Balance Pass Post 2: Nanoweave and Related Features

A distance limit on sniper rifle head shots is the dumbest thing I have ever heard from the PS2 devs.

In a game that has liberators, mana turrets, lol pods, and HE tank spam from mountains away, you go a take the only long range kill that actually takes some skill and destroy it for no good reason. Don't know if its stupidity or just pure laziness, but it sure is pathetic.

< +1 Vote For Longer Max OHK Range >

In response to the bold above, the thing is that these shots are also exceedingly difficult. Those that don't try to snipe at these ranges don't understand how much skill it takes to be able to predict and place shots at such long range. It is a truly skilled player that can do these sorts of things, and as such, these sorts of shots rarely ever effect players that are doing anything less than afk'ing in place.

How much of the player base can make accurate headshots from more than 150 meters? I would venture a guess at about .5 to 1% [please watch those numbers in particular in your datamining, which would of course require you to test it at 300 meters for a time as well!]. Right now, a sniper can kill someone at 300 meters if they don't have Nanoweave. After the update, that will NEVER happen again, regardless of what suit slot upgrade they're using. So that means that engineers with turrets, which snipers are the counter to, get a free pass 24/7.

Please, bump that range up to 300 meters, at the least, and allow snipers to have a good skill ceiling.

Don't see why everyone is so mad I don't use nano or flak and even if I did they are giving cert refund and it gives resistance to small arm im so using NW now.

I quit playing Battlefield 4 coz sniping was atrociously bad at long range.

150m is a total joke. i play sniper 95% of the time in ps2. i'll probably quit if they nerf the snipers this badly. at 150m your basically in the red danger zone of any assault rifle, who have the advantage of easily spotting u and zig-zagging towards u while u miss ur shot, and ur dead....

It is just for snipers.

How can I tell?

Because NW doesn't matter much, if at all, for other weapons.

Do the math.Then write a 500 word essay apologizing and explaining why you are wrong.

If you want nano-weave to have viable alternatives so people don't always equip it, then don't nerf explosions. Maybe if people needed to take flak to guard themselves from explosions, some of them would drop nano-weave. Making nano-weave noneffective against explosions and then nerfing explosive weapons just means nano-weave will still be the arbitrarily best armor choice.

@Revanmug on targets under 40m nanoweave 5 adds at best .2 to .4 seconds to the already insanely low TTKs of this game. Outside 60m of that the game play gets far more reasonable TTK with nanoweave 5. The issue is to many people haven't mastered recoil compensation, leading, and or Bullet Drop if they figured that out ttk outside of the 60m would change.

@Pikeman agreed about the Explosive, the only way to really discourage zergs is the use of splash based weapons which have been heavily nerfed on weapons they were fine on.

Hi all,

It's been a while since I've been around these forums, and longer since I've bothered to log in the game. The Infiltrator, particularly the sniper is my favorite class in game and I've been waiting for the Infiltrator update to give playing Planetside 2 another shot, but after reading this proposed 'fix' I doubt I will bother trying to play even then. Anyhow, I thought I'd weigh in regardless.

Nanoweave is overpowered. At this point no one with half a brain can argue that it's not. It's better at protecting against explosions than Flak, it protects the user from bullets from all weapons (not just sniper rifles), and with the lack of any other significant upgrade to fill that same slot it's the clear choice for noobs and veterans alike. Nanoweave has needed to be re-balanced for months and its day of reckoning is a long time coming. But this 'fix' is a joke.

Just how many snipers do you think can consistently land headshots at 150 meters or more? 1% of the population? 2%? Newsflash; most snipers are terrible. They're deadweight to their team and would be no matter what class they play. It takes dedication, patience and no small measure of skill to be able to pull that off more than half the time, and most players don't have either the dedication or the patience to learn to do it well. Those few who do have those three qualities deserve to reap the rewards of their efforts, not be crippled and squelched.

The fact that you developers feel the overwhelming and irresistible urge to nerf snipers into the ground in order to pave the way for this necessary Nanoweave balance pass is very telling of your negative attitude towards the class.

What about dying to a vehicle or aircraft that you had no chance to see? What about dying to a mine that you had no chance to see? What about dying to a grenade that you had no chance to see? What about dying to any and all infantry classes who sneak up behind you that you had no chance to see?

If you're going to nerf one source of surprise deaths, nerf them all. Make them all impossible. It isn't fair to go on a witch hunt for one source and one source alone.
But then again, by now I have come to expect no less than this level of bias and prejudice from developers who are only ever on the receiving end of a sniper's scope.

I like the general Idea of this upcoming change for NW armor.

However....
...I have concerns about how this will effect the NC (Primarily) as well as the VS (Though to a much lesser extend).
My main concern is this:

See, the NC are not too accurate, so headshots are FAR less common for us.
As well, the VS are decently accurate at range when bullet drop comes into play, but the TR can just BLAST ammo out of their bullet-hose guns for TONS of headshots if they're within around 75 meters.

While NC do get more dmg, this is by far not enough to have even balancing.
We cannot keep up with our inaccurate small arms weapons.

Now add to that headshots not being mitigated by NW armor, but body shots (The only kind that we can depend on) will be.

See my concern?

Now, here is my proposal.
https://forums.station.sony.com/ps2...-balance-warning-mainly-focused-on-nc.157265/
It's long, but the TL;DR to it is:

SOE could raise the NC damages by one rank (IE, a 143 to a 167, a 167 to 200, 200 to 250)...
BUT, reduce the headshot damage multiplier from 2x 1.5x (On the majority. But not all, some that would be too powerful {IE, the Gauss Saw} and would remain as is) of NC specific weapons.

For the NC, the stats behind killing a target with 1,000 HP (And no NW) would change from:

Current: 6 body shots at 167 dmg totaling 1,002 dmg. 3 headshots totaling 1,002 dmg.
Proposed: 5 body shots at 200 dmg totaling 1,000 dmg. 3 headshots totaling 1,050 dmg.

My idea simply removes one standard shot from the requirement, but maintains the headshot requirement.
As the NC get few headshots, due to their low accuracy, this would help balance them by a small margin without overshooting the power of the buff.

If NW armor DID NOT mitigate damage from headshots, this plan would not function.

As for snipers, simply increasing the headshot multiplier from 2x to 2.5x should fix the problem.
Working with the soon-to-be 25% dmg reduction of nanoweave (Rank 5) and having that mitigate headshots as well (As I suggested):

Bolt actions do....
550 @100 meters, so 2x = 1,100. Minus 25% and you get a reduction of for a total headshot damage of .

But, raise the headshot multiplier to 2.5x and you get...
550 @100 meters so 2.5x = 1,375. Minus 25% and you get a reduction of 343.75 (Rounding to the nearest dmg point up or down will not alter the outcome) for a total headshot damage of 1,031.25 (Rounding the reduction up gets you 1,030, rounding down gets you 1,032),

Still a kill.

But we are not done. SOE wants to limit sniper headshots to a max OHK headshot at around 150m.

So, (Again, if they allow NW to mitigate headshots as is necessary for my suggestion to work):

If SOE lowers the minimum dmg from 550 @ 100 meters (Based on the top tier bolt actions -The NC's EM4 longshot being my basis) to 530 @160 meters.

It will be just enough so that bolt actions will OHK at 150 meters or less, but will NOT OHK past 150 meters.


Please, If you find any flaws in my math or logic, I would love to hear it.
I do value community input.

If you agree or disagree, please, say so and explain why!

150m is reaaally short for bolt actions, especially considering the scopes they get access to.

Wow - really hope they push that up to at least 190 to 200, at least.

WOW this is sooo disappointing.

Clearly the resent 'balance' passes have basically buffed all the 'COD/BF3 infantry classes. Basically people who want ONLY infantry combat and believe ESF's should fight ESF's and tanks should fight tanks, in their perfect world vehicle are their just to provide ambient noise and some drama.

These players support unbelievable nerfs to slow firing anti-tank weapons like the halberd so they cant one hit infantry, they support nerfs to unpopular , tactical and unconventional classes like snipers.

The harasser nerf was understandable, although i have a feeling SOE will over do it, but a sniper nerf, limiting head shots to a 150m?! This is ridiculous, if you don't want to be headshotted dont stand on the top of hill silhouetted against a blue sky standing still while lockons ( like the striker) ...

Does SOE understand that in tactical war games, sometimes you shouldn't have a chance to survive against some enemies? In war games their HAS to be imbalance, certain tactics and units will totally dominate another. BUT some gamer's expect to counter anything. A Sniper is a class is dedicated to excel at eliminating infantry from long ranges, without giving them an opportunity to retaliate unless their position is found ( using a scout radar esf or counter snipers ) . A sniper mainly kills infantry at long ranges and is purely designed for this, i don't understand how some brainless heavy assault has the audacity to think they should be able to counter a sniper in the ONLY environment favorable to it.

This will encourage ALL snipers to basically run around with SMG's and bouncing betties ( is this what you want ?? )

AND btw SOE they can be detected, every time a sniper fire they appear on the mini-map.

Also this is balanced by the fact when they are out of mini-map range, head shots are harder to get a longer ranges. Furthermore how often does infantry render beyond 150m ? When it does, please let snipers get 1HK headshots... this is a joke.

-1 to 3 extra bullet to kill can mean alot. It also even better as a HA + resist shield.
-Surviving an explosion that is balance around 1000 health and having more than that is alot.

As for flak armor, what are you scare to die from?
-Tank? They require direct hit to kill you anyway. Flak won't help you.
-Pod? You are bad if you die form that UP weapon.
-Fury harasser? Against a uncerted fury, it will help. It won't against a 9 nade one or a Marauder.
-Nade? You are blind.
-Noobtube? Avoid shielded area. You know there is at least one of them siting there.
-RL? Direct hit kill you anyway.
-C4? You'll be dead if you sit on one anyway.

You are plain dumb.

Nobody has a perfect accuracy meaning it can be higher than that. The other thing that you seem to forget is... Why use flak? Most explosive damage can be avoided. More importantly, most of the deadly explosive damage can be nullified with NW while also giving you other benefice.

I might agree if Pre-nerf Pods, HE, Heat and nades were back but this is not the case. Most of the high AoE weaponry are either weak as balls or spammy enough that your precious flak won't save you.
*Glare at Fury/Marauder*

I agree. You made a very good point. 90% of my deaths due tosnipers are when I stand in front of enemy spawn rooms carelessly or when I stand in front of vehicle terminals too long. It's already quite hard to hit moving target's head at 200-300m. If a sniper can hit a moving target's head at 200m+, he deserves to get the kill.

I like everything here save the lack of headshot protection, especially with all those players who seem to be able to go straight for the head....

I do very much like this - anyone who doesn't like the new nanoweave doesn't have to use it!

“Dying to a sniper that you never had a chance to see is a poor gameplay experience for everyone on the receiving end.”

WRONG- Where did u get this information? There are plenty of times i get killed without a chance to see who killed by and I dont care. Are we going to nerf everything that does this until everything shoots nerf darts ?

Nanoweave = <3 everything about that

We will be giving a cert refund when this change goes live. You can choose to repurchase Nanoweave Armor or spend their points elsewhere.!!!!!!! <3<3<3 your learning!!!


Bolt-Action Rifles
how hard would it be to scale down the lancers trail effect? that seems to be pretty good at pointing its self out to the rest of a hex why not use that on the sniper shots, we have medics its not like a 1 shot head shot is sending you back to the warpgate, hell it doesnt even effect your k/d if your near a medic like you should be. when you factor drop and travel time even as a non-sniper when i get head shot its my own damn fault and they deserved the kill


Explosions Post-Nanoweave Change
id actually like to see more emphasis moved back to flak armor. could we hold off on reducing the explosive damage until a little after the nano-weave change?

It does not makes sense to Buff flak (by nerfing its competitor) and nerf AOE in the same patch!

Wait and see how more flak upgrades effects AOE first!!!

You can check/test ranges by using waypoints. Right click on the map or minimap.

What the ****? 150 meter limit on sniper rifles for HEAD shots? This is so ******* stupid. I just reinstalled your game yesterday, time to uninstall again. The game is dying so fast with people constantly leaving. Good job running it into the ground even faster.

And so the lone infiltrator, sitting cloaked on his hill three hexes away from any fighting vanishes in the night, like tears in the rain.