Air Combat is too Difficult

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by urida, Nov 10, 2017.

  1. adamts01

    I absolutely love how these things fly, and I've only been at the game for a year. I treat them like helicopters in Arma, which can also kick *** using the "reverse maneuver".

    ESF are jacked up. It's FS/Stealth/Hover or go home. It's pathetic from a balance/mechanics perspective. Everyone agrees on that.

    Never considered that. I consider shooting another ESF the hardest thing in the game, not flying the things. I've always thought we needed to remove mouse acceleration and add a gun with a slight aim assist with a lower dps. But offset guns is a new one, which is rare for ideas around here. Was that once a thing? I'd love to see what kind of difference it would make.
  2. LodeTria

    You don't want off-set bullets. Just look at TR/NC hornets and how they don't go where you point for the best example. The VS ones are generally better because they are much closer to your camera.
  3. adamts01

    Good point on the Hornets. I was thinking WW2 kind of guns on the wings. And that would cause hit issues if your guns all fired forwards. But that spread might help limit long range plinking. But if things were offset just with width of the cockpit that might make it easier to gauge where the tracers are going. I don't know. I think it could be interesting.
  4. Kristan

    Yeah, when the game was released bullets used to go a little bit lower than your crosshair. Not that much, but enough to have the depth perception and track how fast are your bullets traveling. I do even remember NC players complaining that they have further offset, since Reaver gun is mounted lower than Mossies or Scythe noseguns.

    You may try to go to VR and look how Liberator nosegun works, since it has offset. Try and look how does it feels, I find it way more suitable than just some dots that just appear smaller as they travel.
  5. JibbaJabba

    An OPTIONAL mouse Yaw would do wonders to level the playing field between noobs and pros.

    If a noob manages (good luck) to actuall get a pro in front of him then he'll stand some chance of hitting.
    • Up x 3
  6. JibbaJabba

    Aye, the reaver was downright broken. The gun was badly offset and it would angle so bullets met crosshairs at some fixed distance when you were aiming to infinity. But if you aimed at something closer, it would adjust the gun angle to again to make the bullets still hit the crosshair. Sounds all good but.... If you are leading a target you are aiming to infinity. If you place crosshairs on a target the gun angle suddenly changes.

    Net result is this really weird sweet spot that you literally could not hit. Could not. The gun would not aim there.

    It sucked. I think they just made the bullets come of a spot unrelated to the gun to fix. Don't remember entirely.
    • Up x 1
  7. adamts01

    Imagine twin guns slightly to the left and right of the cockpit. That horizontal offset would likely make the tracers much easier to see, and add a little depth perception to your tracers. Right now they're pretty much covered up by the next bullet and control/space fighting is more about feel than watching where your shots go. That does sound weird how the old Reaver would change aim, so they'd have to keep the guns firing straight forward, same as they seem to do now. This would make shots slightly spread left/right but that shouldn't be a problem at dogfighting ranges. Keep the overall same fire rate, just split the shots between left and right guns.
  8. Kristan

    You mean like original Reaver?


    *sigh* I miss old Reavers. They were a strike aircraft accessible to all empires with 20mm autocannons and dumbfire rockets.
  9. FateJH

    That's correct. You have good memory.
  10. Solblind

    The twin 20mm cannon sucked though, since they alternated back and forth between two points of fire, and at some ranges (or against infantry) you ended up only aiming with one, losing half of your firepower (which was already pretty low, since the 2 cannons didn't fire together). The only real double 20mm vehicle was the deliverer, but it required 2 gunners.
    Actually, the vast majority of air to air players preferred the mosquito, since it was pinpoint accurate, faster, nimbler, and could point at a better angle downward.
  11. Lucidius134

    I thought that get rid of all offset
  12. Lucidius134

    They got rid of the offset on things like anti vehicle in anti infantry Maxes esf noseguns and also tank cannons and replace them with a camera based system. D projectiles shown to the client are fake, and try to eventually match up with the invisible camera base projectile. This was their work around too weapon baced dead zones that tankers and Pilots were complaining desperately about. Mostly ESF Pilots
  13. Kristan

    That is pretty much correct, but Reaver was not designed to be anti-infantry aircraft, rather than anti-tank. It was easier to use rocketpods to kill infantry. As for autocannons they were good against Liberators, Galaxies and fast moving targets like buggies.
    • Up x 1
  14. Silkensmooth

    They added Coyotes and made A2A missiles more noob friendly, and what did that do for the skies? It just made it easier for gankers to gank in a way that is entirely un-enjoyable for the person on the recieving end of the noob tube weapons which actually caused MORE people to quit flying than it got noobs who no longer needed skill to win to play.

    The air game is amazing in PS2, we dont need to dumb it down to the point where it is as much fun as driving a lightning, which isnt fun at all imo. Its boring and easy and everyone can do it, but its not really fun.

    Flying in PS2 is one of the most fun things ive ever done in a game.

    Making ESF cheaper would make learning to fly much more fun, and hey if you cant handle it, maybe flying isnt for you. Thats what is great about PS2, there are a multitude of playstyles and vehicles to suit every player.
    • Up x 2
  15. Silkensmooth

    Not only that, but im a terrible player. This was my first FPS. If i can learn to fly and be decently competitive at it, anyone can.
    • Up x 2
  16. TR5L4Y3R

    For you it might be the best experience, for me and many others it's the worst .. take the lock on options out of the game people still will have trouble aiming the main gun, show me how well you do with hornets even which require 2 salvos (4 missiles) for a base esf
    of course lock ons makes flying worse when flying itself is already so bad that you struggle evading enemy fire in general ..
    and no, cheap aircraft does not make flying more fun it just means for the learningprozess you end up chrashing/being shot down more often quicker ...
  17. adamts01

    Lock-ons and Coyotes removed skill from the equation. Current air battles are entirely about numbers. Those weapons are cancer.

    Cheap air doesn't make learning more fun, it makes it easier and quicker because you get more practice. And yes, most of that practice includes crashing and being shot down, just like learning the infantry game includes getting killed more than you kill, it's just that air has a higher skill curve. What cheap aircraft does to improve the game is let each faction maintain at least some air presence against all odds, keeping the faction with air superiority from ground farming without resistance. It also lets people do what they want to do, which is fly without waiting 7 minutes at the warpgate for each aircraft.
  18. Dealman

    I honestly think a typical jet-like design with vertical take-off would've fit better. Dogfighting would've had a better pacing and allow for more variety. Not only relying on good aim but also good maneuvering at low altitudes to avoid fire.

    Strafing runs would've been a lot more epic for ground troops, maybe not as effective - but would have that terror effect. They'd still be able to use vertical thrust for sustained fire but expose themselves while doing so.

    Though, I do agree it's far too late to change things now. Especially such a drastic one. There are some really good pilots out there, sadly I don't have the patience to become one.
  19. Drsexxytime

    If anything needs to be done about aircraft in the game it's increasing lock on range for G2A launchers, and effective flak range. Why let one faction dominate the air both in aircraft and AA (TR).

    As far as flight model goes, sure it can use some tweaks because it feels foreign compared to other games, but you can adjust. As far as facing vets dissuading rookies, well, that's in any game without MMR. Stat-padding vets will always go after the easiest to pad targets rather than support their front like they should.
  20. LordKrelas

    Flak is... poor.
    Increasing its range does little.. given what flak is: it either is near useless, or kills.
    -- No in-between.

    Lock-ons, while seemingly better than dumbfires for obvious reasons in terms of damage.
    They are however literally either "And it's screwed" or "and I just gave away my position" followed by "Countered by... oh yes a lot"
    Or for the pilot: "I am screwed." or "And that was pointless"

    Go read Adam's posts on manner of fixing AA \ ATG.
    Or Demigan's.
    Both are interesting, and aren't just "RAISE DA FLAK RANGE"
    As flak.. is flak. useless or hell.