The recent Claymore change/nerf...

Claymore
Now has an activation time of 320ms.
Dev Note: Adding an activation time reduces the effectiveness (and frustration) caused by claymores placed where they cannot be countered or avoided.

I'm just going to post these stats pulled from Dasanfall to help us avoid any unnecessary arguments:

Bouncing Betty: http://stats.dasanfall.com/ps2/item/1044
Average kills per hour 122.

Proximity Mine: http://stats.dasanfall.com/ps2/item/1045
Average kills per hour 122.

Claymore: http://stats.dasanfall.com/ps2/item/429
Average kills per hour 157.

As you can see, this change is necessary.

Claymores were never OP. It's faction traits that were at play.

NC: Always drunk and staggering about with cans of PBR at their feet. They never notice claymores until *BOOM*. Last word out of their mouths? "Duuuude".

VS: Always doing some obscure hot-yoga-hipster pose; too busy rubbing their chakkras to notice the claymores. Last word out of their mouths? "Namasteeheeeyyy?".

TR: Superior faction. Superior players. Superior uniforms. Never have last words, because awesome.

Stay Frosty TR.

Far too early to say what the effect of a trigger time will be, but I'll just place them differently (like I do with Betties and Proxes now).

If you want same trigger times for all AI mines then Claymores would need to have a 360 degree blast radius like the others..........but then they wouldn't be Claymores any more.

Nah. You can make Claymores remain Claymores by increasing it's kill-range and extending it's range in the direction it's looking at. Oh look it already has that! If necessary you can extend it even farther, but it's not necessary.
Perhaps a better idea would be to increase the angle of the explosion, although it wouldn't need to be much if it needs to be added at all.

You can't use statistics to determine if claymore mines are more effective in that manner.

Using your logic that means we need to nerf all weapons that have a higher average KPH because statistics. There is such a thing as faction identity and having empire specific weapons. This constant buff/nerf crap to achieve some sort of "balance" breaks the game more than applying Rock, Paper, Scissors when it comes to combat.

Also now that there is a 320 ms delay the claymore will simply not function properly due to a cone blast radius instead of an aoe like the others..these changes were not needed.

This change is simply bull ****. Claymore give up omni direction for single direction insta blast. THAT IS WHAT THE DESIGN WAS.
There is a reason company's with games that are struggling...go out of business. THEY KEEP PISSING OFF THEIR CUSTOMERS WITH ****** CHANGES LIKE THIS ONE.

Nurfing the Claymore was not needed, it is Cone blast, verses omni directional Bouncing Bettys and Proximity Mines..

This is basically the Pizza mines all over agian, some Dev died like a B**** to Claymores and nurfed it on a whim.
At the end of the day, TR can't have good things when most/all of the Devs VS/NC loyalists.

We have.... "We had one" thing that can insta kill a person, while both VS and NC both have weapons that either take the piss or seeming it's only reason to exist is to farm with.

Too much **** on TR gets Nurfed and not actually balanced or fixed.. They just utterly make it useless. (Keeping the peace or some s**t..)

I've been playing this game since Tech Test 2, and frankly, the Dev department is very bias against TR and I'm quite sick of it.

The players shows during events, even with all the BS we have to deal with and lack weapons in certain scenarios, TR is more popular during those times, yet the actual try-hard player base somehow.. s**ts over TR on Reddit and the forums and cry about our things and manage to get TRs things Nerf quickly and without months of whinning..

Comparing ES weapons to weapons, all of TRs ES weapons have "all" been nurfed and made useless, while NC and VS's where either improved or made "sensible"..

Gatekeeper, was broken on release yes.. but it had the same TTK and range as the Enforcer and the Saron at the same diestance..
Only difference was, we could trail our shots far easier.. Now it's useless at long range vs a Enforcer and Saron and it's TTK is 20% slower than the others.

Striker, made useless years ago.. because of so called "Elite" ESF Pilots complaining about Lock-on ruining the (Their) game.. Now we "All" have the Swarm and yet the Striker is still remains useless?

Some people argue, "but it's situational.." the situation TR needs to be in to effectively use our weapons requires a lot of organisation for the weapon/s to be considered OP.. The once in blue moon TR gets to use our "OP" weapons are far and few between this late in the game..

I know I sound like a whinny like B**** right now, but for someone like me who plays TR religiously, you see the s**t as clear as day, and if you utter a word about it, the white knights of the holy nurf 'but make ours farm easier' grail will set upon you like a flock of seagulls and basically bully your thread in to submission or until you leave.. then argue they are right becuase your KDR is only 2 and their is 7+ if they can't win logically.. QQ mour right?

So if the TR commissioner had more kills than the VS commissioner, you would nerf the TR commissioner?

Frankly I've been waiting for this since claymores but buffed twice. Woulda figured they just tone the damage and distance back down but i'm interested to see how much this really affects it.

I think claymores will still kill more people on avg just because they can be nearly impossible to identify if placed right. All this change does is give those that sprint around as fast as possible a slightly higher chance of avoiding death even when due to server lag they already have a fairly decent chance of that.

Don't forget 320ms is 0.32 seconds. Human reaction time is .25 on average.

Claymore sure is spammed a lot more than the others.

I played around with them today, the problem is they are directional, so with the delay you only have to step over them and you are safe.

Everyone seemed to just run past them, in fact the only time I got a kill was when I threw one in front of a bouncing betty, they had time with the delay to stepped over the claymore so were safed from its directional blast, but the blast hit the bouncing betty which exploded omnidirectional and killed them.

I guess that tactic could be used with the omnidirectional blast of tank mines to make the claymores effective.

All I know is that in game the delay is long enough to run past their limited blast zone.

It wouldn't be bad if claymore had a omnidirectional blast instead of directional

Mines piss off people, people ask for nerfs even if they're completely unnecessary. Not taking sides here, just nerfside is getting stupid.

Next session I'm going to use only claymores. No Primary weapons, no side arms, no knife, no vehicles, and no air. Only clays so I can have the sweet music of BlTCHING in chat to listen to on how OP they still are. See you on the battlefield!!!!

Prox mines/bettys: blink, here i am.....blink, here i am.....blink, here i am.....blink, here i am..... if you are blind enough to trigger one, you deserve to die.
Unless you WALK over them, they wont kill you. Run past and you loose your shield. Add to the fact on serverbusy days, the lag delay worsens it (same as harassers speeding over tank mines and surviving)

Claymores are silent killers that mow you down in an instant. Easily placed and near invisible.
Buffed twice before, you had this coming.

And seriously mr. Therundown. TR underpowered and unfavoured? What game are you playing? Your post is probably the post of the year for me. Lulz

I feel the devs are fixing the wrong issue with claymores which is visibility. Ever since they buffed them by removing an enemies ability to see the green beams (or atleast seem them well enough your face isnt next to it) their kills per user have sky rocketed. Not to mention some clever people can actually get them on ceilings and wall fixtures where most players are not expending an explosive device now that they can cling to surfaces.

I dunno, I guess stats are out there, but is it possible that TR players choose engineer more than VS and NC do?

is it because NC and VS have a better pay-off class/configuration and shun engy more than TR?

Or is it because TR weapons are better than VS/NC engy weapons?

I dunno.

I still think my reasoning in my post above is why claymores seem more effective. It's not the device, it's the device's targets.

So a weapon with a lower damage, blinking light and 0.5 second delay before activation is as effective as the claymore which has none of these, the only other difference is the blast zone?

VS and NC have to be much more creative to get kills with their mines unlike TR, plonk down just inside a doorway get kills.

What has not been mentioned in this discussion is that a good 20 percent of the time claymores land improperly, that is, they bounce off a shoulder or wall or whatever and the cone of fire is not properly placed as the user intended. This has upset me for years, and since I have more claymore mine kills than anyone in the game, I know whereof I speak. Am I still getting claymore kills? Sure, but I am doubling up, using tank mines in conjunction more, placing them back further from doorways, trying to place them in even more unlikely avenues of approach, etc.

There is only 1 NC on the top10 leaderboard for the Commisioner.
Clearly, the NC Commisioner needs a buff.

Reading statistics is usually not as shallow and easy to read as it appears at first glance.
Higher KPM doesent nessecarily mean it kills better than its VS/NC counterparts.
It could (for example) mean that its used more.

.5 and you are still in the zone of a omnidirectional mine, .32 and you are out of the zone of a directional mine though