Planned Death Camera

If you rely more on the spot than your own shooting skills because you can't defend your "spot" from attackers, that puts you into the bads category.

I'm sorry, I forgot to add the /s tag, I was referencing this meme.

It makes things harder people who rely on sitting still in one spot, makes it easier to react to flanking, thus makes flanking and follow-through more important than simply jabbing at the flank and not really getting anywhere. The reaction to such a flanking move has a counter-reaction which changes the battlefield elsewhere. That is what I mean when I say I think it'll create more dynamic battles since the main line will change, split, etc, etc.

It is not just the ragequitters but also teaching them why they get killed. Simply getting killed is not often enough to ragequit but getting mercilessly farmed with little to no real input will whittle down and turn away new players. So I would use inexperienced players/newbies rather than bads.

I do appreciate the play style you're talking about but I also think the trade-off is worth it. Sure, you won't be able to do the same move over and over against the same player. You can still do it, you'll just need more tricks up your sleeve. As a stalker infil, for example, it is already a really bad idea to use the same place. As for snipers, it is already a royal pain in the behind to pick them off they position themselves up in trees on Hossin or whatnot even if you know where they are + sniping is a fairly safe activity in general.

All in all though, this will lead to everyone having to put more thought into what they're doing.

So i actualy think this will make it worse for new players.
Think about it for a second, a new player is probably going to have no idea where some1 is on the death cam anyway.
How are they going to know which box that is, or which stairway that is, or which tree...etc...etc.

The only players who are going to be able to tell instantly where some1 is from a death cam (which is really a killer cam isnt it?) are the veterans who know the maps, know the buildings, and know the object locations.

So a new player who; doesnt know movement is king, who doesnt realise being methodical about your approach is a waste of time, who doesnt know that taking cover behind that box is a stupid move; finally gets a kill, takes cover to recharge their shield and bang, killed by the very person they killed as the oponent was able to quickspawn and go straight back to the new players location knowing full well that the new player probably hasnt moved since they really dont know that they should.

How many times have you rounded a corner and seen a new player crouched trying to 'peak' around the corner only to give them 6 shots into their dome?
Or gone into a door, back out, and into the one round the corner to see the new player sat waiting at the other door.
Its new players who dont move around a lot, not veterans, the veterans will take advantage of knowing where a newb is, and an easy revenge kill......

Terrible idea at the end of a long long list of terrible ideas recently.
No1 is perfect, but the devs really need to learn from their mistakes a bit better.

Since it will show them it is going to become a good learning experience versus the BAM! DEAD! with a cone of the general direction of the shot. In other words, there is a window of opportunity to alter the behaviour based on what just happened.

What you put forth though is why I think vet versus vet is going to be a hell of a lot more interesting. A game of cat and mouse where neither is sure who's the cat or the mouse. On a larger scale it can change the course of battles and TactiCool outfits (who I very much enjoy) really can shine.

Most of the time it isn't exactly a mystery where you were killed from, because it's usually the guy you just lost a firefight with, or a vehicle of some kind, at which point discussion about the camera becomes largely irrelevant because it isn't telling you anything you don't already know.
The only practical time the cam is useful is if you were shot from behind, and to that extent I think you're selling new players short here. A player can generally extrapolate his killer's location from a killcam even on unfamiliar terrain because he already knows where he was, and the camera gives him his killer's location relative to that.

A vet isn't going to benefit tremendously from a cam because on the one hand there is already enough information on the death screen for a vet to make a good guess where their killer was, and on the other if they were killed from a sneaky spot chances are he's been killed from that spot before and can plan accordingly (we aren't exactly overflowing with terrain and base diversity, here). In either case a vet has less to gain from a killcam than a new player.

Disingenuous example is disingenuous. Sitting in the same spot long enough for your victim to respawn and return for revenge gets you killed now, no killcam required.

Again, players who don't move around a lot are easy kills now. The killcam won't have a noticeable effect on that front.

I agree it's a bad idea, but more so for the waste of time and resources for very little gain than for any assumed effect on gameplay. In all likelihood I predict it will be used more for people to see merely how they died rather than for any tactical benefit.

Completely for the introduction of death cam hureee

I didnt think it necessary to address seeing your enemy before they kill you, of course any player would know who that was.
I disagree that new players, in a game with constantly re-used assets and buildings that look the same, are going to be able to decern any useful info about the killers position from the killer cam, if they can then a vet will definitely be able to decern the same.

Never said it would be the ultimate in battlefield awareness, just that a vet could decern instantly where some1 is just based on a few seconds of cam. Take the 'new' landscape loading screens for example, i bet you can tell me exactly where each one was taken just by looking at it for a second? A new player probably wont even know which continent it is on.
A vet and a new player get exactly the same screen, they get given exactly the same amount of information, any potential 'gain' a new player can make a vet can also make, my concern is about the frequency this will be beneficial to a new player or a vet.

Yes sitting in the same spot gets you killed now, no kill cam required, thats why we dont do it as experienced players, thats my point: Who is more likely to sit still after a successful kill, a new player or a vet?
A new player seeing a vet running around like a chicken after killing them provides 0 info, a vet seeing the infil that just sniped them stay in the same position gives them good info.

I agree very little battlefield effect, but id argue there will be less times it will benefit a new player than a vet player since the info given by it will more likely be outdated when its a vet killer than when its a new killer.

People keep saying 'good snipers relocate', 'good flankers chose different approach routes'. Good players dont tend to be the players who just clicked install.

But what does it show them?
Based on the PTS footage it shows the person who just killed them for a few seconds after the kill, not the kill itself, on a rotating camera.
Not sure how its a teaching tool, as ive touched on above, i feel all it will end up being is a tool for vets to enact revenge upon each other (as you stated) and inevitably also new players (because why wouldnt they) who cannot reply with the same as their game knowledge is lacking.

Just saw the PTS footage. Even worse than I thought it would be. GL ever trying to flank a sunderer or something when the first guy you kill can actively report EXACTLY where you are or are moving to WHILE dead. Even when behind cover/walls etc. ******* brilliant...

The closest I'd get to infantry with this is a kobalt ant/harasser.

Which was exactly my point, that unless you're currently running around assuming your opponents are all new players with no SA to speak of, you aren't losing anything by giving your enemy a killcam. This is all moot, however, since I can see now where the disconnect is. I was assuming a COD-style "show me how I died" cam, rather than the Battlefield-style "follow my killer in real-time" cam, which is something I am opposed to.

I think many of you underestimate how that works and just don't want to or simply haven't yet tested how this will work. I was on the test server to check and it's awful. The camera itself stays above your corps while slowly zooming in on your killer's location LIVE meaning you see exactly where they are in relation to you and to where they might be changing location. Then it turns back onto your corps. The only exception thus far appears to be getting killed by someone currently in an aircraft.

In addition to what I just said above the killer's character is highlighted red meaning you will also see him behind rocks and cloaked...

Actually the current PTS prototype goes as follows...
Player A kills Player B. Player B has the camera staying on his corps while hard zooming directly onto Player A's location with a red outline highlighting the killer. After like 5 seconds it turns back onto the corpse. All this happens LIVE so there is no footage of the kill scene or anything and your dead *** can tell your team mates what Player A is doing (moving, aiming at next guy, hiding behind that thingy) even while Player A is cloaked or completely outside line of sight.
So 1. There is no exactly learning experience for Player B because it's not a replay and it basically just zooms in to about a 10-12 times scope max.
And 2. It absolutely and most clearly not only reveals the enemy's position but also places a non removable tracker on them for the next 5 seconds so shoot and move will be less effective as well.