Farm spam tools and force multipliers are destroying the game

Actually we team up in my outfit because the bullsht spam, including infantry spam, motivates us to do so.

It requires teamwork to kill PPA and HE tanks.

Shotguns will kill 1 or 2 people in a squad, but he'll quickly be finished off by the rest of the squad and the people who went down will be revived or will just drop on the spawn beacon.

MAX spam gets countered by having our own MAXes and keeping them up with support or by focused fire and plenty of revives.

Air dominance is countered from the ground by coordinated lock-on strikes or focused flak fire. Even the top liberator/dalton crews are taken out by a team of average ESF pilots.

I think if you removed all your vehicles, you'll be left with a bunch of experienced players quick-scoping you with sniper rifles or camping around corners with assault rifles and shotguns.

Don't forget that your "no skill farm tools" can be used to fight those high skilled infantry players.

If you couldn't use them, there will probably be more people taking out the rage through hackusation reports.

Then the next ridiculous idea you'll see on the forums is separating players into different servers based on battle rank.

(where every server will still have its "newbs" who get roflstomped by people at the upper end of the server max battlerank)

You'll also then get your griefers and internet jerks who will make new characters just so they can go into the lowbie servers and feel like gods.

Is that what you want?

It might help but it also might not. When I drive a tank I always look for other tanks first and once I can't find any I start camping the spawnroom. Even if I got 1xp for each kill I would still do it since no tanks around.

I can agree to an extent on a few points but mostly it sounds like someone can't seem to appreciate that little infantry aren't meant to come off well against a vehicle.

Guess what happens to infantry caught out by a tank in real life? Yup, dead.

it's not such a difficult mental exercise to imagine that tanks in the game should on average be the more powerful in an exchange between infantry and itself. Not to mention infantry have so many cheap AV options (oh, hey C4, what's that? Yopu only cost 200 cert points but you basically give free kills to any LA/whatever brave enough to approach a tank? Cool).

The way you sound you'd not be happy until the game was just semi-auto rifles and no vehicles. Booooooooooooooooring.


I get that the game has to balance infantry and vehicles, but that can be solved by designing bases and such so that when the fight enters the base the vehicles have little to no say on the matter. Between bases if you're dumb enough to run out into the open in front of an enemy vehicle you deserve to be gibbed.

MAX suits are meant to be powerful, and all factions get them so no problem there.

This is the first time I've seen someone bring up the Banshee before and I'm glad it's finally getting some attention. That thing is so overpowered I cannot even think of an expletive to describe it.

When did you first get that thought?

Within 50 meters which is dumbfire easy kill range. :S

>competitive teamwork games
>team fortress
Nope. I find it funny that you're hating on cod, when it exactly fits the infantryside mentality you seem to expouse- everyone has access to the same weapons, all the time. Only skill is the differentiator. I called that mentality the "COD" mentality, because that's what it is. You're advocating for completely useless vehicles (meaning nonexistand vehicles, like COD) and you're arguing for defensless vehicles, meaning any random can take them out, no teamwork or skill required.

Pretty much all "******** spam" would be gone if infantry players stopped acting like sheep and actually pulled AV vehicles themselves. Anti infantry vehicles are invariably easy meat for any non-bad in an AV vehicle. You mentioned things "not being fair." That's false- each and every player has the option to pull the same kind of vehicle, or their direct counter once they've obtained the certs to do so. You could complain about more experience players having better certed vehicles, but by the same token those players will also have more certs dumped into each and every one of their classes.

Teamwork is rewarded lots, you're just unwilling to use it. Every one of those HE tanks are 500 xp, every one of those aircraft is 400 xp and up. By coordinating with a single buddy, just one, you can get rewarded extremely well in taking them out. Furthermore, teamwork is more required for vehicles than infantry- if you get caught alone, with your pants down, you'll need to wait up to 20 minutes, depending on timer and resources, to get back in a vehicle. If infantry screw up, no biggie. They're back within 15 seconds.

Looking closely at your "argument" I spotted something interesting. Namely, that it doesn't even apply to the general case at all- your claim against fairness isn't supported. Your rant about COD doesn't actually disprove anything I say (namely, that the desire for each infantryman to be able to individually take down vehicles is bad for teamwork and bad for the game, and that weak vehicles are bad for the exact same reason.) Your statement on "teamwork isn't rewarded" is blatantly false. Even ignoring things like squad bonuses and squad repair/heal/revive, it's pretty obvious that a unified group can do more than a disunified group. Your final paragraph is basically just a rehash of your original post, and basically just amounted to "NERF NERF NERF."

It's an infantry killing weapon, that does nothing else. It's splash radius is small enough to require aim. It's platform is vulnerable to flak, lockons, small arms, and any ESF in a 500 meter radius. If it couldn't kill infantry well, it would be literally the worst possible weapon, because there would be no point to using it over any other nosegun, which can also kill infantry. Tell me, why does it need to be nerfed?

Another point is that it has not had any complaints since release and no change in ages if ever.

The fact that you would suggest this when it already exists is just further proof of how meaningless it is.

If you think KDR is importsnt in this game then why isn't everyone playing Heavy Assult?

"My skill and KDR doubles when I play Heavy Assult, I just can't figure out why that is" -random scrub

That's the POWER of the skill infused HA shield. The skill just bleeds into you through it.

yeah i

Yeah i agree on the heavy shield being a problem, it should be adjusted very slightly but not in a way they said they plan to, I would suggest just removing 0.75 multiplier LMGs, that would compensate much or just increase the shield energy fade time if you activate it before engagement.
But on the actual note, heavy shield is not too much of a problem if you think through it, if heavy didn't have shield they would be engineers without carbines that are better LMGs and without any role except rocket primary lol.

I don't think you made too much thinking through arguments when you had writen this all but, dying as infantry while playing in squad together, being on same location is unrewarding because:

when you die you need to wait 7-8 seconds(they changed it now didn't they, not 10) and to actually come back in the same cohesion you had with the squad for example, to get in an actual touch with the squad and to find enemies to shoot again, you need 20seconds at laest, if you tryhard ofc, also if you die 5 times to the ******** spam while tryin to get in touch with the squad members that are probably now scattered throughout the base(not together anymore because died and lost touch with the squad) it adds even more in the big picture, to minutes and later into hours by just running around to find allies and enemies to shoot and to watch death screen.

But if you die to a infantryman or non spam cheese bs, you know that you could have done much better, you didnt get instagibbed by tank or MAX but shot by infantry class which makes it fair.

Also one big disadvantage to dying is that it makes your KPMIN so bad over time, the more you die, there's just so many permanent disadvantages iit's too boring to try to even add some more up.

My argument is dying to cheese, bs spam, or dying to the things to whom you couldn't have done almost anything/no chance to counter/ outskill/ play better than or just avoid is dettering players to the game, and will deter. Also some of most significant cheese, farm tools, no skill to use high reward stuff i already reccomeneded to get removed or to get toned down, that will for sure help get old players back and new to stay tuhs provide more income to the game.

Noone wants to die to something he can't avoid or have no chance to go against.( example for this: engineer sitting behind small cover, and gets rocked podded or m14 bansheed by some br100 looser that plays the game day and night the same way because it's 'most rewarding', engie just dies in 1-2seconds or less even with flak on, and after that he gets instagibbed by NC scatmax and so on and so on.)

When you die as a vehicle, you not only get the same respawn timer as an infantryman, but you have to have the resources to spawn the vehicle to go back to playing it, and you have to drive or fly much longer distances than an infantryman has to run to get back to your squad. If you die 5 times or let your squad get scattered without thinking to do something about the vehicles, the problem is with you, not the vehicles. You could do better by quite simply pulling an AV vehicle and absolutely destroying all the defenseless farmers. But no, you keep dying like lemmings because you refuse to pull a direct counter, just like the vehicle user decided to pull a direct counter.

KP/Min is not a permanent disadvantage in any sense. Kills don't matter in this game, except where they prevent a person from getting to a point..

All those farm tools are risky to use- they make you defenseless to AV vehicles, so the moment someone pulls an AV vehicle in your area, you're toast.

And I find it hilarious that you say "Noone wants to die to something he can't avoid or have no chance to go against" because vehciels can't to a whole lot against spawnroom warriors with flak, a C4 farie in an enclosed environment, or nonrendering infantry spamming no-skill lockons or ganking vehicles at render with lancers.

This game's main selling point is king of the hill huge scale with infantry being the bulk,main force that drives the game by trying to capture bases, they capture, vehicles don't, MAXes don't, Air spam doesn't, you weren't supposed to be tanking 24/7 also, that's just wrong and dull if you think through it, I said it's all spammable exactly because of this, there are so many 24/7 pure MAX players for example
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And now with this new resource system, we going to have even more of these fellas and even more new players that are going to stick with the game absolutely. yeah and of course even more easy Tank spam but who knows maybe now we are going to have pure tank battles? I genuinely doubt it, because farming infantry is far more rewarding and far less invested effort.

And yet you fail to mention the infantry spam, making it difficult to impossible fly or drive without being ganked by lockons, and removing the strategy from this game by turning it into a no-skill moshpit where the winner is whoever has the most bodies in the area.

Complain to me about infantry being easy to kill when they have respawn timers of a minute and can't redeploy directly to fights.

If you had any knowledge about the current game, you would have known that vehicles air and MAXes have no cooldowns at the moment , it all depends on resources and if you are subscriber you can now spam even more, just like the players i linked above.
Problem is obvious as well as solution, ignorance on the other hand is not productive

Um, I do. That's shy I mentioned infantry spam- 8 second respawns. Subscriber/boost benefits need to go, though.

Kind of reminds me of PS1 forums. As more and more players got access to the orbital strike and EMP blast, the complaints about vehicles went up in direct proportion. It was as if the EMP blast negated the effectiveness mines, and the OS negated the effectiveness AMS, putting infantry at a severe disadvantage to vehicles.

And the developers caved into the complains and buffed AV weapons sometime around 2007 (about 3 years after the game was released).

The first 6 months PS1 was out players complained that infantry was too powerful. They'd complain, "Man after we get through 3 AMS's and 100 mines, we'd move 100 meters and get stopped by 3 more AMS's that went up and 100 more mines, what's with this WW1 stalemate warfare anyways? We want maneuver warfare." Well, haha, you got it.

Teamwork, or solo AV vehicles.

HA+AI tanks are the juiciest XP, and easily killed by a solo vehicle.