I'm a little uncomfortable with attachments being able to be purchased with SC.

Risky decision considering how few players they managed to bring back with the Hossin update. The game has been heading in the wrong direction for a while and they're obviously lacking revenue streams with the amount of attrition they experience.

Don't people ever think about what they're writing?

Your second definition is the same as the first but for a rather important exception that's been included, which renders the 1st point redundant. You can't therefore say that your first condition is met, when you've added an exception to it on the next line!

"You can buy ingame power with cash that cannot be acquired by playing the game." - this is the ONLY definition in your post that you can use. and you can obviously unlock attachments via certs.

It's pay 2 save time.

Why anyone buys anything besides 1000 cert items @ 700SC (or better, 350 half off) is beyond me.

Well, and cosmetics of course. GOTSTA look good while you're killin

what he's saying is people use one of the 2 definitions for defining whether or not a game is Pay2Win.

So people who believe in definition 2 still won't call it P2W, but people who adhere to the first definition will.

I reject the first one completely. Just being able to buy "Power" with cash does not make a game P2W.

And the second statement isn't true about this game.


So it is still not P2W.

I think the line is at least a little clear:

Suit upgrades make you explicitly harder to kill. (Like flak and nano-weave). You could be terrible at the game, but you would still be able to take more hits than the next guy.

Attachments may make your weapon better in a certain area, but if you suck with a weapon, no amount of golden lazer sights will save you.

Next year: Nanoweave Bundle 14.99 EXCLUSIVE for SC! Your certs will be refunded so this is not p2w!

The more $$ SOE makes the bigger the development budget which means we get more content for the game faster, so It's a good thing.

The definition that I accept, as expressed below also takes into consideration that a F2P game needs to generate revenue otherwise it will cease to exist.

"Any and all items in a F2P game can be purchased via Cash, provided all those items excluding cosmetic or non game play related items are available to be purchased using an in game currency as well, that can be earned at a reasonable rate and the prices for those items are reasonable as well, meaning they are not set arbitrarily high, resulting in the need for cash purchases to be competitive.

"Reasonable" is obviously debatable and would also fluctuate from game to game, but most rational people can come to agreement, that items should be set at levels that encourage purchasing items for cash while not requiring it. This is where the market forces will come into play and will sort this out over time or the game will go bust either from lack of players or lack of money. ( I would also argue that SOE is facing a lack of money issue, because it is too easy to earn Certs, especially for higher level players, new players should have big discounts, but as they advance those discounts get removed both for SC and certs)

I agree and disagree with the second part of your comment. I agree I do not think SOE is targeting new players ENOUGH. However, I do not think they are going to be able to monetize their existing player base, because there is not enough incentive for those players to be monetized. But newer players r players shifting to other servers would be.

I know I haven't bought a new gun in ages and I really have no desire too. I have a membership, but I earn cert points fast enough that anything added to the game is of little interest for me to be purchased via SC, because..#1 SOE has damage my confidence in new products, from excessive changes to those items after release, so I will wait a month or 2 till I Purchase and when I do it will be with Certs for the same reason...#2. I already have all the weapons and attachments, etc etc I need to be successful. If they added vehicle upgrades or anything along those lines. I would just grind out those items, in a day or 2, unless I was really impatient, but knowing the history of newly released Items Ill wait and grind and I think most veteran players will share these sentiments.

Personally, where I think SOE is dropping the ball is in customizations, be it player looks, sounds, emotes, different gun models, different vehicle models, sound packs for guns or vehicles or even special animations for our characters, weapons, vehicles.

If you're terrible at the game nanoweave wont help you. Even if it did, it only serves to even playing field against vets who should already have nanoweave.

Meh not sure how I feel about this. On one hand people could already pay cash to buy weapons which was fine imo since you would then need to put in the time to upgrade them. Now they won't even have to bother? Also I'm thinking ahead here and what will happen when we get cert resets? Someone could buy a bunch of attachments with cash, then buy a cert reset and effectively have bought certs. Does buying certs constitute as pay2win? We already get payed certs from daily certs that come with subscriptions and a bigger cert income due to boosters so I really don't know what to think at this point.

I guess at the end of the day it doesn't really matter though since someone who does not want to spend a dime on the game doesn't have too and will eventually be on even footing with people who've payed for stuff anyways.

All these items are still sidegrades. It doesn't matter if you have the money to buy everything without the tactical knowledge and experience to use it effectively. It doesn't really bother me that you can get stuff quicker through SC.

It only annoys me when SOE introduces weapons that are designed to be too effective in order to rake in SC purchases and then nerf it a couple months later at the cost pissing off the community and losing a lot of players.

If it's revenue they need, then spend more time advertising the benefits of being a premium member. Besides the member discounts, member sales, bonus experience and passive cert gain, members get access to the other SOE titles and their membership bonuses. Get an outfit/guild interface in-game that allows a community to exist between multiple SOE titles and can show who is online/offline and which game they're in. Then add in the ability for the in-game voice to work to talk to people and send messages to others in the same community from one game to another.

Being a premium has very good value but a lot of people just aren't aware of it. Invest in better advertising of the game. Many people who I know that play Battlefield and Call of Duty don't play Planetside because they've never heard of it, not because it's not appealing to them.

SoE is a company. Companies need revenue. SoE is free to generate revenue any way they choose.

Based on past experience, why are people surprised by this latest move? I am still waiting for the One-Shot-One-Kill ammo to go on sale.

I couldn't care less about this update. What I want to know is the Payer Studio on hold? I'm itching for new gear.

Nothing theyve done as far as this game goes leads me to believe they would implement anything like that.

Clearly you haven't seen my stats if you believe I ground cert for hundred of hours.

I have no real problem with selling attachments and such for SC. As long as you can buy attachments and similar stuff with both SC and Certs I will be OK with it. Just don't make it so you must pay SC and can't buy the something with a comparable value in Certs.

I'm 100% fine with this change, if it allows them to bring in a few extra bucks good for them. I'm surprised people are up in arms about this, because the difference between a weapon with a forward grip and without is nothing compared to an ESF with Pods/Coyotes vs. afterburners. Or a stock tank vs. an AP / Halberd. (And I'm not even saying that is pay 2 win, it is pay for convince of getting sooner rather than later) As long as every one still have the option to reach the same peak, then things are just peachy.

And if this change is occurring with the PS4 release in mind, well I can tell you that it will probably work. Certainly I will spend more money if I can also buy weapon attachments ... saving those precious certs for things that cannot be purchased with SC.

I was going to make a thread about the same exact thing. This is complete bullcrap and a massive cash grab for MAX players and people who want to skip the progression. The thing I liked about this game is it isn't "pay-to-win", you might be more inclined to buy a weapon you like rather than earning it, but that is balanced out by the fact you still have to earn your way to making it better. By making attachments purchasable it completely kills any sense of progression and allows people to skip their way to having a fully decked out kit and actually making the game more of a "pay-to-win" experience. If this change moves on to vehicle attachments do you really think it will stop there? Of course not, next we will be paying to instant level our med/repair tools and abilitie. If this goes through to vehicles I can honestly say I will be quitting.

As a side note I should mention this a complete kick in the balls to anyone who ever bought a boost or is a member. Why should I care about 50% more point gain if I can just buy everything instead? Why should I support your game over the months if I can simply make a couple of small purchases and have everything I could ever want?