(PA) Shotguns Nerfed...?

Was there a stealth nerf to PA shotguns lately? I've been playing for about an hour now and the only thing I've been able to actually kill in one shot has been infiltrators. Literally everyone else has been two or three shots if they weren't already injured.
If so, they're pretty gimped now; useless for breaching. Otherwise, if not, what the hell? It can't be hit detection as almost all of my targets have been left with about 10-20% health, depending on spread luck -- so hits are registering (for the most part).

This is very confusing and frustrating, so any light that can be shed on this would be appreciated.

Only shotguns that can 1-shot people are pump actions and the Jackhammer. Most shotguns have 130x6 pellets for 780 total damage per shot, while pump actions have 130x10/130x11 pellets for 1300/1430 total damage.

I don't know the exact math on slugs, but if you don't want to run pump action (and don't have access to the Jackhammer) you might want to try slugs. They work decently even though you still can't one shot anyone because you can start firing from further away and all of the damage lands (or none if ya miss)

There was no nerf that I am aware of.

http://ps2guides.besaba.com/mechanics#slugs

• Slug damage is hidden and can't be accessed in game, but it was datamined from the game client:
  • Full Auto and Semi-Auto slug damage: 500 @ 10m - 360 @ 40m
  • Pump Action slug damage: 800 @ 10m - 400 @ 40m
  • Remember, that shotguns do 150% damage on headshots instead of usual 200%, and it affects slugs too.
• Slug Ammunition increases cone of fires by 75%, which makes the weapon even less accurate.
• Slugs inherit the velocity of the shotgun they're used with, except for the NS Baron G5, which has 300 m/s slug velocity (prooflink).

Yeah, PA shotties shoot sponges. I don't think this is due to a recent nerf, though; they've been this way for a while.
In my experience, the only real reason to use them is for the 'fun factor' of one-shotting someone in the face (as rarely as that actually works with the abysmal hit detection) or for the 'humiliation factor' when you kill someone with one.
They certainly aren't a strategic choice of weapon in any situation.

I was using PA shotty (Bruiser) last night and it was one shotting majority of the time.

One HA seemed to shield at the most opportune time and saved himself and I had a few instances of what seemed to be poor hit detection when a few other guys didn't die in one shot during a huge battle.

Then there was that one HA who I shot in the back twice at point blank, and then knifed because he was still standing, who still kept going only to be gunned down by someone else a few seconds later; not sure if that was lag, hit detection, or even potentially a cheat.

So no the PA shotguns haven't been Nerfed, but they seem to suffer to hit detection issues more noticably than other weapons.

shotguns got nerfed a while ago.. their pellet counts got completely destroyed.. now you have to either use pumps or get headshot everytime.. they are so dumb to use over smgs now and more often that not youl be mutually killed by any lmg/smg around unlike the old days where close ranges shotguns rocked..

i dont think (pump-action) shotguns were nerfed, rather it is just inconsistent damage/performance coupled with occasional lag/hitregistry issues that ruins the experience.

like for instance, i often manage to kill people with my Baron from midrange (!) which is like within 30 meters. but sometimes when people are standing at spitting distance to me multiple properly placed shots wont kill them while they easily kill me with automatic weapons (happens especially often against TR assault rifle users... hmmm).

i dont know what's causing this issue. guess you have to live with the fact that shotgun performance has serious woes.

Oo... did not know that. I used it a bit and it seemed ok -- but that's good to know!

Wait, don't slugs improve your CoF? Because when I used to use the Thanatos with slugs (before they were nerfed), my CoF became noticeably smaller.

According to datamined attachment effects, increases CoF by 75%, as written in CoFScalar = 1.0 + 0.75
Laser Sight, for example, reduces CoF by 35%, as written CoFScalar = 1.0 - 0.33

I still don't fully believe it, as I've used slugs a lot, and it didn't seem to have THAT terrible of an accuracy. But it's not something you can test easily, as CoF is hard to see with normal buckshot.

Shotgun's hip fire crosshair is not something you should pay a lot of faith too.

The laser part might actually explain my issue. I used to use a laser sight with slugs, and it (the CoF) was INCREDIBLY small. But to be honest, the only shotgun you really want to aim with is the automatic one; the thing's RoF makes hipfire accuracy so bad.

Not sure what you mean, I've played with slugs on all shotguns, and I advise to always aim down sights with them, unless within a contact shot distance. Laser doesn't help much. Like I said, it's a placebo effect due to crosshair size, which doesn't reflect the real state of CoF.

As you can see, even with laser and within 5m slugs tend to aim outside head hitbox.

Of course you would want to aim with slugs; they're different (kill them). Unlike slugs, unmodded shotguns will nearly ALWAYS land a hit if you hipfire an enemy at ~8 meters, because of spread and all. It's for this reason that you don't want to aim with shotguns, or at least aim with them too much. This comes from my viewpoint regarding ADS and the apparent recoil you experience when you fire, especially with shotguns.

However, ADSing using an automatic shotgun is definitely a good thing, because it is auto fire, meaning that your CoF doesn't reset after firing (although there is a delay with a duration I am unsure about). The CoF on auto shotties gets so out of hand, so ADSing, which helps the spread of any weapon, makes up for that.

As for the laser sight with slugs, I don't use them anymore. I actually don't use SHOTGUNS in general, unless it's with my NC character (because I want the Brawler for the ultimate troll). It can be agreed that slugs and laser sights do badly at even short ranges, but laser sights do actually affect slug landings in a positive way (although incredibly meager in that effect). Also, I like how you took the time to make a video, with music that seems totally unserious in nature. Thanks for making me think about life

Music I was just listening to while recording Shadowplay records all. I was curious about this topic for a while - just how useful a laser sight is for slugs - so this was sort of a kick in the back for me to finally get around to it.

When you said "aiming with shotguns" i thought we were speaking about slugs only.

if i use slug ammo with my NC Bruiser, the crosshair circle becomes much smaller, which would seem to indicate the accuracy improves. and i have found that it does improve.

also when using slug ammo if i crouch the crosshair gets even smaller, allowing me to semi snipe people with it. if it really got 75% larger as you suggest, you would never hit anybody with it, at all, ever.

Not quite the direction I intended the thread to go, but good info nevertheless. Personally, I dislike slugs as I prefer getting in people's face and either filling the role of sneaking around and taking people out from behind (hence the preference toward pump-actions and the OHK potential), or breaching rooms/breaking small groups.

Unfortunately, I'm on about day five of hit detection being absolutely **** out of nowhere. Today has, thus far, been the most egregious, as I'm literally running and colliding with my targets, ensuring the only thing on my entire screen is their torso and firing. Yet, despite that, it feels about half the time my shots do nothing. And yes, while the in-game responses I've gotten have been amusing ("I too, suffer from missitis" is arguably my favorite), it's not helping me figure out what the hell changed that's affecting my overall game.


I've been using the same basic arsenal for roughly two years now, so I think the drastic drop-off in K/D* is pretty indicative that something changed for the worse. I don't know what else to say. Obviously no one else is noticing this or I imagine this thread wouldn't have deviated as it did. But it's affecting my performance, and each time I blast someone in the face two or three times only to have them LOLSPRAY me to death with their SMG, it makes the game a little less fun, until eventually I ragequit out of frustration.

* That spike on the 15th is likely due to me favouring other weapons (phoenix/blackhand) after making this post. Easier to stay alive when I'm spending most of the battle behind a rock. :/

Hit detection is inconsistent. When I have the time to play, lately, I play for a lot of hours in a row. I can say Hit detection depends on the load of the server. In the morning (CEST) it's good, then it starts to decline.
The effect is exhacerbated by the number of people in the fight too.

Hit detection is terrible..I miss shots in 2m that in normal situation can't miss. I lol when BR1-10 kill me when I unload 8 rounds of baron shotgun into them.

I had a VS infil kill me after I put 8 slugs from my Baron into him a few days ago. Insane.