[Suggestion] Nerf Mosquito and Scythe Air to air and buff Reaver

So thats why i getting rekt the **** out of me? Reaver is just ****?
Nose to nose is no for me, i know if they turn to me i have to avoid fighting... they just kill me in no time and like my bullets do nothing.

Is funny to plane it... but is seriously that ****?

Wow man, you sure are a salty person. Think I'll just avoid talking to you now since you cannot be civil.

That's, uh, not how I understood skill ceiling to work. By your logic, the flaregun has an incredibly high skill ceiling, because it is practically impossible to use effectively. Decreasing velocity doesn't raise the skill ceiling alone, as it doesn't actually do anything to make skilled players more effective. Now, if you traded decreased velocity for increased damage, or decreased RoF for decreased CoF, these would be examples of a raised skill ceiling.

With increased bullet speed those with bad aim still are not helped but those with good aim and wish to train harder get more for their efforts. So skill cap is raised.

So Jawarisin has an alt in NC that was last played in April... is that suppose to convince me of anything?

You seem overly biased by going against balancing the ESF between factions so I called it out.

The thing is as it stands, bullet velocity could be lowered and you could still attain great accuracy. See it this way, tankbuster's velocity is 300m/s. Obviously it's used at close range, but you can nail people 500m away still. Of course it's not super accurate, damage falls off, and it't becomes unreliable.

See it this way, let's take the other extreme: Would making the weapon hit-scan make the skill ceiling higher or lower?
As long as you can guarantee to nearly always hit if you do it right, decreasing velocity is fine. Now of course, if you take it too far, it just becomes an unreliable weapon.

Imagine it on the ground: Bullet drop/travel time vs No bullet drop/travel time (hitscan)


Hopefully you get what I meant now.

an "alt"? It's br 102 you idiot. And it was last played in May. Which is because I left with my laptop at the moment. I don't have access to my desktop.

But then again, my bet is you're br 30 and you think you know something.

Sure, but decreasing velocity doesn't increase the skill ceiling. The TB is a good example of a high skill ceiling weapon because it is relatively difficult to use effectively because of its low accuracy, but can absolutely wreck an opponent in the hands of a skilled user. If it were hitscan, the skill ceiling would increase slightly (the weapon would become more effective in the hands of a skilled user), but the skill floor would raise significantly.

If we were to imagine a low damage output hitscan weapon, the skill ceiling would be rather low, as a highly skilled user would not be able to use the weapon much more effectively than a moderately skilled user, and the skill ceiling would be low, as even someone who can't aim should be able to score hits by waving their mouse around.

Not entirely true. Higher velocity would raise the skill floor some, but I'd agree that a skilled player would be able to get more use out of the velocity increase than a less skilled player.

If I may add something, what I'm about to type isn't related to Scythe, Reaver, Mossie balance. It's just something I think is missing in the arguments being made.

Skill ceiling is almost impossible to change in a vacuum. In the case of guns in games, relative weapon effectiveness is decided by many, but what can be boiled down to 3 main, interconnecting factors.

And that's the thing, changes to skill ceiling affect the other 2 (2 when heavily simplified) factors. Again, let me repeat, this is some serious summarization. They are skill floor, and versatility.

For example, the aforementioned cone of fire which is very easily described by the skyguard. Increasing cone of fire changes those factors in the following way:

1: Ability to hit a stationary or moving target increases. The spread makes it easier for *SOME* hits to connect and *SOME* damage to happen. This lowers the skill FLOOR.
2: Number of misses increase based on the size of the target. Decreases versatility at long range (or against small targets up close) as damage will happen, but not at a rate high enough to deter or kill a target.
3. Ability to put ALL damage outputted (paper DPS --> DMG and ROF formula) decreases. This lowers the skill ceiling as no matter how skiiled you get, some RNG will counteract your pro aim.

And these are just 1 way each that each of those 3 catagories is affected. There are more.

For example: 4. In relation to number 2 above, versatility at close range increases as the target is less able to dodge incoming fire.

What I'm saying is that the statements that "This goes up" or "this goes down" alone really doesn't discuss the point y'all are trying to make in full.

I notice 2 or so people discussing more than 1 aspect and I think the discussion would benefit from more people following those other people's leads.

Y'all can go back to y'all's discussion about which ESF is better now. (or let it go as I think people in this thread are a tad too polarized to acknowledge other's points. hint hint )

Over my dead body.

I wonder how the Vortek will compare now that the Maelstrom is being bought up to par.
The Mossie one didn't get buffed that much though.

Yeah, reading over my previous comments, I got skill floor backwards. Oops

Return mass acceleration to the game and we be good to go again. Reaver will be able to dive and get a bunch of extra speed with it's weight :3

TBF I am glad to come across this... I myself have been a Reaver pilot for not that long and on multiple occasions I get pawned by Mossi but mostly Scythe pilots... I have been flying for around a month and I think the Reaver is definitely the hardest to use out of all of the ESFs. The Mosquito was so incredibly easy to maneuver for me and I was killing pretty high level Scythe pilots and Reaver pilots as well starting a new TR account and I wouldn't even want to discuss how easy the Scythe was to fly. However there was one time I was literally using the default Reaver load out (with exception of Hover 3, max Stealth and FS4) and I had managed to take out a whole 5 man scythe squadron (3 of which rank 90 and above) alone during aerial anomalies which was nothing less than a fluke. The Reaver is certainly the most rewarding but is most highly situational out of the 3 ESFs and I don't see how anyone is able to pull this off in a Mossi or Scythe as I've seen insane TR and VS pilots but if I have somewhat capable wingman we are usually able to quick dispatch and eliminate the target no matter what rank or load out the opponent is using. From this post I think I will persist to train with the Reaver... Then I will be able to achieve true air superiority.

The real problem is lockons... And the ridiculous Skygaurd...

You're right about the Reaver!


If you're talking about lock on missiles from the ground, the whole trick is to fight away from battles or high enough to not get locked in the first place. If you run default or extended fuel pods, you can simply afterburn away from ground locks when you get the lock warning.

If you're having trouble against air locks, you can simply stay in a reverse maneuver and keep moving and they won't be able to track you. Thankfully this change finally happened.

Given your name, and that you speak English, I'm guessing you're on Connery. Message me if you want to do some dueling. I play all three factions on that server and dueling at the warp gate is the best way to get better.