2nd set of pump action

Discussion in 'Test Server: Discussion' started by bestan, Apr 8, 2013.

  1. Pikachu

    Are the old MAX AV weapons in there as well?
  2. Being@RT

    It's true that angular velocity makes aiming at close ranges a lot harder. But this does not only apply to shotguns, it applies to all weapons. The advantage of high RoF weapons here is that they land at least some shots instead of potentially missing all. But the disadvantage is that they must "get lucky" many more times than the pumpaction does. Shotguns can also partially hit: aiming with them is a little easier, mitigating some of the high RoF advantage.

    When comparing times to kill, one must keep in mind that high RoF weapons don't, in the situations ladiesop described, hit all of their shots either and that the TTK increases appropriately. This usually means that shotguns get at least one more attempt to shoot (and potentially: onehit kill) the target.

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    At long range the angular velocity is negligible, but bullet travel time means that targets can move out of the way even if you aimed perfectly. You need to be psychic a lot more in those situations.
    ---
    With 12 pellets of 134 damage each, the new pumpactions can achieve a kill as long as 33% of pellets hit over two shots, or 22% over three shots. But each shot individually has the potential to kill outright, with 60% overkill damage if sufficiently close for the spread to not matter.

    quick napkin math reveals: Each pellet in a 3.5 degree spread hits a 30cm circle every time at 5m distance, half the time at 7m.and a third of the time at 8.5m, which, assuming distribution of pellets is uniform and that damage hasn't yet begun to degrade, gives the new pumpactions an expected OHK up to 8.5m away (RNG can still mess it up of course, but I don't feel like calculating the probabilities)

    Which seems to conform to my VR testing. Although actual targets are probably bigger than a 30cm circle.
  3. Sparks

    You didn't learn to wait for the 2nd batch like the smgs yet then? :p
  4. ladiesop

    That is harder, but at long range enemies are more likely to be stationary, moving predictably (i.e. in a line and not varying pace as they're getting from A to B) or slow moving, especially if they're aiming down sights at someone. This applies to medium ranges as well, and there, automatic weapons are a lot more forgiving against moving targets than something like a battle rifle so the prediction thing is lessened here.
  5. C0L0NELH0GAN

    My review of the new PA Shotgun:
    Its a overpowerd infantryplay gamebreaker

    Oh man, if you wanna go into a tower and don't want to get killed, you will have to buy it! So, SOE sells millions of the second generation because of its imbalance killing power! After they sold enought of them, they will swing with the nerfbat and will bring it to the - even postnerf - op status of the other shotties!

    Thats how economy work here!
  6. Qaz

    The new PA feels better, actually. The longer refire time makes missing less forgiving, which seems more appropriate for PA shotguns that can instagib. The accuracy at range might be too high right now, but apart from that, this is what the original PA should've been (and not the rapid fire gun we have now).
    • Up x 1
  7. Nocturnal7x

    Shotguns were ok before the pumps, the pumps have made CQC a joke.
    • Up x 4
  8. nubery

    They nerfed all other shotguns and are now going to release new unnerfed shotties forcing shot gunners to buy the newer model because the others are less effective.

    They've done this countless times, it's SOEs marketing style.

    We'll likely see flamethrowers soon too since thy nerfed scattmaxes and want to collect on NC wanting a new weapon.
    • Up x 1
  9. Gavyne

    ^ hear hear, the pump action shotguns are overpowered cheese weapons. I used to love the infantry balance prior to pump action shotguns were introduced. Now I can't say the same. And if I can't enjoy infantry battles, my time in this game is going to be shortened dramatically.
  10. nubery

    Where are you seeing this? I want to read up on it.
  11. Kroova

    Hopefully, this is the kind of thing we can prevent through the test server.

    Still it is frustrating how what you have described seems to be the norm for SOE...I do not want to go too far off topic, but this kind of stuff over and over again really discourages me from buying more Station Cash. I would rather spend my money on a game like LoL where the company actually seems interested in creating a quality game versus SOE's moneygrabs....
  12. ladiesop

    • Up x 1
  13. nubery

    I feel you, but think of it this way.

    I dislike the money grabs. Yet at the same time they're improving the game with that money, the could probably be doing a better job of it but we're seeing very frequent patching and updating. We're even seeing system revamps. This game is growing. It's living and stabilizing. I'm alright with SOE being money pigs if they keep improving the game and continue to press out frequent patches.
  14. Ganjis

    Don't worry, they will only be OP until they decide that everyone who is going to buy one has done so, then they will nerf them to be worse than the others, in case people haven't bought those yet. F2P!
  15. ladiesop

    The question about it I ask is about Slugs?

    This one follows the BC2 pump action pattern: slow rechamber, 12 pellets (though these do less damage with the latest nerfs). Now with slugs, up close they did 100 (fatal) damage, and it dropped down to 50, which would kill on a headshot.
  16. Takoita

    Another one? I'm still downloading the test client and I'm having a real hard time not pressing 'cancel' right now. We bleed too much players as we are now, please don't add more incentives to throw the game for a couple of months or more.

    Oh, and if you are bummed with what to do with the new models, replace one of the existing shotguns with the new one - they look quite generic and ugly and could use a brushup.
  17. ShadowAquilaX

    The VS one is chromed out. :D awesuuum!
    However 4 shotties is 3 shotties too many. This "pay to win" attitude needs to stop. or at least stop making guns and then making new ones because the first ones weren't as successful, sales wise. You're just vomitting product at us and nearly force us to buy it if we want to contend with it. it's insulting.
    Not everyone wants an SMG or a shotty, and we shouldn't feel like the only way we'll stand a chance against them is to get one ourselves.
    And where the hell is my cloaking Scythe?!
    But yeah the VS one at least looks nice and enticing. I would buy one if cqc wasn't already frustrating as it is.
    • Up x 1
  18. Amorphium


    they are improving the game by first making it worse? (at least infantry fights)
  19. Parasox

    SOE, I beg you to stop killing the game with these new guns. The shotguns have completely destroyed what little fun was left in CQC engagements, and the recent balance patch did nothing to fix it. By churning out these cashcows, you are killing the game. People are leaving in droves because it's clear to them that you care less about gameplay than you do about return on investment.
    • Up x 1
  20. Takoita

    If you want more gun sales, make existing choices a more inticing buy. For example, NC will thank you wholeheartedly if the Jackhammer would stop being the worst option for that slot and sweep it up in no time.
    • Up x 1