Cyrious made a video about Skilled Players

This is something I've pointed out numerous times in various places. People jump to absolutes and fixate themselves on it. There's never a middle ground.

There was a youtube video last January of someone doing multi-hacks. Shooting through walls, infinite flight, ect. He played for months while recording himself at hour-long binges, got banned and came back. All of which because he had some extreme grudge against Planetside.

If THAT can exist, I scarely believe that people can be so ignorant to completely refuse to accept that smaller, subtler things exist too. And ontop of that, that the way people are acting is more like openly inviting cheating. Anyone accused will immediately be defended by swathes of people who know nothing about the context of the situation instead of being an intermediary, and from there a cycle starts.

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Personal experience? On Emerald, I've noticed a lot of people ADS'ing at walls. Not pre-aiming before rounding corners, but standing perpendicular to a wall, ADS'ing, snapping to the wall and staring at it, and sometimes aiming/tracking through it. That is - not - normal. While it could be server/client shenanigans, the way peoples models move and look, that they have to re-aim to where they were before in an actual gliding motion, and not just a visual glitch leaves me extremely suspiscious...

Along with several people that stay ADS'ded constantly and only play that way, and only breaking it when running, while not impossible, is strange to see a fairly wide selection of players doing this...

I play on Emerald exclusively and I do not see this like you do. Sure, occasionally I see someone flying or I get insta-killed by multiple head shots from 10 miles away but those are relatively rare events. I am certain there are cheaters but I do not believe it is anywhere close to rampant. And honestly, at this stage of the game, I feel there would be little motivation for anyone to spend time creating cheats for PS2 or for folks to go through the trouble/risk of using them. PS2 is not Warzone or Fortnite.

I agree - this is why I don't really have a problem with those suggesting that cheats are not a big problem in PS2 purely to ensure its survival (after all - nobody wants to play a game infested with cheats). Whatever I may think I still play it. OK I might not if I was stuck on Soltech but that's a whole different story.

I have more of an issue with other idiots trying to con people into their blinkered world by spouting nonsense proving they clearly have no clue what they are talking about.

This is precisely why I highlighted "attacking/defending spawns, construction, and support roles". Killing a sunderer not only awards the XP equivalent to a handful of infantry kills, it also gives gratification to the faction loyalist who knows that without him the base would be lost or a platoon worth of teammates be busy defending it. This is the kind of action that at the most extreme decides who wins or loses an alert. Construction in particular gives far more XP/minute than regular infantry gameplay does especially if you are not very good at it. There is a reason players are filling silos just for the sake of it; it can give up towards 500 certs/h. There is a dedicated construction directive line to boost, and on new-Esamir there are vehicle capturable bases where the flail can shoot into.

The Forwards Station, as the router, yields spawnpoints that cannot be taken out by armor, can be placed such that only LA's can reach them, and even placed in a glitchy manner. As you say taking them out is hard, and the vast majority of bases are already biased in the attacker's favor. I fail to see how this would make fights any more enjoyable, not only do enemies spawn from a point outside of reach, most bases would also be impossible to defend.

It's possible to use ADS if you hold it before going up in the air, not while you are in the air. Also even when using a macro to ADS for 0.01 seconds the scope comes up somewhat before returning.

There is a far longer time that the rocket can hit the aircraft, giving the aircraft time to move into the shot. The size difference is also huge compared to a head at the distance portrayed.
On top of that I just tested it out: If you fly through the air that is still your minimum COF. If you fire your COF increases... I don't see his COF increase during that shot.
There is a trick to do something like that. When you crouch while holding fire your COF decreases quickly, and if you fire before moving or flying your COF won't grow that much. Similarly if you ADS, fire a shot and then go out of ADS again you can keep your COF below the expected norm.
Unfortunately, you can't ADS while in the air so you can't use that trick. How'd he pull of simultaneously a shot with no COF growth and an extremely lucky shot?

Here's one of the problems with trying to find cheaters: People are willing to defend them even if it's almost indefensible. Yes it could potentially be luck... But this type of "luck" seems to be happening fairly often around people suspected of being subtle cheaters. Convenient isn't it? That's quite literally the point of a subtle cheat: To make it look like skill or luck, so it's harder to determine if they are and have random people defend them for reasons I still can't determine. Combine that with the lack of COF growth while firing in mid-air and what do you have?

Let's turn that around: You are claiming there is only white, no black.
Frankly I don't care much if he's a subtle cheat or that the gameplay mechanics in the background are broken: It needs to be fixed either way.

You've said that you see fairly few cheaters, but if you desperately want people to not be cheaters then you'll ignore some that are. You'll probably counter with "if you look for witches, you'll find witches" and that is true. I'm not saying we should ban this guy outright, I'm saying that some more inspection into his actions is warranted. If he is cheating, we need to catch it and plug the hole. If he's abusing the system that system needs to be fixed. If he's just skilled and extremely lucky, good for him. Although it's suspicious that he simultaneously pulls of an extremely lucky shot combined with a lack of COF growth.

Can't edit it anymore, but a short test found that bolt-actions don't have COF increase while airborne.

It obviously doesn't otherwise it wouldn't be in a montage, and you wouldn't be hackusing this out of the ordinary shot if it was something truly ordinary.

I don't desperately want everyone to play legit. I only ask for the truth. There's no reason to go out of my way to accuse someone of cheating if they appear normal. You on the other hand, seem to desperately want everyone to be cheating, that way you can pretend you're a good player and have no room for improvement.

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There's lots of reasons to use cheats, one of which is for the fame and social standing. This guy apparently posts his exploits on the internet, which shots and situations do you think are the most likely to get this guy the thing he tries to achieve? The one's with a subtle cheat or the one's without?
The point of subtle cheats is that they are hard to see, and they are the best type of cheats for people who want this. They can show off without getting caught, but there are edge-cases where they might be caught. So yes if it was an ordinary shot I wouldn't be saying "that's suspicious, we should investigate".

If you ask for the truth, then you are asking the same thing as me right? You should be questioning something so far out of the ordinary. You should be asking "could this guy be a subtle cheat?". If you don't then you give subtle cheats free reign to diminish other people's gameplay.

I don't have a desperate need for everyone to be cheating, I do have a desperate need for people to be checked upon if they are showing suspicous signs that could be cheating. I want cheaters to be caught so my gameplay isn't diminished by someone playing unfairly.

Ofcourse it's so nice to see how you say "you can't just accuse someone, I want the truth!" and then immediately turn around and say that the only reason I want there to be cheats is so I can pretend I'm a good player with no room for improvement. Where did that come from eh? With that line of reasoning I could just as well accuse you that you defend cheaters because your fragile ego can't handle the idea that the game was rigged from the start and that many of your failures weren't actually your fault. Its not like people in bad situations haven't done the same before. But there's no way for me to know from this conversation, just like you can't know if I want to pretend that I'm good without room for improvement.

@JustGotSuspended fair points, and that's why I said sometimes. Even just one Friday a month would be nice for me as a public platoon leader to have an occasional chance to herd the cats around without worry of them getting discouraged because we ran into players they can't beat, and then I'm arguing with someone who is accusing them of cheating. Just one Friday a month off of this would be nice.

In Planetside?

Really, I can get the motivation to do so in a hyped game like fortnite or whatever. No one gives a flying rat's behind that you can hack planetside. And if they were doing it for fame, then there'd be 0 need for them to keep it subtle.

My ego? Humility you mean?

I have. And there's far more substantiated and logical conclusions that can be made to dismiss cheating in 99.9999999% of scenarios, especially if it's someone I die to to regularly. Because subtle cheats factually are not possible, I would have to de-educate myself to even consider such a conclusion. It's unreasonable to even pretend that "subtle cheaters" is a fair and acceptable method of reasoning. It's a red flag that highlights ignorant individuals who chose to cling on to a myth rather than accept facts.

When I do encounter a cheater, I report them, go after them, and attempt to bully them out the game. When I conclude that the player who I've died to was more skilled, had better/worse connection/hardware than me, or that I simply made a mistake (the latter accounts for over 95% of my deaths) I leave it at that. There's no need to imagine excuses for why I can't seem to kill that guy. If I sense it's an actual skill gap, I ask them for help. Try it, I'm sure many of your "subtle cheaters" would gladly train to to get good and aim better.

Players are checked on, and cheaters are dealt with. Denying this is another rejection of factual truth. If you report someone and he's still playing after a few days, it's not that DBG didn't check him. it's just the guy wasn't cheating, and you have 0 idea how to identify a cheater from a legit player.

We're back into fantasyland here. For cheaters to actually account for a considerable part of my failures - worse - for the game to be "rigged from the start" the would have to be a considerable amount of cheaters. By considerable, we're talking about the 1/4th of the playerbase cheating insanity some other guy vomited from thin air earlier. If you'll kindly scroll up and attempt to read words of reasoning, you'll see I, and other players dismiss it as simply being an indication of a severe mental illness.

There have never been more than two dozen cheaters confirmed at once. These are numbers that were officially posted after the crackdowns. Claiming they missed a few can possibly be debated. A fair amount of skepticism is fine. Going as far as to say there's such a vast amount of cheaters that actually impact the game and have never been caught, or are in cahoots with devs goes beyond rationality, to the point where if you're not chocking on the pile of stinky bs you're typing, you should cyriously get yourself checked out.

No knowledgeable person can argue "subtle hackers" exist. No sane person can conclude from 6 official bans, a WHOPPING quarter + of the [multi-thousand] playerbase is cheating. Especially when not even being able to provide a single piece of documentation at how such an absurd conclusion was derived.

And trying to pretend DBG doesn't investigate/deal with cheaters because the dudes you report aren't being banned? Nah dude, DBG even renamed half of the Connery playerbase by themselves. Seriously, dudes playing for 8+ years, and some with silly names no one would even think of reporting were removed/renamed.

If the "cheaters" you report aren't being banned, it's not that they're incredibly subtle. It's not that DBG is ignoring them. It's just that you have absolutely NO IDEA what a cheater is, and in your nonsensical vilifying spree, you wasted valuable dev time and resources to investigate an ordinary player.

I feel they could've cultivated the idea of Koltyr a little more. Make it a relaxed zone for players with below certain stats/directive score, where they can casually have fun with each other and not have to worry about improving themselves, or at least lower the gap of improvement they need to have some fun in shooting situations.


With the size of the continent, I'm sure performance would've been better there too.

Idk I'm not against the idea of giving players who are less skilled (whatever the reason) a break from sweaty tryhards. What's important for them to understand is that the game's complex, but they aren't losing because of cheaters or whatever salt-generated excuses. Giving an already dying game bad publicity for something it doesn't deserve is silly.

And that's coming from a guy that bashes the team, every update and can't stand the current direction the game's taken. But at least I can be honest with myself and others, giving the game credit where its due. Although idk if it really counts as credit, because the game's never had a serious issue with cheating in the first place, likely due to the lack of hype and complexity surrounding the game's release.

That's the most the crosshair expands to. Idk if the CoF technically goes larger, but the 'crosshair CoF' is maxed there.

also the cof does expand as soon at he steps on the jump pad, to the fixed values for jumping/free fall, and then shrinks to walking/still values once he lands on the other side.

There was a time when there was a certain amount of transparency in the anti-cheat efforts, with server wide message's saying that this and this player was banned. Can you point to a single example, where a banned cheater has had an active membership subscription? Otherwise I don't find it irrational to say that maybe there is a 'no-ban' policy in the CS department when the cheater has an all-access pass. This ofc if the cheater is subtle such that while the probability of a legit player pulling off the same is vanishingly small, the cheater does not fly around and no definite proof can be made.

But this can go both ways. Cheaters may know that they could be caught and once they decide to do it stop paying more money to cut their losses for when it happens.

You do realize that my comment about your fragile ego was a deliberate overexaggeration to show how the basis of your argument could just as easily be used against you by making up stuff? I didn't actually think your ego was that fragile, it was just to make a point.

You have an extremely rose-colored idea of cheating. Checking cheaters isn't as easy as all that, it's why cheating remains a problem is every single game in existance and so much money is spend combatting it. Considering I've personally already seen over 20 people flying through the air, teleporting and killing several people per second in the first year alone I really want to know where you get the "6 bans" idea from. I would argue that 6 bans shows a complete failure of all anti-cheat systems.
Also where did you get the "quarter of the people is cheating" idea from? Are you having a discussion with someone else who claims that? I'm not claiming that.

The problem with the rise of subtle cheating is specifically that it's harder to detect and that it makes it easier to gain notoriety. It doesn't really matter if it's PS2 or Fortnite, it doesn't matter if it's just with the people you kill or with a Youtube audience.

Very true and they often included funny comments when they were banned - it was both very amusing AND had the beneficial effect of assuring other players that something was being done about the cheaters at the time.

However this was a long time ago (i'm talking 2015 - maybe earlier) and the hacks were rather crude. Things like teleporting to other players is going to be spotted easily. It pre-dated the amazingly sophisticated Hagsclub hack, i'm guessing things got much tougher to spot after that.

Funny you should say that - it's the most logical explanation I can think of as to why this guy is still playing:



He has been killing multiple people during his lag periods, does this virtually every play session, was caught on video from last year but is still playing and is now ASP+34.

I'll give you 2

https://www.pcgamer.com/soe-planetside-2-bans/



And yeah, you're being irrational

It is easy to detect cheaters. What's hard to do is restrict them. It's easy to identify them, and ban them, which DBG mods do surprisingly well. What's hard/impossible to do is prevent cheats from occurring in the first place.

Yeah, they can detect the guy cheating, and ban him fairly quickly. What they can't do is immediately ban the same guy who made another account after he was banned and started cheating their again. He will get noticed and banned, but it's a repetition of the process.

Promptcritical SOE was the guy publishing reports about the cheating to try to reason against naïve people like you. Obviously you can't reason with the unreasonable, which is why people like you still roam the forums bugging everyone about your imaginary hacker problem. But those of us actually paying attention got some interesting information from that, Cyrious is one of them. He's even compiled that information into a video so you don't have to trouble yourself with reading it.

Killing several people per second is nothing abnormal, considering the ttk of weapons and the game's nature.

Someone pointed out there would hypothetically be 1000 "subtle cheaters" supported by DBG roaming around the game. That's one forth of our playerbase. You're basically saying the same thing, and earlier you even claimed the game could be "rigged from the start". That means there's so many cheaters you wouldn't be able to distinguish them anymore. We not talking single/double of even triple digits. This would mean cheaters account for a significant percentage of the playerbase, which is simply a lie.

And how would you argue that? Are there some secret numbers only demigan has access to and isn't willing to share with the non-woke players?

Idk on one side we've got numbers coming from an actual dev, that seem to correspond to the situation in game. On the other we have players that are constantly dropping red flags like "subtle cheater" and conspiracies that prove they have absolutely no understanding of the subject claiming they know better. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

You do you bud, but unless you're gonna show some basic evidence remotely supporting your claim to make up for your ignorance on the matter, you might as well make a soliloquy of your argument, because it isn't one.

You provide nothing to argue with. No sources, no evidence, no logical fallacies, only ignorance and absurdity that seeps through each post.

People have tried to cheat in streams, on youtube, whatever. It's very easy to catch, and there's many instances where some were. Of the few people who actively make planetside content on youtube, I would challenge you link me some of them who "subtly" cheat, without telling their subs.