[BUG] Out of all the things that need balancing ...

... the gatekeeper cannot stay in its current state. The only tank weapon that can suppress anything has had its day in the sun but now it needs some adjusting. It's pretty sad when the common theme of a tr fight they are winning is endless barrages of tank (sometimes harrassers) spam pounding off of spawn room shields, heck they don't even need any active targets just let the gatekeeper spam rain until someone steps out the door.

I'm sure this thread will get a lot of responses from those that will not want to see their construct obliterating cert farm machines tampered with but it has to go.

There are many more complaints I have regarding the point and click adventure faction but I'll leave it stand with this for now.

Not even a fan I prefer the Vulcan, splash damage from GK it horrid for killing players. While they are at that nerf they can tone down the Aphellion since it's basically a Vulcan with ridiculous range and no downside.

I think lowering the projectile velocity should put it in a good position.

Okay, so let's play "Spot the OP Gatekeeper"...





It looks scary!
But oh wait... those VKPH, VKPU, KPH and KPU stats (some which I didn't list because I'm lazy) were from the first 8 days since Gatekeeper was released!

What does it look like now?



MBT Secondary stats (ALL STATS TAKEN FROM ORACLE OF DEATH, 15 JUN 2016 (because it couldn't load further, for me at least))

KPH
Saron : 22
Enforcer : 21.1
Gatekeeper : 18.63

KPU
Saron : 4.27
Enforcer : 3.8
Gatekeeper : 3.7

VKPH (the stat that actually matters)
Saron : 13.2
Enforcer : 14.35
Gatekeeper : 10.45

VKPU (the stat that actually matters)
Saron : 2.64
Enforcer : 2.5
Gatekeeper : 2.02



Harasser turret stats
KPH
Saron : 31.56
Enforcer : 28.12
Gatekeeper : 24.4

KPU
Saron : 3.8
Enforcer : 4.42
Gatekeeper : 3.95

VKPH (the stat that actually matters)
Saron : 22.13
Enforcer : 24.74
Gatekeeper : 21.1

VKPU (the stat that actually matters)
Saron : 2.67
Enforcer : 3.9
Gatekeeper : 3.41

How come that the Gatekeeper, a broken OP weapon in the eyes of many, gets out-performed by Saron and Enforcer in every single category and only scoring 2# in just two of these categories? It kills less infantry and vehicles per pull and also less often than the before-mentioned Saron and Enforcer?

If in your imaginary scenario where TR just spams things at everyone and wins, isn't it, well, a bit biased? Why don't you at least try to combat the enemy threat instead of hugging the spawn room or just ignoring the fact that you let the TR take a superior position and assert dominance, and pretending that they aren't there and won't shoot you (EVERYONE will shoot you if given such position).

Or better yet, combat the enemy tank zerg with infantry AV or your own tanks? It always worked, it will always work in such scenarios.



But naaaaah, Gatekeeper OP plz nurf.

Or, or, if you're so determined to nerf the "OP" gatekeeper, increase the reload speed and/or reduce the velocity a bit. A bit more skillful and increases the TTK without ruining the feel and power of the weapon. Doesn't change it too much nor over-nerf it, but it's going to be balanced in the eyes of people like you. Win-win?

After dealing with non stop AODR zergs for about two months straight I can, with complete certainty, say that most of what you suggest as counter measures are fundamental mistakes. Fighting lolkeeper spam and generally HE farmers from within the base they are attacking only gets the defending team camped and farmed. The best solution is actually to grab AP forces from the next base over and hope you get to flank before the cap timer runs out.

Those stats listed earlier, what is the start date of the report range? I never saw that site but if it is going back to the start of the game, well, the Saron isn't what it was back then. I have enough time in a mag. A FPC mag with Saron will lose to an AP Prowler with GateKeeper both from distance as well as up close. The only perceived advantage the mag has is try to get to a point they can hope to flank which is often not viable so please dont try to use that excuse. The mag will often have to retreat and repair due to the damage output of the lockdown prowler plus all the zerg fire plus always having to be on the lookout for the c4 fairies.

Additionally, the saron certainly is not at the AI level of the gatekeeper, not by a long shot

That always happens when one side is winning handily and can get a clear shot at the spawn room, Gatekeeper or not.

Running out into the path of enemy fire is seldom ever healthy for you.

Ok, I'm taking a wild guess here that you main TR because neither the Mag or Vanguard does this in anyway shape or form

I'm not sure whether to envy your experience or pity your awareness.

Entirely false... every faction at one point or another has absolutely used their MBT to camp out in front of a spawn room. Magriders have an advantage of traversing terrain so they can reach new angles to do just that, Vanguards are the hardest to use for this task but it can still happen. Prowler on the other hand have the firepower to completely suppress defenders.

Just because it's easier on one faction does not mean they are the only ones to do just that.

RREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

If you're getting spawn camped by a large number of vehicles firing at the doorways the problem isn't with the campers - it's with you and everyone inside the spawn room.

You get farmed if you let yourself, what you should do is pop over to the nearest friendly base and get an AV armor column going and swing around and pluck them off the spawn.

The nerfed the saron in response to the point and click republic crying about it, they then gave the point and click republic the best long range mbt weapon in the game and did not revert the nerf on the saron == stupid *** devs and and a large balance sway in favor of the PaCR (Point and Click Republic)

Does the vkpu tell you how far they are away from the target?

Lay out the strategy for dealing with a GK harasser bombarding a spawn room from behind a group of elevated rocks 300m away?

Wouldn't call the Saron nerfed, it's definitely been re-purposed though. It's one of the highest DPS AV weapons, it's also capable of being used at close to long range, albeit the long range capabilities are lower now, and against any target(Even air depending on angle). When it comes to long range AV, NC have it the worst... Enforcer is very difficult to use due to it's drop, making it more of a medium range weapon, and the Mjolnir isn't worth mentioning. At the very least Vanu get the Aphelion which has incredible accuracy even at range.

Do you really need me to spell it out for you?

http://ps2oraclestats.com/monthlystats/
Take a look at "Monthly Weapon Stats: MBT Secondary Weapons" and "Monthly Weapon Stats: MBT Harasser Weapons". Check out Avg Uniques and Avg Playtime (h).

The Gatekeepers prowess is no secret. And it's lack of kills is due to people not bothering to fight it. How many Gatekeepers sit idle in zergs, not padding the stats you're so fond of?

TR was getting butchered on the battlefield before the Gatekeeper was released. Now TR is rocking. It's called Easy To Spawn & Spam Extreme Range AV. You'll notice the current main punching bag NC does not have Easy To Spawn & Spam Extreme Range AV. Without it, you can't dent an armor zerg in many areas of the maps in the Standard Game (without overwhelming numbers).
But naaaaah, Gatekeeper OP plz nurf.

By far the best bet (w/ a design/balanced challenged Dev like SOE/DBG) is to either:
1) nerf the Gatekeeper into the ground, OR
2) give every Faction a Gatekeeper equivalent (since it's really the most effective vs. other Ground Vehicles... when nothing can poke it back)

The GK, like all secondaries has to compete against the main cannon in order to get the kill. A competition it's FAR more likely to lose than a saron is to the FPC on the magrider for example.

You can't point to those stats in isolation and use those to support your point because of that simple fact.

In fact, even with having to compete against the highest DPS main cannon of all the primaries, it's still managing to get those KPH figures regardless shows there's something to look at in terms of balance.

Vulcan is love, Vulcan is life

I oppose your suggestions because:

1) Then why did they add the Gatekeeper?
2) Then does the TR get a copy of allegedly OP weapons from other factions
3) If 1) OR 2) What is the point of playing any faction, lets just make everything NS and bland.

I don't actually own a Gatekeeper, but I've used it a fair bit when I gun for people.

Here's my experience:

It is pretty bad at killing infantry that have mobility (I.E. any infantry that isn't in a door or is camping or AFK).

It is good against Magriders, because the velocity lets it keep up with their mobility.

Its decentish vs. Vanguards that don't use their shields.


Summary: Its good against larger vehicle targets, and if the target has a good profile, it can keep up with faster targets, but against small faster targets, its not that great.

Vulcan is generally better, Aphelion and Saron are more annoying.

I think the most important point from this discussion is that people are generally prone to siloing and skub-warring.

Recommendation: Just leave the Gatekeeper alone. I find it hard to believe that TR are suddenly super-powered or in the ascendance solely because of one weapon.