If you are going to add an activation time to the HA overshield, give us one thing in return

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Roll Fizzlebeef, Mar 22, 2014.

  1. LT_Latency


    This was the way they were suppose to be at launch.

    The resist shield was the best shield if you had it up before you started taking damage.
    The other shield were better if you used that after you started taking damage.

    The is no point in using the non resist shield if you have to use them before you start taking damage because they are now worse then resist all the time
    • Up x 1
  2. Nephi1im

    So um... that's not a source.
  3. LT_Latency


    I can't find the quote for 1.5 years ago.

    Basically design functionality should make it pretty obvious. There is NO point to use the other 2 shield except they are useful after you have taken damage.

    They may have changed their minds, but that is how things used to work
    • Up x 3
  4. Nephi1im


    Strangely enough, both of the characters in sig the NC has a 0.5/1 KD and the VS has a 1.6/1 KD. Both of which also imply that line is pretty far from the truth.
  5. Nephi1im

    Again, the devs adding an activation delay completely contradicts you sourceless claim. NMG and Adrenaline shields can just as easily be intended to activate prior to an engagement. Apparently, doing the opposite is not intended.... hence the nerf.
  6. LT_Latency


    Ok, You tell me.

    You have one shield Resist. This shield is the best if used at full health.

    You have another shield that is worse if used at full health but better if used after you have taken damage plus losses effectiveness while it's running.


    What is the point of the second shield???


    It's possible they changed there minds, but it's clear how they were suppose to work
    • Up x 3
  7. Posse

    Source? Every high level Heavy Assault player who understands the HA gameplay much better than the devs. Also, since it has activation cost and depletes over time, using it preemptively is the worst idea ever.

    And yes, they call it an I-win shield because they don't understand the HA gameplay as well as some of us, something I'll continue to think unless you can link me to a dev that has more time as HA played than me

    No, when you nerf something you have to take into account all the effects it will have in the game. When they nerfed the Harrasser into oblivion, that nerf indirectly made Viper Lightnings completely oveerpowered.

    And no, I wouldn't be okay with this kind of nerf in any situation, I'd be okay with a HA nerf IF they nerfed MAXes in the same patch, but not with this kind of nerf, adding more delays to a game that already has built-in delays, and in abilities that are supposed to have zero delay by design, is a terrible idea.

    Yes, they are, too easy to use, the TTK difference with every other weapon is way too big for the pellet spread they have. Not to mention clientside and all of that. Just the other day I ran into a LA with a Pump, I was playing LA too, with the VX6-7 (CQC carbine, I was using it as intended), I did everything right, the guy shot his first shot after I landed 6 bullets on him, what happened? We traded kills despite me starting shooting first and not missing shots with a CQC weapon, seems balanced to me.

    That's why I'm proposing a rocket nerf instead, genius.

    Oh, I can deal with them just fine, the problem is when they completely destroy other CQC weapons with lower skill needed to use them.

    HA balance is part of the thread.
    • Up x 1
  8. Nephi1im

    Because one potentially allows you to take 0 damage, while the other absorbs X% of damage? They are different, it's up to the player to choose which shield for a given situation.
  9. LT_Latency


    They both do that. The resist shield makes your shield last long as you resist more damage. You start losing protection on the second shield when you turn it on unlike the resist shield which has constant protection. There is probably a tiny window where you would not lose hp from the second shield but lose HP from resist if you are turning it on before gun fights start.

    The second shield simply isn't worth using when you can use a steroid pen or a medic to undo the damage instantly.

    Every thing points to the resist shield be better but needing to turn it on early
  10. LibertyRevolution


    I killed all the heavies. ;)
    Those kill shots are when I'm low on HP after those fights by a random carbine/smg guy. :rolleyes:

    Resit shield last 6-10 secs depending on level and resists 45% of damage. So 1450eHP.
    NMG lasts 15 secs and blocks 650 damage completely, bleeding 43HP per second while on. So 1650eHP.
    Even with a delay on NMG they will still be different enough.
  11. LT_Latency


    If you turn it on while taking damage. If you turn it on early it much weaker because the power is draining.

    The shield is built to be best when you turn it on while getting filled with holes. The dev would basically have to be stupid if they didn't think this shield was ment to be used while getting shot because that is exactly how it is designed.
  12. Nephi1im

    Man, 28 instances of hyperbole in two sentences (see what I did there?). Again, all this anecdotal crap is pretty much worth a hill of **** since all of the numbers indicate that "high level HA players say we're fine" are wrong. You can have a bazillion days played as whatever, but it doesn't change the fact that, to the contrary actually since you're biased, they are outperforming all other classes by measurable metrics.

    It's sort of their prerogative to change things as they see fit. I'd say MAXes are due some tuning, and I don't doubt it will happen. That said, I still think hyperbole #46 that "this change will kill HA and make MAXes supreme!!!" is quite overblown. I'm pretty sure your rockets still kill them quite dead, you just might have to use the minimap and hit F prior to rounding the corner into a MAX....

    The TTK between shotguns and other CQC weapons in PS2 is vastly LESS different than other popular FPSs. This is actually the reason a lot of people consider shotguns lackluster in PS2. When an SMG can down you in 0.1 seconds longer while being vastly more forgiving.... why use a shotty?

    Yay more anecdotal stories!!! Man, I wonder if people realize this "one time, at band camp, I lost to a shotty" type of discussion doesn't help your case as an advocate for balance....

    That has nothing to do with the fact that heavies win more than they should because of the shield. Nice try though.

    If this were the case, the numbers would support it. As they don't in any way, shape or form, this still sounds like you having an ax to grind against shottys instead of an actual balance discussion.


    Well, really it's about the idea that the shield allows heavies to win more often than they should, which by extension means they are played more than they should be. Rockets aren't the issue, hence their lack of nerfing.
  13. Posse

    Learn2math bro.

    45% damage resist means that bullets deal only 55% of their total damage, so 1000/0.55 = 1818 EHP
    • Up x 4
  14. Fenrisk


    The Time to kill is about half a second when being shot in the the head by a SMG/Battle rifle/Most common infantry weapons at close range. A heavy has no time to react when up against a smart LA/Infiltrator. There are plenty of ways to take out a heavy when your not one and having better AIM and awareness is one of them.

    A shotgun will drop a heavy before he can blink in close range. I honestly don't see the issue. La's and infiltrators are far better infantry killers then heavy's.
  15. Posse

    Show me those metrics then, and show me those metrics based on skill level while you're at it, I already know that newbies perform better with HA than with LA because it's easier to use, high level players? Not so sure about it.

    Oh and btw, if they're outperforming engineers and Medics, news flash, they're supposed to do that, because they're ASSAULT classes, not SUPPORT classes.

    The same thing was said about the Viper Lightning, toplel.

    Other popular FPS such as? And I mean similar FPS games, don't throw a comparison with Quake or UT because that's a completely different game. CoD or BF have lower TTK spread, and, like it or not, they're the most similar ones in infantry gameplay.

    As I said countless times, if you go toe to toe with a HA you'll lose (at equal skill), that's the point of the class, if you're LA or Infil you're supposed to flank them, if you flank them and even then you can't kill them, then that's a learn2aim issue. When I play LA I eat HAs for breakfast easily, it's way too easy to flank them.

    The numbers don't support it because shotguns lack versatility but people think they can use it anywhere, that doesn't make them balanced, same as with the ScatMAX.
    • Up x 1
  16. KnightCole


    BUt here is the funny thing, if it was not intended, then why wait so goddamn long to change it? I mean, typically, something that is not intended is fixed pretty quickly after launch, or in Beta or something.

    It is getting pretty annoying how SOE seems to be nerfing and changing core game play tactics and play styles a year into the game's life.
    • Up x 3
  17. Posse

    There's also this, changing the core gameplay AFTER the game was launcher is a terrible decision. If the devs feel that they need to nerf the HA shield (as I said before, I'd nerf other things but whatever), adding something that changes the gameplay of the class is not the way to go, if they want to nerf it, just do a straight nerf (lower extra HP pool/damage reduction), and that's it.
    • Up x 3
  18. Fenrisk


    Quoted for Truth.

    The heavy shield WAS intended to be this way but Planetside 2 Development goals have changed. They are trying to turn this game into another dumbed down FPS COD clone and appeal to casuals. They think they might get the sandbox FPS crowd who only enjoy bland twitch skill gameplay and nothing else.
    • Up x 1
  19. KnightCole


    Ugh, ikr....that is the sad truth of the matter.

    In another year we will have CallofDutyside2. Or Titanfallside2, without the Titan....but Infils will be jumping off walls and crap lol.
    • Up x 2
  20. LibertyRevolution


    I guess I cant math yet bro, I don't get it.. you lost me at division. :(
    Isn't 45% of 1000*.45= 450?