Bullet Recoil Patterns: Do we want them?

Randomness brings a certain excitement to the game.

Though I certainly wouldn't miss CoF while ADS, I understand it's more a noob deterrent and great equalizer at the same time.

Well the majority of this thread's disappointing. Randomness in competitive games is just bad and rewards people to not even try.

No. One of the perks of the VS is that they have a tight sustained cone of fire. Removing cone of fire would only hurt balance. If you are firing at range, you should just burst fire.

When was the last time you played it? Before making my post I actually went and checked. Nope, bloom. No recoil pattern was the same.

Goes GO follow the same mechanics as 1.6?

I fired one shot at a wall in 1.6, and it landed lower left of the centre of my 'cone' within the crosshairs. I moved left, fired another single shot and it landed in another location, to the right of the centre, but still in the bounds of the crosshair.

Oh, right.

So the video you posted where one of the bursts, the second shot went to the left and another went to the right... That's completely predictable? Then when he opened it up, it sprayed all over the place?

Are you sure you watched the video?

The difference is that if the recoil is predictable, you can remove it with a macro that compensates the mouse movement which mean you can put it outside the game files. That makes it a whole lot more difficult to detect since you are in no way injecting code or messing with game files.

A random COF still takes skill to handle but a different kind of skill. You need to burst fire and you need to learn your weapons limitations. COF bloom is one of the ways SOE limits the effective range of weapons. So if you remove it, you'll have to adjust the damage data for every single gun. It's still a matter of skill, just a different set of skills.

CS has some bloom, but its minimal. Basically it always follows a recoil pattern, and each shot always has some bloom.

PS2 has no recoil pattern, just upward kick per shot, and increasing bloom.

Ok, I think I understand what you're getting at now. However, if you're mashing down the mouse button and shooting a whole clip in either game, unless you're point blank then the result will be much the same.

Either game you need to burst to be accurate at any decent range. When recoil pattern starts to matter, you shouldn't have been holding the mouse button down long enough for it to occur. I'd love to see someone compensate for a whole clip of recoil of an AK in CS.

The AK and M4 in CS have predictable and consistent recoil patterns. This is a fairly basic and fundamental part of the game, particularly at high levels of play.

The point of random bloom in games is to narrow the gap between the skilled and unskilled. The more random something is, the less skill comes into play. That's why COD weapons all have random bloom.

Watch any competitive CS game. It happens all the time. Why talk about this if you know nothing about it?

Not going to happen. The randomness is intentional. It is one of the ways that the developer can prevent players who invest a lot of time in the game from 'getting too good' so that newer players stand a chance when they just start playing.

Game mechanics like cone of fire and horizontal recoil are skill balancing mechanics designed to lower the overall skill cap ceiling. Note that games like quake and tribes (which feature incredibly high skill caps) do not have these mechanics emphasized, compared to games like Call of Duty which do.

Being able to move our mouse over some pixels, then press your left mouse-button and move your mouse down is not what I would call high-skill. High-skill is trying to controll something, that isn't really controllable.

Your "CoF randomness" is controllable through burst firing. It adds another layer of weapon control, instead of just bringing in randomness without counter. I see no problem with that

I'm leaning towards the 'bloom is needed' side. Here's why.

A very, very important stat of how a gun handles in this game is the first shot recoil modifier. This modifier is absurdly high in high RoF weapons to discourage them from being too effective at longer ranges as they're supposed to be used for close quarters fighting. The reason for this is the first shot modifier makes burst firing tricky, which in turn reduces the accuracy at range.

If there was no bloom gained from full automatic fire, then weapons would not need to be burst fired, holding down the trigger would be sufficient. Now, since you don't have to burst fire, then first shot recoil modifier is no longer important, making short range carbines very effective at longer ranges, as well as making longer engagements too easy due to the lack of recoil.

Unless you find a way in your system to counter this, I don't agree with your suggestion OP.

There are enough other factors where you can best your enemy with skill in this game. We already have individual recoil directions per weapon and that's enough. Recoil patterns that always stay the same.. that's not how guns work.

Ok, I actually play both CS and PS2 alot. This is the different.

In counter strike.

Your first 2 bullets will hit almost dead center and your third bullet will land very close this is enough to kill someone in counter strike because head shots are much more powerful compared to body shots in this game. After this your bullets start to go all over the place. Even if you are dead on target your chance of hitting the head is almost zero and the chance of hitting the body is low. This leads to a 3 round burst dead on the head almost ALWAYS being the best shot you can possible make. If you miss with that burst it's best to wait a split second and fire another burst because spraying further will do little unless you are at close range

In ps2

You have a bonus to the recoil to your second shot which means your first 2 shots are not ment to hit close to each other. If your first shot hits the head the second one will miss at most ranges even if you are pulling down. Head shots are not as powerful and your spread does not ramp up as much this means there are many ranges where just hosing the body and hoping for some extra head shot damage is better then focusing on the head.

If you think Poker's at all random...

Well, do you fancy a game?

In fact, let's play two games. That way you won't lose any money, right?

*Snigger*

It's funny how CoF bloom and recoil patterns are totally random, yet totally predictable.

IIRC, COD has no COF Bloom when ADS. Recoil and visible idle weapon sway (and lag) are the only factors that affect accuracy when aiming.

Bloom is only a problem for you if you don't have trigger discipline.

Also, some here might want to watch this...