[Suggestion] TR now severly lacking in anti-magrider weapons

Vulcan and Marauder are getting changed because they've been terrible for months upon months now so it's a moot point. Let see some pounder stats...

Let me quote Xasapis real quick. So Pounder is the worst AV Max weapon by a large margin. Oh yeah decent at AI work if you have infantry charge you but crap at AV....

Fractures are "on par" with the vortex provided you are within short to medium range. At long range? Good luck. For that matter they are still worse than the comet which has a slow travel speed but it's quite effective at range due to no drop spam.

Everyone who has suggested ground homing was suggesting only 5-10m lock on range. So near misses aren't wasted. Nothing like the air homing range. A velocity buff would work as well. But it's far less interesting really.

Hmm one wonders whether the TR main guns will be hit with the nerf bat when their secondary's get buffed (changed around).

Weapon KPH
Supernova PC 16.51
Supernova FPC 18.24
Supernova VPC 39.02

Titan-150 HEAT 17.32
Titan-150 AP 19.27
Titan-150 HE 34.54

P2-120 HEAT 21.96
P2-120 AP 25.01
P2-120 HE 47.6

Lets see the max difference between HE weapons is 13.06...

Before TR whine about DPS it goes

Prowler
Lightning
Vanguard
Magrider

And for the giggles nerf the VS Kobalt the KPH is just too high

VS M12 Kobalt-MBT 69.22
NC M12 Kobalt-MBT 47.55
TR M12 Kobalt-MBT 56.34

Oh and the TR need a buff

VS E540 Halberd-MBT 25.14
NC E540 Halberd-MBT 25.62
TR E540 Halberd-MBT 22.24

Or maybe the TR should get gunners whilst their main guns need a little bit of tweaking

Are those all MAX weapons? Never heard of them!

Unrelated and irrelevant to the discussion, thanks.

Hitting ESFs is difficult with the Lancer, but Liberators and Galaxys are trivially easy to hit with it. Valks are in between the two, sometimes being easy to hit sometimes they aren't, bonus points if you shoot through the open part in the back.

You realise that a weapon that performs better than the combined performance of two weapons of the opposition is not merely "decent", right?

You should get xp for shooting a lancer through a moving ball's open space and doing no damage. Like a kill's worth.

They perform worse for AI than all the AI weapons, and TR MAX has the weakest AI options.

I'm also pretty sure they're not actually performing better than Falcons and Comets combined, I'm not even sure what you mean by that exactly, but Falcons and Ravens aren't that far behind Pounders for AI - definitely not half as effective. Comets are lacking but still not that bad.

The only thing Pounders double is Vortexes which are by far the worst AV weapon for AI.

For the time being, I don't think Pounder AI is a balance issue. It's the only good TR MAX weapon and it's fairly niche. It is however, fun to use which is also rare for TR weapons considering all our empire specific stuff is extremely boring RoF increases and "stationary mode lol".

If anything, it's a role issue - it's good at AI but worse at AV. Which is the airhammer in a nutshell - not as good at its intended role as the other AI noseguns, but much better against other air.

I think Pounders should stay how they are. I am obviously a bit biased since they're my top weapon, but they're the only TR-specific thing that's really unique feeling for me and offers a fun playstyle I can't find on the other factions. They're a more versatile AV/AI dual purpose weapon, but they're not outperforming dedicated AI or AV weapons at either.

TIL this is a discussion about MAX weapons. And here i was thinking it was about the TRs lack of AV weapons vs Magriders. Which is hilariously incorrect anyways.

Quotes statistics, very good. Those don't show AI kills, though. So they are, in effect, cherry picked. Aaaaand yeah, the Pounders melt any target at close range. In the game. And if ~1 makes Pounders "crap", then doesn't that mean that the Magrider and the Vanguard need an enormous buff?

Quotes stati- Wait, nope, refers to their "feels" when stats don't suit them.

Velocity is the Lancer's forte, and homing is the Pheonix's. The Pheonix also has the highest single shot damage, as is NC's trait. This causes problems becuase you can't remove one or the other now, but 3 important traits leave the 3rd thing starved of meaning if one thing gets 2 traits, rather like the tanks, with the Prowler getting speed AND firepower (OH! LOOK! A "NICE THING"!).
If you want to buff the Striker, give it a ridiculously large magazine and a big ammo pool. Then it becoes a spammy-suppression weapon against Ground, and an area-denial weapon against Air.

Quotes AV statistics for an AV gun.... Yeah.. Keep trying. The pounder is trash at it's intended role. As proven by those very statistics end of.

"No anti-mag weapons" isn't true anyways:

• Prowler
• Fractures (Which out-perform Vortices also)
• ML-7
• Lockons
• C4 (there isn't much of a gap between factions, and NC does the worst)
• Halberd
• Libs, ANY AIRCRAFT FOR THAT MATTER, lovely, lovely Banshees too.
• Tank mines

Speaking of good stuff, "nice things".
The MCG outperforms the Lasher in every category, and outclasses the Jackhammer in some as well.

So a lot of this thead is subjective, and a fraction of what has been said objectively supports the OP's "point".

Great, buff it at it's intended role, but nerf it's AI damage to hell.
Slightly sub-par AV results, massively overperforming in AI duty (for it's intended role of course). Needs a nerf for AI, a big one, and a slight AV buff, maybe less arc (half?) at the cost of slightly slower velocity. Proven by those statistics end of.

Also, on just looked at the VKPH stats up there again, and notice how Fractures are doing better than the Vortices?

As I believe you like to say: "Moot point".

I think the issue is more at ranges that many tanks start pelting at. Not nessisarily always killing but detering and threatening in the longer ranges.

Ravens, lancers, Phoenix (I think?), vortex. All can threaten at fairly strong distances last I knew, which tr really doesn't well.

The reason prowler and c4 and such have been left out and likely why magrider is mentioned is because our past the normal midrange magrider is normally more likely to avoid shots from things like dumb fires and are probably going to be able to move to cover from lock on.

Given vanu and nc can respond and actually do a decent job deterring armor through their weapons, tr kind of has to wait for them to close more OR pull vehicles for the fight, which the two other empires don't nessisarily need to do and even if they did the other faction infantry and max level units could engage much further out than the TR effectively could.

Not to say mag needs nerfed or lancer or any of that but tr could certainly use tweaks that would give them more effective means to fight on that level similar to the other two's playing field there no?

The pounders are multi purpose, not OP in any aspect but so they are good with AI, so we have something decent , shock horror, very much like the VS max, but as I have said in many threads, the VS max is balanced ( apart from there ability, which is pointless and needs a buff or something else ). Pounders do very little damage unless your close up, you cant pin point where they land at distance, its spray and pray.

If you go down the logic on the pounder, then god the VS will suffer more

Opinions are allowed.

Nice post.

However, Vortices are, again, out-done by Fractures. So I don't really see all that much of a problem there. Pounders? See my previous posts.

I'll be playing around more with fractures tonight to be able to speak a bit better on use. Although I'll have to use my lancer as more a baseline for use comparison to vortexes (yes I spelled it wrong, the x doesn't get enough love)

I just remember last time I was using fractures they were very very underwhelming in terms of damage to engagement range and having to compensate for the drop and fly time.

That and they felt like kinda slightly faster comets that fell and not anything that was "oooo this was worth it!"

If you manage to get C4'd in a Magrider, you done ****** up. It is the easiest tank to dodge infantry with and it kills people by bumping them at 8 kph while straifing.

The DPS numbers on a prowler are also a little off; that is their dps at optimum performance. The trick is that the people who can actually manage that recoil are few and far between. Because of this, relatively few dedicated AV tankers exist on TR because the entry curve is higher, especially with on the move firing. And AV tanks are the primary counter to PPA mags.

Why can't the TR use what I use? I'm pretty sure the Decimater is NS.

I was referring to Comets and Vortexes combined. Pounder performs better overall. It is a problem, this an AV weapon that is way too good at AI and not good enough at AV. As for the TR being bad with the AI weapons, that's ... how to put it, not true?