[Suggestion] Allow LAs to equip AP mines

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Campagne, Jul 31, 2020.

  1. Campagne

    If they can have C4 they should get anti-infantry mines as well.

    I don't see why not when C4 is allowed.
    • Up x 1
  2. Demigan

    It would certainly reduce the amount of C4-wielding LA's, which would make a lot of people happy. I would definitely bring some anti-infantry mines for a lot of my fights, as the LA is a perfect behind-the-lines saboteur.
    • Up x 1
  3. Twin Suns

    If the LA gets AP mines? Then my infiltrator should be allowed to use shotguns. That seems fair.
  4. Demigan

    AP mines on LA's arent even remotely as powerful as shotguns on Infils. Infils are the only class that can mitigate almost all of the Shotgun's downsides and actually start combat within effective range. It would not be fair, and you also have to wonder about your logic: You seem to say the LA would get something "belonging" to the Infil and therefore the Infil should get something from the LA. But what would the poor Engineer get then? Its twisted logic.

    You have to look at the class and its roles. The Infil and LA are both great at flanking and rear-lines sabotage with their own strengths and weaknesses. The LA class could use an AP mine without the Infil losing any of its strengths or usefulness.
    • Up x 2
  5. KhlorosTesero

    If LA get AP mines, i say heavy assaults either get access to the Assault rifles and or carbines.
    • Up x 1
  6. Money

    I remember in beta or shortly after launch when Infils got shotguns. Good Times!
    • Up x 1
  7. Demigan

    Why? HA's already are the most used class in the game because they are the best or second best for almost all common tasks in the game.

    If anything the Engineer and Medic should get access to almost all weapon types. LMG's, Battle Rifles, scout rifles, auto and semi-auto sniper rifles. These classes miss the advantage of overshields, stealth or mobility and could use the full range of weapon options to make them an easier choice for any battle.

    Whats with people getting so antsy about the LA potentially getting an upgrade and asking for uprades that are just aimed at overpowering themselves?
  8. nagibator

    change c4 ability for infantry mines will be fair. av rocket launcher is enough
  9. Jryder

    Carbines, please!
  10. pnkdth

    C4 has to be placed and detonated with timing and precision. AP mines you can just run back and forth between terminals (of which the LA does quicker than any other class) and chuck 'em in for ultra easy mode kills. Super express pizza delivery. Plus, it would make battles horrible for everyone else which is not what PS2 needs. It would surely be an easy way to purple the AP mines but the price would be a horribly frustrating experience for non-LA players.

    "I don't see why not when C4 is allowed." For the same reason infiltrators do not have C4. Each class has a mechanic which would break those weapons. Infiltrators would be able to comfortably deliver and detonate C4 just at the right moment due to their cloak and LAs have their jetpack for efficient delivery of mines.

    edit; my quotes are derping out.

  11. Campagne

    Timing and precision? For C4? No way man! I knew how, when, and where they were coming to and from. The mines only cover a small spot while C4 has a much larger blast radius and can't trigger too soon by itself.

    And how would any of this not apply to C4? The current "super grenade" known for cheap and easy kills?

    What I'm looking for is the ability to drop mines in places where engineers & infiltrators can't or to cause extra mayhem when I flank.

    Anyways, I wanted BBs yesterday when I was defending a sunndy in one of the tech plant's towers. The VS we were fighting were launching over on the launch pads, so we could easily see them before they launched and there was only a small area they could land and would want to hang around in. I was an engineer so nothing else in my loadout really would have changed, but I had to choose between flanking up the side of the tower or going up the lifts and placing mines after I killed everyone on top. I got a lot of mine kills.

    But the thing is, I could have easily just flanked and then dropped some C4. Like I said, I knew when they would land because I saw them coming. Not enough time to resupply before more came so it was kill, bomb, back down to sunndy, repeat. C4 + flanks would have been much more effective and much less less risky, the only reason I didn't is because I don't use C4 as an AI weapon because I think that's bullsh!t. Mines are much more fair because they're much more noticeable, faction-specific, and have smaller and less damaging blasts. If anyone has a problem with AP mines on LAs they should have a problem with LAs having C4 as well.
  12. Demigan

    Fair for who? The Rocklet Rifle without C4 to damage a target first is mostly a toy. It would be more fair to ask for LA's to have access to 1 c4 but not 2. That way the vehicle users who get blindsided because of their own shortcomings have time to react and deal with the LA.

    That still presents a huge problem though: aside from C4 delivered to unaware tanks by an LA, infantry has virtually no enjoyable gameplay method to deal with tanks. The tanks control most of the engagement and have plenty of time to get to cover for repairs while the tanks can OHK the infantry. There are only 2 reasons to remove C4 entirely from LA's: you are a vehicle player who wants to be almost uncontested when dealing with infantry, or infantry have finally gotten solid alternatives to C4 that allows infantry to combat vehicles effectively.

    Thats a good point actually. Having LA's throw OHK AOE bombs triggered by proximity for maximum accuracy would be a bit much. Infiltrators running through masses dropping them is already an annoyance. Making AP mines like deploying a dildar would be a good idea for the LA at least.
    Someone will immediately say "do the same for C4!" But they are completely different weapons with different uses.
  13. pnkdth

    The difference is you can "miss" with an AP mine and still get kills but with C4 you have to either feel the right moment or hope someone is on it (unless you have visibility). The scenario I'm thinking of is chucking them over barriers and generally having perfect access to delivering pizzas on infantry or known travelled zones. It is already a moderately effectively tool with an infiltrator, who still has to run up in their faces, thus giving it to the LA which can fairly easily outflank and keep delivering pizzas over and over can quickly become overbearing (especially when people start realising it and do it en masse).

    Mostly, I just don't want to relive the horror of grenade spam and explosionside. In this sense I do not think this suggestion scales very well (the more people use the worse it'll get).

    Yes, that's my chief concern. What happens when it scales in number of players using it. That really is the design challenge for PS2, how to making things work individually without breaking when it scales. I have no objection to a kind of "trip wire" setup for the LA as it could be used as something unique for the LA class (kinda like a mix of the claymore and BB/proxy mine). Would suit the theme of the class, i.e. use their mobility to set up ambushes and traps.

    I'd really like to see more of a trapper style rather than Rocklet/C4 delivery. Like an anti-infantry spec for the LA. The more distinction traits for each class the better since for me it means each class has more meaning/role.
    • Up x 1
  14. Campagne

    That is an issue, I do have to agree. But if they couldn't just be thrown like smart grenades, wouldn't they be just fine? Fly up to the point room past all the defenders and then mining the doors to give a small advantage sounds fun, and what a LA should be doing.

    C4 over walls is already a cheap spam "tactic" though. Maybe force the mines to not activate when there is a hostile player within the blast radius, only being able to detonate once the radius is clear. This would help force their usage as mines and not the pizza delivery method.
  15. Raidashi

    Having AP mines on LA's would be... Terrifying to put it mildly. As it stands, theres already plenty of places that people can place AP mines that cant be seen or shot until you're already too close and they go off and kill you. Fortunately, most of those places are difficult to access.

    However, the LA would be able to easily get to said places, and hide the mines which, once set, require no tending or thought and minimal risk just score reliable free passive kills. I frankly think this would be immensely more frustrating for people than it is worth while.
  16. Demigan

    How about an amendment: Allow LA's to equip a new type of AP mine, a deployable Sticky mine?

    Basically it would be an AP mine that you can stick to surfaces and has to be deployed like a Dildar. It would also be nice if it wasn't a OHK mine but more of an Ambush mine that requires the LA to finish the job.

    So how about this:
    Deploy it against a wall or on the ground, a green laser like the one on Claymores shoots out for a distance, let's say 10m.
    Crossing in front of the AP mine will launch the mine through the air towards the target, where it will detonate and deal 700 damage. Plenty to weaken an enemy but not enought to kill on it's own. The mine could perhaps use the Spitfire's aiming ability to slightly correct it's direction and have a better chance of actually hitting the target as it passes.
  17. nagibator

    fair for me. i killed thousand tanks with c4. its too easy. doesnot matter pro pilot or noob. its dead when stand more than 2 sec
  18. Demigan

    1: You do not have access to teleportation, so you wont be killing any stationary tank in 2 seconds.
    2: if you can kill anyone you've never met a pro tanker
    3: if c4 is removed, what would you do then to defeat tanks as infantry? Use harsh words? You claim its fair but offer only a complete removal, rather than a way that this playstyle can still exist in a method that might be considered fair. Reduced damage maybe? Higher C4 cost? A maximum of 2 c4 carry capacity? These all have their problems but they arent as dim-witted attempts at making vehicles almost impervious to infantry.
    4: c4 only works from stealth against enemies who do not pay attention. You may have noticed that tanks who are in vehicle combat are far harder to kill with C4 than those who are complacently farming infantry. Shouldnt we just solve the problem by forcing vehicles to pay attention all the time just like infantry does?

    Also you are somehow saying that having AP mines INSTEAD of C4 is fair, but all you are really doing is saying that you want vehicles not to fear LA's ever again.