Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by VinLAURiA, Jun 2, 2013.
Snipers insist there should be no counter to them, so this thread was bound to cause an argument.
Yeah... but the IRNV is all the way better in many other circumstances. For example it's crosshair is the only one who is always clearly visible and do not obscure it's target. Also, the bullets flies from the center of the crosshair (just as if it was mounted inside the barrel) which allows you to fire from places where using other scopes would result into a barrier or a console...
Pros and cons, my firends, pros and cons...
This isn't about snipers, it's about infiltrators. The guys that actually try to infiltrate with the few bad tools and mechanics given to them that is. You wouldn't see a sniper with an NV scope anyway because they usually out of effective range of the scope.
I've had a few run ins with the old IRNV scope myself, turned a corner and cloaked, crouched and stood still. The guy came around, looked me in the face, looked around and then scoped in to shoot me before I could uncloak. That certainly wasn't good game design and made infiltrators even more pointless than they are most of the time.
With that said, IRNV scopes are cheap and their only right to exist comes from smoke grenades. Other than that I just run with holo sights on everything and keep my eyes open. No need for cheap aiming aids.
I'd rather see the IR/NV feature make a comeback. The cloak's not there to help you sneak right in front of people. By then, you would've already broken the first tenet of infiltrating: Don't move in plain sight. You want to move out of sight. Of course, you don't need the cloak for that. The cloak aids you when moving in one's peripheral sight where you're slightly out of focus thus much harder to spot than if you didn't cloak. (The second use of cloak is at long range sniping, but then at that range IR/NV doesn't render people.)
Hence, reintroducing the IR/NV feature doesn't affect good infiltrators who actually follow standard infiltration tenets. It only punishes those that breaks them.
It's hilarious how there's so many people that completely failed to read & understand the OP's post xD
I see stealth as an aid to infiltration, not a guarantee of infiltration. Just like an engineer / medic cannot always outrepair / outheal damage.
As has been pointed out in this thread the IRNV scope has a significant range limitation so people using them to counter stealth would sacrifice their longer range use.
With each other class ability the enemy has the ability to beat it. E.g. You outdamage a healer / repairer or focus on the healer / repairer. Stealth also needs to be counterable by enemies, it cannot only be broken if the stealther makes a mistake.
Imagine if you could only outdamage a medic if the medic made a mistake.
Imagine if an engineer could outheal all damage on a MBT unless he made a mistake.
wtf are you talking about. Approach another unit frontal at ranges 0-20m cloaked.....the infiltrator is ALWAYS spotted. And there is already a counter to infiltrators sneaking around in your base....it's called sensor darts.
BTW.....I use the NV-scope myself. It's already better in every aspect than the 1x/2x scopes.
Nope. That's the penalty you get for using an all seeing scope.
Approaching in plain sight would be making a mistake, which is exactly what I said would fail.
The counter to infiltrators is infiltrators? Wonderful...
Every aspect except all of the ones outside of its range where you could still use a reflex sight.
You must be bad if you need a scope to be able to see an infiltrator.
Protip: Turn your graphics down and you will always see them.
yeah, like your team fails, when no one spawns a medic or a engineer to repair the Max units.
It's even more hilarious asking for a 30 cert scope to negate an entire class ability. Much like it's hilarious that on low settings you can see them anyhow.
Hey luperza, when was it you said SOE was working on the fix for this? 5 months ago?
With a range of barely 65 meters.. and if I noticed right, sensordarts don't spot cloaked infiltrators. At least for me it never worked, but I might be wrong there..
blah, blah.....they do. They spot any moving target cloaked or uncloaked.
I think having your targets light up like christmas trees is a fair tradeoff to not being able to see infiltrators while scoped-in. You know, you either wouldn't see them anyway with IR/NV at long ranges, or you could hipfire at close ones so only way you're gimped is midrange.
IR/NV scope range is fine as-is. It's only good out to about 50m (or thereabouts) which means anything past close/mid range work, it's a detriment rather then a help. Once you start getting towards the outer range, player silhouettes become fainter and fainter and harder to spot.
A good fix for the cloak being 100% invisible to IR would be to make it show up as a normal player silhouette, but with only 10% opacity. Which would make it invisible out past 20m range, but visible close-in.
(And most of my cloaker kills are because they were moving. Movement catches the eye and gives me something to investigate.)
You've CHOSEN to use the IR scope for all its manifold advantages, you have to take the good with the bad. A 30 cert scope negating an entire class's main ability is ridiculous and you know it. Don't ADS when you hear cloaks.
No to being able to see infiltrators with NV or Thermal!
..... It's funny, I did THAT exact thing as an Infiltrator on Mattherson last night against a VS squad.
It was at least 5 to 1 and a half dozen vehicles, and I still managed to delay a base cap until reinforcements arrived.
A determined Infiltrator is a force to be reckoned with.
Since the cloak was improved to the point where no small arms HS/NV scope or vehicle IR or Thermal scope could see a cloaked infitrator, the class has received a few added upgrades such as low TTK SMG options and the ability to cloak a heavily armed ATV.
Not only will it cloak the vehicle, but also any armed passenger that is in it.
Furthermore, the duration of the vehicle cloak is added to the individual cloak as they don't draw on the same powersource.
This means that we recently saw the infiltrator class become more front-line active. With the 35-40 secs of vehicle cloaking, they carve wide swaths of roadkills with the ATVs, they also sneak up close to infantry in the field and SMG/Knife their enemies to death.
I have no issue with any of that. It's good to see this class offer a wider array of play-styles instead of the archetype distance sniping role that this class has in most ganes.
However, I do feel that the cloak is perhaps a little too effective. First of all, the so-called "pro tip" of dialling down graphics really has no bearing on the issue. Surely it's not intended either. But who would sacrifice graphical fidelity just for that. So we have to look at the ability without this "trick" in mind.
I don't ask for much: Leave everyting the same, with one exception - make the turning ON of the cloak take 3-4 more seconds. Turning it off can still be instantaneous, to not give up ambush-advantage (it's noisy anyway) but make turning it on take a little longer so that discovered infiltrators can't insta-cloak and sidestep.
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