Should C4 DMG be tweaked versus Vehicles ?

There has been plenty of adjustments to C-4 over the two years or so since this game has been out. Most of them pretty much nerfs. C-4 takes a ridiculous amount of time to actually throw, and detonate on target. Because of latency, where your client actually sees the C-4, the server may be one or two seconds behind that, which is why C-4 does not actually get attached to moving vehicles.

They've even tried buffing situational awareness, but in the two years I've seen, you simply can't buy situational awareness. Proximity Radar works fine, but you'd actually have to look at your mini-map every 5 seconds.

Also in a game where resources don't really matter (-50% resource continent bonuses, Premium membership bonuses), staying alive for 5-10 minutes in a tank is all you really need to be able to pull another one. And every single person can potentially pull a tank. Someone hell bent on C-4'ing every tank can only average taking one out every few minutes. Failed attempts burn resources as well. Everything is expendable in this game, it's what makes PlanetSide 2 the way it is.

I will continue doing what I do because it's fun to watch all the 'splosions. C-4 is still tricky to handle. It's not as easy as some are led to believe, especially when the server-client latency is stretched with hundreds of players in the same hex. Conversely a tank spamming HEAT from 250 meters away does not have to worry too much about that.

Chasing tanks on foot (as in not being a fairy and walk up to said vehicle) to plant some C4 has rarely worked out for me except against the most oblivious of all drivers hence I don't really think it's a valid tactic. I really don't get the fuzz about C4. The damage of one brick is arguable I guess. But two bricks should gib a tank always.

Perhaps some kind of audio notification when C4 is placed would be neat. Much like it exists in the Battlefield games. Have characters shout "placing C4", "here's a gift, enjoy" or something along those lines when C4 is being planted. That's more of an inderect nerf and it'd not only give vehicle users a better chance to react but also Infantry and MAXs although probably not to the same extend.

now im using maxed flak armor, and i was reported for cheating, by an LA, while i survived his c4 and killed him

Considering

a). Much increased spammability of pretty much everything since the resource revamp update;

and

b). Bugs and server lag hijinks involved with C4 itself

I'll have to disagree with the notion, OP.

NC MAX can OHK infantry, infantry should be able to OHK NC MAX.
Gunship can OHK infantry, infantry should be able to OHK gunship.
Infantry can OHK spitfire turret, spitfire turret should be able to OHK infantry.
Spear Turret can OHK infantry, infantry should be able to OHK Spear Turret.

I think even if they were to lose their C4, there would still be a ton of them running around. LAs have more mobility and can do sneak attacks pretty well. I'd be ok with the class trading C4 for anti-personnel mines. I'd be ok with LAs having battle rifles too.

It's fine as it is.

There's a big risk in trying to C4, and you spend resources to actually use it. Tankers only see the successes, they don't see all the failed attempts where they were shot down by infantry or the tanks themselves.

C4 should be toned down against vehicles per brick so one does around 50% damage.
furthermore medics should not possess C4 in the first place.

Definitely agree with that. In particular it needs Squad tools. B/c Squads / Platoons seem to hate the sight of LA's in their own ranks the most unless it's for 1 quick minute to try and bomb a Sundy. Otherwise they're always demanding they switch to medic or HA.

One of the more recent ideas someone else added to the forums was instead of letting inf EMP's just stun vehicles, have LA's drop a "prop" on them that slows it to a crawl and has to be shot off, forcing the player to exit their vehicle and maybe giving the LA a chance to fight them on even terms. (then Infiltrators could be given empty-vehicle-hacking instead and LA's + Infs would want to work together more). B/c of its less lethal nature, they could easily be allowed to carry way more of them just like how Engineers can carry a ridiculous number of AV mines.

My personal idea for another tool would be a nanite tagging spray that marks a target at decent range and keeps it visible to the entire squad for the durations Spotter-beacons are tiered at. Only a medic could remove those tracking nanites. It could also used to tag Friendly targets that would be of value to their squad like Skyguards & manned AA turrets if that squad was an Air-squad wanting to know where friendly AA support was always located.

Once the resource system is finally finished, LA's could have a role there too in getting a lot more of it to their Allies faster than is normal... making them a high demand class for any platoon that is going through resources too quickly.

If Airstrikes or Artillery strikes are added like Higby hinted at, they would definitely be the #1 choice for painting the target there...

They could also put Squad beacons on top of hard to reach places that their whole squad uses.... Oh wait, they've been doing that one... I guess that's one more thing they do well besides just being Carbines in trees. (they're also damn scary to most of us veteran snipers who manage to parkour outselves up to places no HA is usually bright enough to reach --- and yes, Snipers were never considered "useful" to the game the past 2 years ... but since the nerfs to HE rounds, Libs, Pods, PPA, and Banshee ... there's not really anything else left that IS effective at Anti-Infantry at longer ranges. So the role of sniper is a lot less redundant now meaning that LA's can hunt them now and be useful too. They definitely don't have to be AV bomb dropping Rambos anymore just to protect their Infantry brothers from the big bad A.I. Farming vehicles anymore).

So you basically promote vehicle immunity to everything except heavies and other vehicles?

I think it's necessary to remove C4 from Light Assaults before anything because it will force SOE to finally address the lack of flavor in the class from either complaints or metrics in a significant fashion, and not just bandaids. It's pretty vanilla compared to anything else that can be fielded. While generic C4 represents a considerable place in the Light Assault arsenal, however, there's really nothing that can be introduced as comparable. Whatever it is gets automatically outshined.

There's also Engineers and MAXes.

Ok lets see the facts.
Tanks
- Tanks can fire incredibly accurate over great distances (up to render distance) without damage degradation
* OHK on nearly all infantry
* Able to be active long times before they need to resupply
- Tanks are immune to small arms fire
- The 1v1 TTK on a tank is higher than any infantry, with maybe some exceptions of a primary on a MAX
- Tanks have a high movement speed and acceleration
* Able to avoid many dumb-fire rockets
- They can run over infantry
- They have a relative slow turn circle, both body and turret
- No strafing
*Exception for Magrider
- Large, and together with their movement they are heavily restricted to bases and buildings
- Are good vs other tanks
- Autospot from great distances
* can be reduced by stealth
- Autorepair, firesupression, radar, etc as possible upgrades

So tanks pack a punch over long distances and are difficult to take down. They have tons of extra gadgets to make their lives easier. They have only two real downsides. They are limited in moving through bases and buildings, and they have a more limited amount of visuals, making situation awareness a bit more difficult.

C4
- Carried by infantry
* Easily killed, among the lowest TTK in the game
* Slow movement
* Easy access to buildings and tight spaces, with the LA as an admirable best in this
* No turning or aiming restrictions (as fast as the mouse turns)
* Invisible to radar, except when spotted, vehicle radar, or the motion spotters
- An effective range of 2-6 meters
- A combined deploy and detonation time of about 3 seconds
- Can kill any tank, except Sunderers, with 2 bricks
* Need to resupply after every two bricks

So here we have C4. Able to take down most with two bricks. To be able to place a C4, they must not be noticed by the target. It has a small range, and best used in CQC. So in a base or on targets you can easily sneak up on.

C4 is highly limited, especially in range. Tanks on the other hand are good vs anything on nearly any range, except incredibly CQ. My experience is that people who know how to C4 tanks, also know how to avoid it. Standing still too long, often close to things that can be cover the approach of infantry is very detrimental for the health of your tank. Especially if there aren't too many friendlies around to shoot down anyone sneaking up on you.

My honest opinion is that if you want this nerfed, you don't know how to counter C4. It is ridiculously easy to drive away the moment you see a C4 person. It is ridiculously easy to move to position where getting a C4 has a very, very low chance. But I think people are too focused on their current position, and don't want to give it up even if the situation changed and the chance of C4 has sky-rocketed. They want to stay at their formerly good position, or they just ignore chances for C4, because in all other ways it is a very good place to be. And then the injustice! You got a C4 on your tank! The possibility of a OHK should be removed! Ignore the fact that you can farm easily from pretty safe distances, I was too greedy and made a mistake, but I shouldn't pay for my mistake!
No. Just pay attention to where they might come from, and reposition, even if it means fleeing, if the chances of C4 or anything else has increased to a certain level.

From a slightly different point of view:

2 of these kill a tank, no matter where they're placed:


3 of these don't kill a tank, and depending on the direction a tank can eat several and live:


Both are full of HE, in fact they have the same explosive substance in the real world.

But wait, there's more...
The small one costs half as much as an armored buggy in PS 2.
The big one comes for free, with an infinite supply.

In other words, there's so much inconsistency here, that these topics will appear endlessly.

How about making big gun shells as well as all missiles cost nanites, giving tanks a coaxial Kobalt, and making C4 the compact demolition charge it should be, rather than the nuke everything it is now?

just like tanks and liberators need to specialize, infantry should be required to specialize as well. thus i recommend having two explosive types:
- C4: high splash radius and high damage against infantry/maxes, but very low damage against vehicles
- Satchel Charges: very low explosive radius and low splash damage against infantry, but very high damage against tanks

the problem with current C4 isn't its strength against tanks but rather its universality, it's like AP and HE combined when comparing it to tank shells. tanks have to specialize, why not infantry as well?

It's a tough problem coming up with good tools for the LA. All the recon stuff already belongs to the infiltrator and support tools don't make much sense on a class that's designed to operate away from the HAs and medics and engineers. If you ask me LA should have been the only class with access to C4 to begin with, but that ship has sailed.

Remove the ability for LA to carry 2 bricks.

Problem solved.

If some Heavy or Engineer can actually run up to a tank on foot and plant two bricks, maybe he deserves a kill. 95% of the time, though, it's a solo LA flying through the air and it's simply too easy for them to do.

Making them only carry 1 brick would still mean plenty of C4 deaths but at least they'd have to look for wounded tanks or else *gasp* coordinate with other players.

What's wrong with that? Only engies and heavy assault's should be the Anti and vehicle support classes or if they do keep C-4 on the others it needs to be changed to a vehicle/MAX support weapon instead right now it's just a super grenade that most classes can carry and lets infantry kill everything. The problem with this kind of weapon (like the lancer,Phoenix,Striker,Vortex and Ravens) is it becomes unbalanced when most of the players start using it,if you give a weapon this powerful to infantry it's all they want to do it becomes their goal to use C-4 instead of tanks so now we have a bunch of nerfed tanks fighting off a constant swarm of infantry AV and a bunch of infantry complaining that we won't let them out of the spawn room so they can C-4 us and spam us with rockets. If the devs want infantry to be treated more fairly they're going to have to reduce infantry AV power and range across the board or just encourage them to learn the vehicle game so we can actually get some balanced fights instead of fights where one side has all the vehicles and the other side won't pull any they just whine about how the other side is bringing assets to the fight and how the enemy isn't giving them the chance to get out and use their C-4. Anyway I think it should be 40% damage per brick to support friendly tanks and possibly destroy damaged ones in the heat of combat not blow them up outright it's too much power for single infantry.

imo C4 should do directional damage and should kill in 1 brick to the rear or underneath and 3 bricks on the top, side or front

That is a nerf and a buff depending on how you look at it

Noooooo. It is VERY Hard to get C4'd for me (As a casual tanker), Since I often am watching my back, and have a good gunner in my vanguard. Thats all it takes to avoid getting c4'd. If you get c4'd, Your are ******** and DESERVE to die.

-C4
-Two LAs working together (against 3 pilots working together) with C4
-Spitfire is unmanned
-C4