Going Prone

well this is not BF2. PS2 actually has proper physics for player models that react to steps, hills etc.

Well, in this game, infantry animations are linear. You know when you die on a hill, half of your body is merged into the hill? Or on the edge of the steps your stiff corpse is floating? If you prone, I could imagine that this is how it will work unless they overhaul how the infantry models function.

Proper physics seems to only apply to aircraft, as I can drift my lightning across 30m of rough terrain to spin around a harasser which is bouncing upside-down because of a bump in the terrain map.

Has been asked for in the past many of times. I would like it to be a feature. Most people don't want it though.

I'm not for adding prone ingame, but your comment is just hilarious / not worth good FPS player. Basically you're saying that because you're not skilled enough to react to prone guys, it shouldn't be in the game... BF4, BF3 have this and there are no problems with it. Being prone means you can't move fast. It's a trade.

Thank you for your completely polite and kind response, it reminds me of the people on defiance who say "What? Solid reasoning why shotguns on a whole do the worst dps in the game, clearly you need to get better scrub".

I also immensely enjoy the fact you did not bother to quote the rest of the post which indicates heavy problems that are common in games were prone exists (especially battlefield. watching the sniper whose barrel is looking towards the sky kill people below him because models and physics are hard is stupid or looking at a guy whose model is halfway clipping through a wall when on an objective), this was a major part of the argument so the fact you didn't respond to it just validates it more.

Regardless, the point here is that these things bring an inarguable advantage to protecting objectives even without the clipping issues. A guy on the ground has far more time to react to a new entry than the person who has to adjust their aim, going into an objective already has severe disadvantages because you may not know where the enemies are holding up, add to that there could be three guys laying down in different corners of the room makes it even more of a hassle.

Haha like sniping does anything in this game.

"But it increases mah KD!" you then say?

Yeah, head over to stats.dasanfall.com and be in for a shock.

I don't sugarcoat for people. I tell you how it is. Here is the quote then

In Battlefield 3/4 going prone as a sniper would result either in showing your legs or your gun, which means you're easier to spot over distance and in some cases easier to kill. It is a disadvantage. And your head was always visible to the person you were shooting at, except he would notice you faster and shoot back for your head. For you as a player it makes no difference if lying sniper aims up or down so why would you complain about it?

You also bring in how it may look like, but the only problem of clipping in the wall is that lying infantry may be killed from the outside. However in BF4 if you try to lie in the corner, you'll moved forward. No clipping occurs.

Going prone is a trade-off. You're trading your mobility for a moment of surprise. You still can't grasp the concept it seems. The only issue here would be a very little profile at greater distances for snipers. But as other class, you still won't easily hit a cloaker who's crouched behind a rock and only head is seen same as with lying. So a sniper would have more choices. That's the only thing that can make Infiltrator OP.

I simply don't bother to reply to everything people write because I don't have the time for it. Even less time when it's poorly written argumentation like yours.

Then I hope you can keep that level of confidence for yourself because it certainly doesn't come off as that way when you respond. Trying to tell someone you won't respond to their points because your above them simply makes it look like your avoiding the topic, attempting to belittle the other persons statements does the same thing. When a person responds to every point and counterpoint you make in an argument saying you won't respond because it was "Poorly Written" comes off as a simple defensive measure to avoid the topic altogether. So please, enjoy your fantasy where you stepped off on the high note here.

But just to humor you I will address you last point, mobility is a complete non-issue in the situations I described. I don't need to do a wall-run or jetpack around the room when engaging someone in close quarters or defending a point indoors. I don't need to go into a full sprint as a sniper. Considering a major part of the game ( Mainly, capturing objectives) ends up being a close quarters indoor battle mobility isn't exactly a pressing issue. Being able to respond to a threat entering a room immediately and with surprise is a hell of an advantage though. Most TTK times average around 2 seconds that gives them very little time to react to being surprised and dealing with a smaller target. That is the concept you still can't grasp it seems.

I'd played BF3 for several years, a game where TTK is less than in PS2. Going prone added a skill element to the fight where prone person needed better aim to use the surprise and entering person needed to think better where to possibly aim. Like I said, it's a trade off, I'm basing this off my experience as a lying soldier or the one entering. And off my experience I'm telling you that more than often I was crouched than prone! I was not the one with KDR below 1, on the opposite i usually would kill many people before dying. Mobility is not an issue? For prone soldier? So when I throw a grenade inside or start prefiring, shooting around corner with ADAD or just bunnyhop around prone soldier who CAN'T turn that fast, needs to stand up or run, you're telling me it's not a bad mobility? The worst thing you can do as a defender indoors is being static, not being able to hide behind corner or obstacle. That's what prone does to you at expense of "surprise/small profile".

Your argument is that you need to react better to someone "small" and prone "somewhere". I'm telling you as an experienced player it's an addition of skill to the game, which is more fun, and it's also a trade-off. I never heard any good FPS complain about having to aim better like it was a bad thing.

Making your logic more extreme, let's remove crouch, such way you only need to aim on the chest/head level! Makes things much easier and "fun" for players who don't wanna bother to learn aiming. Now this must seem to you like I'm getting on my High Horse again, but this is what your argument is about: "I don't wanna have more effort in aiming". So yes, I get the concept of being "lazy".

And to reassure you - I'm not discussing / arguing with you out of my ego of wanting to defend going "prone". I DON'T need this in Planetside. My only motive is to make someone understand that he is just a whiny gamer who wants things easier (oups, high horse again). Some gamers just whine too much instead of trying to learn.

So chill, I'm not making you to get better in FPS, there will be NO prone. You may exhale happily that your spray'n'pray, run'n'gun tactics of clearing out people indoors is not endangered.

If they add prone there needs to be an animation and a delay to match it, especially for getting back up. Otherwise you will end up with the 'dolphin diving' meta of BF2 which looked absolutely ridiculous or other cheesy prone spamming techniques. Given Sony's 'half ***' record for adding new features and content I doubt they would do it right. For those who don't know, here is an example of dolphin diving in Bf2. This is what high end infantry combat degenerated into due to poor choices in prone mechanics. Go to 1 minute for maximum dolphin.

I feel like there is obviously no point in continuing this discussion we have two different opinions on the matter and no amount of math, statistics or scenarios is going to change your mind here. The only thing I am getting out of your side is "lol get better scrub" as if it was some sort of win-all argument for every situation. Pointing out obvious flaws in the system such as clipping, models with broken spinal columns and unreadable gun directions are just problems I should clearly solve by getting better and learning to aim,(Because you know, knowing which way a person you are engaging is facing isn't important at all) instead of being an issue that haunts most modern military shooters where prone exists as an option and allows for cheesy silly things like the video linked by the poster above.

I feel as if you and I are on completely different pages in terms of respectable conversation as well, because your argument is riddled with nothing but blatant stabs at someone for what you assume are their motives, in the end every firefight can be broken down to a numbers game and being forced to adjust your aim to a target on the ground put the numbers even more in their favor. As a person trying to take an objective you already come into a room at a disadvantage by not knowing the situation inside. So not only are you forced to find the enemy locations to know which corner you should come around firing at but you also need to know their positioning to get an idea of where you should be aiming, when entering and wasting more time attempting to relocate your aim from crouched/standing targets to the prone ones. That is all I am saying. A single prone target isn't an issue, minor annoyance? Sure, but nothing you can't get around. But it is when there buildings full of prone targets as well as normal ones where I find myself hating the idea. I wouldn't want it in the game because it would turn the indoor game in an absolute mess trying to relocate from ankle level targets to normal ones.

With that final point I think it best to let the conversation lay, because my own motives a reasoning have been explicitly stated multiple times, if you wish to attempt to derail it further with more venomous statements and blanket assumptions go on ahead.

the scale of the battles makes going prone so bad. being prone will make you 100% unable to react to someone trying to knife you in the back where as if you are crouching if you are good enough and the other player is cocky enough(as in thinking they can take 5 seconds to kill you) you can turn around and smack them in the face.

BTW I think you quoted wrong the 2nd part of the post.

Look my intent was NEVER to insult you. I get you see me as being high horsed, but it comes of me liking challenges and knowing how i handle them. Yes, I guess we are on two different pages. Maybe if we talked IRL over this, we would have a totally different conversation with more understanding of each side.

Yes I understand your concern of lying people everywhere, but I also see a MAX running in after people threw nades inside and taking out those lying ducks quite easily because they can't move anymore. I also don't remember any problems dealing with this in BF3/4, so I don't see why I would deal with anything in PS2, where rooms are empty compared to BF. I would just scan for the first person I see and corner shoot / prefire burst him. It worked in BF3/4 (where you don't actually see people go prone so often anymore) why would it not work in PS2?

Unreadable guns are readable enough to know horizontal angle of enemy aiming. Like I said before, it doesn't really matter where enemy aims vertically. But I think you don't accept / read some of my arguments. I also wrote before that clipping / prone models is not a question of gameplay. It's up to Devs how to make it right and it's up for another discussion.

Well, maybe you just DON'T GO PRONE if you don't wanna be at disadvantage? Did you even use your thinking capabilities before posting this? Even Chazt, who I have an argument with, might agree with me on this one...

Out of all the problems in the game you are asking for going prone. You are very excited about going prone in planetside 2 and it will never happen. There is no point in going prone in this game at all and even if there was SOE wouldn't implement it because they don't give a crap what people want usually. Also good job on claiming you have superior "thinking capabilities" just because I don't agree with you.

Snipping is fun! Cqc sniping a thousand time so. How rewarding is it to go in a room with 5 bullets, and headshot 5 players in there in quick succession. You only know half the fun...

If you read my comments you would know I'm NOT for implementing prone (I realize you wouldn't read that far to know I'm against implementing prone). You don't disagree with me. But your previous comment of how prone is bad because you won't be able to react to a knife is illogical nonsense. I never claimed I have better thinking capabilities, I asked if YOU used yours.

I loveeee CQC sniping, I main it on one of my alts, I just hate people on far away hills.

You think I'm going to read about something that doesn't matter? I posted to tell you that you are literally talking about something that is so irrelevant that I find it hard to comprehend how much time you have on your hands. Oh maybe you are just trying to win an argument over GOING PRONE (wtf). Why not talk about game breaking glitches or maybe how infiltrator gameplay is so broken right now. How is my comment about being defenseless when in the prone position irrelevant. You literally are making **** up. It will always make you more vulnerable to someone who is in close proximity. That is a fact. Are you some kind of wizard who knows where every enemy is? I didn't think so. Why don't you take a seat.

My answers in blue

They wouldn't crawl as fast as the can run they would crawl half the speed you walk.