Vulcan buff is yet another example of a severe misunderstanding of vehicle balance

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Paperlamp, Nov 26, 2014.

  1. Paperlamp

    You can't keep trying to balance multi-vehicle weapons that function the same but are on dramatically different vehicles. You buff the Vulcan on the Prowler and it will probably become imbalanced on Harasser yet again.

    I am a TR biased player as well but this is one thing I have no problem admitting, and it applies to all factions really.

    Each vehicle needs different weapons balanced with the capability of the vehicle which includes different size/speed/durability among other things.

    Please stop making this mistake over and over again, take the steps to fix it instead of repeatedly breaking vehicle balance and leaving these secondary weapons in nigh unusable states for some vehicles just so they aren't overpowered on a other vehicles.
    • Up x 22
  2. Flagonswarm

    I would really like to not be stuck with the basilisk as the default on MBT, sundy, and harasser.
  3. Onetoo


    Well, that was a little off-topic, but why don't you like the Basilisk? After being buffed, it has become quite a potent jack-of-all-trades weapon. Aside from on the Harasser (too many shots missed due to erratic driving), I think it performs very well on most other vehicles.
  4. WTSherman

    They're planning to buff the Vulcan again or something? I've been doing pretty decently with it since the last buff (new crosshair+slight CoF reduction). Sure it can't quite reach out to *extreme* ranges, but that's not what it's for... within its effective range I can use it fairly well against tanks, infantry, and air (though it's best for tanks obviously).

    I'd be worried if they're planning to buff again, the Vulcan is a delicate weapon that could easily turn into an anti-everything monster if they're not careful.
    • Up x 3
  5. Flagonswarm

    It's not entirely off topic, basilisk on a sundy is a different beast than basilisk on a harasser or MBT.

    I don't see it as a jack-of-all-trades as much as a "sucks at everything" weapon, personally.
    • Up x 3
  6. BobSanders123

    Here is a video detailing its current state on PTS as of 11-26-2014. It appears to have a stagnant CoF as well as a magazine size increase to 90 from 60.

    • Up x 2
  7. CNR4806

    Taken from a PTS thread:


    This is hardly a buff. In fact, it's trading the Vulcan's burst-fire capability for 30 more rounds.
    • Up x 1
  8. WTSherman

    Good god. :eek: The PTS CoF seems to be a bit larger than the current starting CoF, but the lack of bloom makes it *way* more accurate over the duration, especially due to how its spin-up works. That thing will be shredding infantry left and right if it goes live, not to mention that a 90 round mag will let it one-clip anything short of maybe a Galaxy.

    If that goes live it could very well be the return of the anti-everything Vulcan.
    • Up x 2
  9. MasterDemoman

    I think that SOE is approaching this from the wrong angle.

    TR have an anti-vehicle minigun. bullets=av
    And an anti-infantry grenade launcher. explosives=ai

    Just saying, think about that... Isn't it kind of funny? It's far too late to go back now, lol. Anyway, stagnant COF on an AV weapon, wonder why I haven't seen that before, not like weapons with stagnant COFs are good against infantry, right?

    ppa

    It wouldn't be a PPA, but it'd be versatile as hell...
    • Up x 3
  10. Nody

    You are correct that it would not be a PPA; at least the PPA could not damage vehicles in any relevant way (an AV Machinegun however...)
    • Up x 2
  11. Xasapis

    TR will never get properly balanced secondaries as long as the primary is so dominant. The Prowler is dominating the stats by the merits of their main cannon. If the secondary becomes equally or more appealing than the primary, then it will become a balance nightmare and end up into nerf land again.

    The only way to balance the MBTs, is the Magrider way. A really weak primary, that makes secondaries appealing. Both Vanguard and especially Prowler main cannons need to get toned down, and their secondaries buffed accordingly. Well, assuming the target is to get more people to gun. If not, current balance is just fine and developers shouldn't be bothered.
    • Up x 4
  12. Sabreno Carvaroni

    I want to note that other factions get their ES AV secondary weapons for harassers as well. The problem with vulcan is that it's designed for close range and harraser is particulary good in getting to those ranges. Maybe they should tweak magazine size so harraser wont insta gib other harrasers (not cosiderably faster then other factions AV harraser do), like get it down to 50-60 and make reloads faster so DPS in general remains the same.
    After testing all factions AV secondaries I'm kinda content with current Vulcan on PTS. Its performing a bit better in close range then enforcer trading off range for more damage. Also if this is final then saron is actually underperforming relative to other factions AV secondaries vs MBT. As I see it right now enforcer will beat saron pretty much at any range, plus the vanguards armor + shield ain't making it any better for magrider. Although due to magriders mobility it might be ok, I didn't drive one on live so can't say for sure. Also considering vanguards with shields I'm not sure that current Vulcan performing better at close range can make a differance in a head on fight, the risk of getting so close probably is not worth it and staying away from vanguards shooting from longer distances in siege mode is still more preferable in my opinion.
  13. sindz

    SOE doesnt seem to understand this, its been proven countless of times with the broken vulcan that could shred a galaxy in 4 seconds or the marauder which was an upgrade over the fury on every single form. And now the vulcan is gonna be broken OP again with the way it works on PTS - and lately what has been on the PTS makes it to the final game.
    • Up x 3
  14. BobSanders123

    An AP Prowler with a vulcan can kill a vanguard is it sneaks up from behind in a really, really short amount of time.
    • Up x 1
  15. Nody

    Nothing new then as we're already behind on AI being last on AV on secondary with the weakest main cannon with the worst ES ability will simply complete the set and continue our march to 100% NS being the best alternative (to bad there's no NS MBT cannon or tank for us to use), after all we can simply point back at what we got (ZoE, Phaseshift, Comets, Vortexes, PPA etc.).
    • Up x 1
  16. SerasVic


    It is a buff as the spin up time ***** up any burst firing and the "fixed" CoF is smaller than the one before after few shots.

    This and the 30 rounds makes it a quite good buff.
  17. Haquim

    Sorry, but I just have to:

    VS will never get properly balanced tank primaries as long as they can attack from such riddiculous angles. Magriders are dominating fights by merit of their mobility. If their primary can rain death from atop mountains, then it will become a balance nightmare and end up into nerf land again.

    The only way to balance the MBTs, is the Prowler way. A solid box with a powerful primary that stays on the ground.....

    Seriously we can do a rant like this about any MBT, just need to coin it for its strenghts.
    • Up x 4
  18. Xasapis

    You do realise that your attempt to reverse the argument is a complete failure, right? The angled attack will happen with the Magrider, whether it comes from the main cannon, the secondary cannon or Vanu himself reigning holy fire on the unbelievers.

    The difference, and it's a big one, is on the combined power of the MBT. Right now the Magrider's primer is so weak, people opt for gunners at every opportunity they get. TR on the other hand would rather pull a second Prowler, because the main is so much potent. The best secondary (and thus the best weapon you can mount on the Magrider) is the Halberd. And yet, TR will rather pull a second Prowler than man the same Halberd.

    Do you see where I'm getting with that? Either the Prowler secondary will become ridiculously broken OP, so as to attract people away from the extremely powerful main Prowler gun (which will lead to crippling nerfs of said secondary). Or, the Prowler main gun will have to get toned down considerably, so as the secondaries become appealing.

    The Prowler's main cannon will only become balanced enough for gunners in mind, when given the choice of gunning a Halberd or a second Prowler, people will opt for the Halberd. Until that happens, TR will never have a proper 2/2 MBT.

    Of course, we can dismiss the whole notion of gunners and keep the situation as currently is. I'm sure a lot of people are happy already with the Prowler being the best AI ground platform in the game (even during the PPA era) and second best (soon to be best again) AV platform.
    • Up x 4
  19. Zotamedu

    The reason the Vulcan is rather meh on the Prowler is not really the main cannon but the ability. Out tank is designed to lock down to get buff for the main gun. The only way you can use lock down without committing suicide is if you park on a hill far away. Then a close range AV weapon is utterly useless. Only the Halberd is an option in that scenario. Or maybe an AA gun to deter air or some AI to take care of incoming C4 but I've found the Halberd to be a very competent AI gun if you can aim it properly.

    So no wonder no one wants to use the Vulcan on a prowler when it's primarily designed as a long ranged artillery piece.

    The Vulcan on the Harasser is another thing entirely. Running stealth Vulcan Harasser is great fun. You can do some serious damage to an MBT before they even manage to get the aim on you. It absolutely slaughters 1/2 Magriders if the driver is decent since they can run circles around them making it very hard to actually shoot back. It's a high risk and high reward weapon. I think you'd be more effective with a Halberd in most cases since the Vulcan can not be used against larger armour packs. It can only hunt down lone tanks but it sure is great fun.
    • Up x 1
  20. Cest7

    My biggest WTF was when I read they were buffing the vulcan before nerfing the banshee.

    Yes, the prowler's vulcan needed more range.
    No, The harrasser's vulcan did not need a change.
    I don't like this change.

    This makes no damn sense to me either.
    Its basically a reversal of the PPA and Vulcan mechanics. Does higby really hate the VS that much?
    Can we get a buff of the same calibre to the ppa?