Shotguns and Elitists, Part II

Yea, the issue I was addressing here was more of the oxymoron of "SMG's are okay but shotguns aren't", since ya know, SMG's turn the game into a point-and-click certventure game.

Why hello reclaimer alt!

If you want my stats, go ahead.

SupremeGundem

GundemDakka


Also, Liberty, what's up with the 6 KDR with shotguns? I would understand if that was my KDR when shotgun kills are re-added, but then my lifetime KDR is still like 1.2 for my VS. Even with vehicle deaths removed it's nearly the same.

As for my TR, as you can see my stats range from well-above average to extremely high, in fact my accuracy for the MSW-R is highest on Connery and #7 worldwide. KDR is nearly 2 for TR as well.

Brought it up in the last thread, might as well do it in this one as well.

At least infantry can choose to use what weapon type they want. NC MAXes don't get any choice but shotgun or shotgun, while TR/VS MAXes get effectively equal (but with massively larger mag sizes) to anything from Carbines to SMGs.


And no, I am still not going to give this up. It is well past a ******* disgrace at this point.

Ok I don't care if you believe me or not, but this offends me. I've never once made a forum alt. And quite frankly, YOU guys were the ones who dug up my alt's stats and used them to make personal attacks against me. I've never ONCE made your stats the basis of my argument.

I don't care about your stats. I'm not even going to look at those links. And I damn sure am not going to take the time to make a forum alt just to stoop to your level and make some silly stat-baiting argument...

Good for you, if you didn't ask for my stats then don't look.

And if that character is an alt of yours, then tell us, what is your main's name?

Sometimes stats are necessary in order to indicate the experience of a player.

Wait now, back up. You accused me of making a forum alt and now are changing the subject.

Why would you make the knee-jerk assumption that he was me? I really want to know. You are showing some classic signs of a Narcissist complex, and I think you might need help. Do you think you are so loved, so intelligent, so well liked that NOBODY else could possibly show any hostility toward you but me?

i dont care about any elitism, about any pseudo combat-etiquette, about the loadout of my opponent, about his skill sets, about his rage tells, or about anything of that matter...

i love shotguns and i will use them if the situation allows it. i especially enjoy the Baron and Phobos (VS pump). and most notably i dont care about any auraxium medals... i just love killing people with shotguns

And once again I must point out the extreme hypocrisy of the OP, who's apparently obsessed with others in-game stats, accusing people of "elitism"....

Could work.

Shotguns are absolutely not forgiving. If you rely on your COF to hit people you are at too long a range and your damage falloff will have started and the RNG will dictate you'll be able to hit a complete zero to 3 or 4 pellets to hit. Not a good thing to rely on for any kill, and relying on COF will simply get you killed.

Ok, so you are saying that we can hit 100% pellets, which means extreme CQC and high accuracy.
However, the Orion example below does not require extreme CQC or that high an accuracy.

Difference is that Orions are often used at ranges they aren't supposed to, lowering their accuracy and TTK. Imagine if the players used them only at the right distances just like shotguns have to, the accuracy and TTK would level out quickly.

Yeah, since Orion users always need multiple magazines to kill one player! You can see that the calculation is coming up with numbers that are simply not realistic unless you engage someone and allow him to escape... Oh, which rarely happens with shotguns because they are kill or be killed weapons!

I don't think that's the problem. Even if I take 8 shots to kill someone I get hate tells about shotgun being a noob weapon, even when they shoot me repeatedly I sometimes get hate tells.
Oracle of Death also seems to indicate (or someone said it, didn't check) that shotguns are some of the worst weapon in terms of KPH, KPU and whatever. So why the hate? Because they feel the weapon is somehow giving the opponent an advantage?

You have to have perfect aim to come out on top! You are using either a low-ROF automatic shotgun or a lower ROF semi-auto! Simply gunning away is a really, really bad way to deal with enemies since in CQC almost any movement will get you out of the crosshairs and even the COF. In the previous thread they showcased Iridars video which showed exactly that: aiming just off the target in effective CQC gets you too little hits, if you get hits at all. a Carbine can easily be hipfired and you just have to try and look in the enemy direction for some hits, but doing something like that with a shotgun will just leave you with no ammo and a really angry enemy right next to you.

Yeah you do need extreme aim. Otherwise people would be able to do 4 or 5 kills with a semi-auto shotgun regularly.

Only if your aim is good will it stack things in a shotguns favor. You need an extreme management of range to get that favor in the first place.

They are absolutely, definitely not.

Who care's what their opinion is.

The fact remains there are people who want to impose a stupid set of rules on others. Whether it be no shotguns or other non-sanctioned weapons on the ground. Or no lockons on ESFs in the air. And they use demagoguery to attain said rules by calling others scrubs, exploiters, and saying its not 'honurbru'.

Ok I can get behind that. But where are all the people calling for no shotguns?

As far as I can tell the OP got some hate tells, and because he's such an attention ***** and narcissist, had to make 30 pages threads about it.

They saw how badly the Skyknight nosegunners get reamed.

It was actually my observation of streamers, which I clearly stated in my first thread.

And if I got a hate-tell for using a shotgun, I'd be celebrating. In all my years of shotgun use I've gotten like 2 rage tells. Connery fellas just have too thick skin.

I applaud your actually forming a solid case in this thread, but there is one major factor you're not considering: Overkill shots.

Even on my MSW-R, with which I am #7 worldwide and #1 on Connery, I couldn't manage more then 36% accuracy simply because I can't easily predict how many hits my target will take, and often I spent a few bullets on an already-dead target. This isn't as much of an issue with semi-auto weapons.

You can see on my CARV that I stopped trying to be super MLG-leet accurate and went for kills, and while my accuracy suffered my KDR and KPH are significantly higher.


I mean, in the average CQC battle, 3 seconds would be a loooong-*** time, way longer then most engagements.

#1 on the server and #7 worldwide with the MSW...and you sat there and told me to my face you main Light Assault? LOL OK!!!

Just another HA overshield crutching MLG elitist!

First of all...

FOR.

*****.

SAKE.

USE.

THE.

REPLY.

FUNCTION.



Second of all, 2 LMG araxiums does not mean I am only playing HA. For my TR I am currently headed towards the LMG Directive, but for my VS I've actually been getting into SMG infil lately.


13000 of my kills on my main are on my LA. 2700 of them are HA. So much for HA crutching(Which by the way, if I'm holding a point, then it's not crutching to play the point-holding class). I have more hours on a single carbine on my VS main then I do for 2.5 LMG araxiums for my TR.


Oh, also, did you know that part of my point in my last thread was that after only a short time as HA, I manage blue-ribbon level accuracy with a normal weapon?

I suppose you wouldn't understand the concept of being a skilled player, since all your stats are sub-par anyway. Unless you'd like to show us this mythical main of yours that supposedly has at least average accuracy or KPH.

After you've made it clear how much it bothers you? Not likely lol.

And thanks for making my point and being so obsessed with stats. Just like an ELITIST.

So, in order to further your argument, your brilliant strategy is to inconvenience me by not using the reply button? I'm simply trembling in my booties, how ever will I stand up to this mountainous wall of solid evidence and logic?

And how I have proved to you that I am the elitist? Your posts are getting less and less sane as you go, you've got to try harder.

Sure, I use stats a lot in these threads: For the sole purpose of deflecting the "mad cus bad" argument that inevitably would be used against us(Read: bLind)..

Actually, that's not the sole purpose. If stats weren't used, there would be no basis of this argument in the first place. If I couldn't say "Hey, LPK shows 80% of players can't consistently use shotguns to their fullest potential!", my arguement would lack substance. I could yak on till my jaw fell off and start beating people with it, but I wouldn't have any way to prove my point.

In the scientific community, you can't just go up and say "I feel like x is y because z", and expect people to act like you've just discovered the 4th law of motion. If you can't back up your claim with statistical evidence then your claim lacks substance or credibility.

Here's to hoping you actually read this and actually recognize how insane you sound.

You don't use stats scientifically. You use them to say "Oh look I'm better, therefore you should shut up".

That's elitism. Stop dodging it and just own it. Face it, you are an elitist.

No I just think you are so desperate for validation and attention you have to hit refresh to constantly get forum alerts. So it apparently just drives you crazy that I don't use "reply" all the time even when there's no reason to.

Thank you for proving that you completely lack reading comprehension, otherwise you would see that for 90% of both of these threads I use stats to show that shotguns are actually an inferior class of weapon that require skill to use even in close range. This is the stance I have taken since I first posted my first thread, hasn't changed.


And no, also, it's just really ******* inconsiderate to not use the reply function. But I guess you don't want a legitimate discussion anyway, so it hardly matters.

Considerate? YOU!!? HAHAHAH OMG.

SIr, that ship sailed long ago. The very first thing you did when we first met here was start making personal attacks. Since then you've only gotten more obnoxious and trollish.

And it's not just me. I know you don't realize this, but well, you're kind of a tool to just about everyone that doesn't agree with you.

Never personally attacked you, I simply asserted that without having flown yourself, the value of your opinion was severely diminished.

So, would you mind getting of my thread if you have nothing constructive to add? Frankly I should have asked this yesterday, but I suppose we all make mistakes.