[Suggestion] BF2142 LMG's are the solution to the Heavy Problem

Medic's were supposed to be the defacto choice for infantry combat. It was stated in design notes (I've been told at least) and I've seen references to this fact repeatedly over the years. Engineers, LA's, Infaltrators, and Heavies the support specialists helping masses of medics to take points.

That's never been the case.

The over shield is superior to everything and medpacks make the occasional need for healing irrelevant. The LMG is pretty much it when it comes to infantry weapons: very controlable at short and medium and larger magazines vs. the Assualt Rifle and Carbine.


So, make some of the LMGs a support weapon ala BF 2142. In that game, the LMG was functional running and gunning, but clearly outclasses by other infantrys weapons. It shined under sustain fired. The longer you shot it, the tighter its cone of fire got. It made it viable at range when you had 3 second to 'rev up' the guns fire. It created great covering fire situations where a couple LMG's focus firing a point prevented all but the newest of players from rounding a corner/door/position and helped the more 'run and gun' classes to approach.

If you give heavies this great tool to help pushes or cover doors AND slow down heavies by 25% whilst giving them increased health you might force players to choose other classes, opening up the infantry combat and creating a more diverse role within PS2.

Heavies are already slowed down when they turn on their shield. They have no increased health without the shield.

That's because it was not in any of the known or quoted design notes. It's only ever been the opinion of an unrelated bunch of forum-goers that there should be a defacto "Medium Assault" that should have been the go-to class and the Combat Medic is the often chosen pedestal. The words usually spoken are "that seems to be what was expected."

The designated support class supposed to be the frontline infantry?

What are you smoking?

Proof?

Because as far as I know heavies were always mean to be the frontline class. It says so in the class description.

I always thought LA was supposed to be the standard soldier. I thought that was everyone one else's favoitue class when I first started playing this game but quickly learned everyone was playing HA like me.

Negative cone of fire bloom? Ugh!
I've seen that mechanic in other games and I find it very counterintuitive and downright uncomfortable to use.

That mechanic was fantastic. It wasn't counter-intuitive though. The gun was a mini-gun, and it basically worked the same way as the TR mini-gun; In 2143 the gun fired immediately, but the shots went wild, so it wasn't effective Then it had a steady rate of fire that become more deadly with increased accuracy. The PS gun takes a second to start firing, then becomes more deadly by speeding up the rate of fire, rather than tightening the cone of fire. Different approaches, but the end result is basically the same.

What I really miss about 2142 was fire modes that actually changed the way that the guns handled. (single shot, triple shot, auto fire) In PS, just tapping your mouse button quickly has the same effect as single shot mode.

I hope it's legal in my country because I want some.

oh god no, 2142 LMGs were the most awkward damn things ever. I managed to make the Ganz work and had a 1.89 KD over all in that game, but yikes, I never want that style of LMG ever again. BF2 Prject Reality kinda used that method, longer you fire, the more accurate you are......ugh...and 2142, crouching was the most accurate, prone was terrible and standing was terrible....crouch, ADS, fire....ofc, the Ganz locked up after 20 rounds, you had to fire like 12 to zero it in, and it took about 10 to kill someone.....so sometimes you could just barely finish someone off. And attacking? forget it, Ganz was a terrible attacking weapon, walk around a corner and Baur vs Ganz? Baur wins. Ganz vs Voss? Voss wins. Ganz vs Morietti Sniper Rifle? Sniper wins. Ganz vs SMG? Ganz wins, SMGs were terrible weapons in that game, those engineer weapons....omg.....

No, PS2 LMGs need their accuracy and bloom back, not nerfed further.

Though the Ganz kit did come with a permanent Infiltrator Dart style item =D IDS? Love it. Got called a hacker so damn often using that.

I could see a "prone" LMG stance, or a "deploy LMG"; with folding bi/tri-pod being placed on some boxes, on a roadblock,..
Game is not designed for it.
In the "more shooty, more accurate", it becomes terrible for attacking, and even on defense, do you expect heavies to keep "suppresion" firing? Because otherwise, enemy comes into view, the LMG is "cold"; at the worst possible accuracy anyway.


LMG's very controllable?
Gauss Saw vertical recoil/shot: 0.55.
Reaper DMR: 0.44. Aaand the reaper gets the "super compensator", for 25% vertical recoil reduction.
How about.. Gauss Rifle, vs Anchor.
Gauss Rifle: 0.3. Anchor: 0.4. So.. an extra 33% vertical recoil.

TR: T1 cycler: 0.27 vertical/shot. Carv: 0.4.


In general, there can be an advantage in horizontal recoil; LMG's tend to have low horizontal recoil, or rather AR's and carbines can have bigger horizontal recoil..
However, that is largely beaten by the better ADS moving accuracy. (Carv: 0.4. Cycler: 0.3. Gauss Saw: 0.5. Reaper DMR: 0.32)
Another big consideration is the by far better hipfire. Moving hipfire with the Gauss Saw is 4.5; the Reaper DMR is 3.
Carbines get to be better.
Since you mentioned short range.. hipfire is pretty important.
Also, 0.75 ADS speed for all factions in both AR's and carbines now. Besides the NS weapons I mean.
Finally, higher DPS available, through higher rate of fire.
AR wise:
TR has Cycler TRV & TAR; NC GR22; VS HV45; outdps-ing all LMG's.
Carbines: Lync, GD7F or bandit, VX6-7 or Serpent.

Would I like an LMG for light assault? YES. To shoot at stuff from rooftops; not really for CQC.
I would actually be thrilled if I got the option to run assault rifle on the heavy assault; shorter reloads, more accurate on the move,..

Funny, because the Medics in this game DO have the best weapons. Best handling, best accuracy, and generally good range. LMGs are definitely NOT the defacto weapon in PS2. LMGs are high recoil, and have the worst accuracy for automatics in the game. They have big clips and big reload times. They have some stats that are pertinent to range, but their handling and accuracy generally forces them into CQ to be their most effective.

Heavies as a platform are very on/off. You either have your shield fully charged, or you don't. If you don't, you have the game's most inaccurate tier of weapons and an equal or only slightly higher (relative to how much charge is in your shield) health pool. This is what leads some heavies to choose such weapons as SMGs or Shotguns. Which could potentially make them better than other classes SMG/Shotgun loadouts (aside from not having the LA jetpack), but that's not the argument you are making.

I was happy they reduced the LMG effectiveness in CQC, though i forget which GU it was. Though i'm finding time and time again i run SMG and it's not even a real bother at range if i can find a way to close distance effectively, although mainly because the G-SAW is more of a pain at that sweet spot vs other faction LMG's. It has bizarre traits that really ruin it as an LMG.

LMGs are meant to be wild, inaccurate weapons while moving, but super accurate death machines when 'deployed'. PS2's LMGs are just less-accurate assault rifles. LMGs are not the best weapons in the game - assault rifles are superior in their damage/RoF models for the most part and have substantially more controllable recoil (Reaper DMR versus NC6 Gauss SAW, no contest). The fundamental problem with LMGs is that they're designed wrong.

Reaper vs SAW is a great analogy, and I actually use that mentally to differentiate the differences between the two weapon classes because of how defined the differences are. I also just used like 6 variations of the same word I think.

Take CoF off ADS on all weapons, rebalance from there.

What's the heavy problem exactly? Noobs like using them?

Noobs don't know what's good for them. They're noobs, that's just what they do. Unless they're zerglings, then they do what Noobs do, but slightly better.

Cuz if they were designed right no one would use them. They would be horrible weapons that just make the user a sniper bait....and just so 1 dimensional no body would take one. Hence why in like BF3 and stuff, most people run around wtih carbines and ars...LMGs even in that game are rarer....I like PS2's old LMG accuracy, they were pretty much high mag cap Assault Rifles. OP? maybe....but atleast viable for the first time in a long itme. 2142 LMGs were viable, but limited as defensive weapons. But they gave that kit a radar device, it really made the kit really nice. Got many hackusations.

Weeeelll...personally, I think Infiltrators should not be in the game, at least not with their current weapon selection (everyone feel free to hate me, idgaf). Snipers are a part of the problem with PS2's current base design, as it renders any form of tactical gameplay completely useless and forces everyone into camping doorways. If snipers have to remain, LMGs mostly have to stay as they are.

Yea right dude, I would love that as I was using support a lot in 2142 but fun fact there was a bug with some of the weapons I found that the Ganz bullets were actually bottom left corner of the cross hairs. One shotted and sniped fools with a hmg it was bloody awesome.

I personally think cloaking shouldnt be in any game. Sniping is not that OP in this game. I find the stalker cloak and NS super pistols to be more problematic then any sniper rifle.