anecdotal evidence. Solstice fires at 100 rounds per minute less than the VX6-7.

SOLSTICE VE3

Kills 1,183

Kills / Min 0.37

Accuracy 24%

Fire Count 63,329

Head Shots 169

Hits Count 15,360

Score 367,954

VX6-7

Kills 1,170

Kills / Min 0.36

Accuracy 24%

Fire Count 59,663

Head Shots 146

Hits Count 14,317

Score 203,859

Lol very nice how the OP gets nothing right.

"Urh durh, it seems to me like the Trac 5 has worse ttk than the other carbines."

Don't bother checking the stats or anything, just commence whine mode right away.

Time to kill depends on the distance + recoil x ROF + attachments + damage drop off + damage per bullet + rof ( Enemy hit box)

At longer ranges weapons with much less recoil and more recoil reducing attachments will have a much shorter time to kill. This game isn't ROF+Damage per bullet = win unless your within 8 meters of your target.

If that was the point made in the first post, it would be more defensible. However, the OP was incredibly unclear as to his criteria beyond vague notions of accuracy and TTK. Any attempt at clearing up the matter for him is simply moving the goal posts.

TTK is TTK. TTK changes if you look at ranges yes, but looking at ranges, bulletdrop, dmg drop etc is pointless, since carbines are not longer range weapons in the first place.

First you say decent vs player, then you exclude random pub players as if they all suck. That in itself tells me your not as bright as you think you are.

People in outfits are like sheep. What best? VX6, I got it cause whatshisname said it was good. Someone else told him it was good and so on.
It's a good weapon no doubt. Does that mean it's better than Serpent. No. Fact is it will put bullets on target as well or better. It'has more DPS at the cost of reload speed. It's your choice. Both are good. I have no issue with reload or mag size. So I Max DPS and do extremely well with it.

Not exactly. There are several differences that make all the difference in the world between these weapons. While TR weapons have the higher capacity magazines, they also suffer from higher horizontal recoil and longer reload times.

Shooters are min maxing, and here is a clear example. You can do well with every weapon, I never said you couldn't. But you will do better (or atleast have the option to to outperform peopel with the serpent).

But the simple fact remains, every stat on vx6-7 are superior to the serpent (with minor stuff ofc), which makes the vx6-7 a better choice all around, (more versitile) and as I listed earlier the difference at pointblank range (where the serpent shines) is 24 MS. Now if you decide to take the lesser gun, thats your business. Cause the balance in this game at the point where the actual difference betweeen guns are so small. With this being said, why would you go for the worse option of the 2? And I especially don't like when people say the serpent is a gem in the VS arsenal, cause it is clearly as every stat states, a worse option than almost every other VS carbine.

And again, you bring in all personal stuff "i do better, dont have problems with reload, i take max dps" and you have nothing to back this up, i have every number I listed. But if you "feel" lik the gun is so much better, then so be it. But don't feed the morons here who call it OP, if peopel want to whine and cry on forums, they better have the facts to back it.

To be honest I find you can't really afford to spray with the TR carbines either. That long reload time can spell death so I find it best practice to not be frugal with shots. And when you factor in the inaccuracy and high horizontal recoil of the weapon I can't really put my faith in a measly 10 extra shots to save the day. I find myself reloading far more times than I ever find myself getting a use out of those 10 extra rounds, simply because I know in a fire fight those 10 rounds aren't going to be enough.

Really, there are few times I ever found myself saying "Thank God for those 10 extra rounds." But there are far too many times I find myself cursing at the reload rates haha.

Whoa did you see that OP? This dude just went up one side of your face and down the other ! So i'll translate. He said you need to get more practice, stand still, and be mindful of the wind when trying to balance a carbine on your finger. This goes for all carbines. And before you come in here saying that its too hard..try nanites first.

Give the Jaguar a try my friend. It's true that you don't get the cool under slung toys but it is very accurate and has one of the if not the fastest rof in the game. It's all I use on my Engineer and it does quite well. It takes down a full health HA in one clip and TTK is only a couple seconds.

Are you kidding me? The Trac5 is a murder machine.

OK, sure the Solstice and AF19 are very accurate (more than they both should be for carbines) but the Trac5 is squeeze trigger = dead.

This thread is full of so many idiots that it's beyond belief. The facts I've read here are laughable.
Let me address some of the deluded points I've read in this thread.

"TRAC-5 has the best DPS"
Now, if only DPS counted for something in this game. I've been over it many times and cannot be bothered to explain it once more, but DPS is useless when comparing weapons in a FPS.

"TRAC-5 has a high RoF and 10 extra bullets. You have it good when compared to VS and NC1!1"
Nonsense. Our faction advantage is nullified by our ridiculous recoil. We need those 10 bullets to even get some bullets on target.

"TR carbines are good in CQC"
I read this argument so often, and laugh at it every time. Maybe that was the advantage the devs intended to give us. But that is gone due to the massive use of shotguns and SMGs.

"The Jaguar/Lynx is good, try it bro!"
How delightful. So as TR I have to get a weapon that costs 1k certs or 700 SC, in order to keep up with the VS/NC starter weapons? I'm not sure, but I think that is a clear balancing issue.

"You have 40 bullets though!11"
Yeah, and nearly double the reload speed of VS/NC. Add that to our ridiculous recoil and it really isn't an advantage.

"TRAC-5 is scoring the best though !11!"
Score Per Hour is a worthless stat, just like DPS. SPH has nothing to do with actual combat in this game.

That's just some posts that I found the most hilarious. Anyone saying TRAC-5 is better than NC/VS weapons is either completely ignorant, or just deluded.

You´re honestly comparing .5s reload times with 10 extra bullets? First of all, 40 bullets a clip allow you to more frequently utilize the fast reload. Also, 40 bullets a clip allow you to easily kill 2 opponents without having to reload inbetween. That´s an advantage that far outweighs a slightly longer reload time and minor differences in recoil.
You TR make it sound like your weapons are super inaccurate and don´t do dmg, when infact they do the same dmg and are just as accurate.

I think the trac-5 from my experience is definately far from subpar to the other carbines because it hits harder than the solstice, is easy to aim correct, has 10 extra bullets in each magazine. and its recoil lends itself to tracking targets going off to the right.

Since when does it hit harder? That's a new one.

Blarg20011 said: ↑

“Truly my biggest problem with TR carbines is their complete lack of variety, every one is 143 damage, all have essentially the same reload, all have 40 rnd magazines, all have .3 vertical recoil, most have .225 horizontal, all have the same recoil decrease, most have the same first shot multiplier (except oddly the TRAC-5 S, which is lowest), and all have almost exactly the same CoF stats. The only noticeable difference in TR carbines is their bullet velocity, and their RoF. In comparison, the NC and VS have a wide variety of carbines to suit the player's style, with different damages, RoF, recoil, and other unique stats.”

Check this out;

Stock (best of all traits): solstice = trac 5
Hipfire: vx6-7/serpent = jaguar/lynx
Burst precision: trac 5 burst = solstice burst
Long range/precision heavy hitters: t5 amc=pulsar C
Special Forces (multipurpose w/barrel launchers): solstice SF = trac 5 S

The NC has carbine equivalents in the same categories. Just showing the VS/TR ones to get the point across.

Still think VS has more variety than TR?

Oh my god, I would trade you any NC weapon for that Trac-5. That thing is a BEAST. How can you even compare it to the Mercenary...

You completely miss the point where the long range VS gun has more damage/shot, compared to the AMC which is the starter gun with a lower RoF. NC have even more variety with 200 damage guns in various categories.