This is mostly a reiteration from a previous post... additional credit to Makora Playing the Infiltrator, it seems like every class has a little something extra they can do to vehicles, be it Air or Tanks. EMP grenades (unlike PS1) don't do anything to tanks, or MAX units, they simply mess up someone's HUD for a few seconds. LA and Medics have C4, HA have rocket launchers (and C4), and Engies have lots of tools in their bag. In my opinion we need *something* to help our squad, and a way to help defend. Here is my idea for a new rifle: The Nanite Systems Anti-Materiel Rifle (NS-AMR) would be a weapon with a single round, needing to be reloaded after each shot. To fire this weapon, you have to deploy it much like the engineer's AV/AI turret. The infiltrator is both stationary, and has a limited field of fire, but the infiltrator can use the cloak ability. Ammo count would be 20 shots max. Refire rate 3-4 seconds, has a clearly visible tracer, and a very loud sound when fired. Because the rifle needs to be deployed in order to fire, it cannot be shot from the hip (none of that, 360-spin, jump, headshot, yoloswag crap) Attachments: scopes as all other rifles, no rail options unless a stabilizer is implemented, and has 2 additional ammunition options. No barrel options. Ammo type: because it’s additional ability to damage heavy armor, ammo will cost infantry resources at 10 per ammo, max 200 ammo. Also, you will be able to choose different variants (much like slug ammo); *Standard ammo: 800 damage on infantry, 900 damage on armor. *Anti-Armor ammo: 700 damage on infantry, 1300 damage on armor. *Anti-Infantry ammo: 1000 damage on infantry, 500 damage on armor. Note: The standard rocket launchers(ML-7, S1, Shrike) does 1700 damage + 1000 splash. I believe the Decimator does 2000 damage. The strongest sniper rifles (RAMS.50, Parallax, Longshot) do 800 damage at 10m, 550 damage at 100m (according to charts). Starting out, all Infantry have 1000 *total* health (health + shields), yet Infiltrators have 900 total. Now I’m sure a lot of you will think the idea is “OP”, so I’m going to do my best to offer rebuttals: Infiltrators can hack turrets and deal with Air/Tanks that way: the option is extremely situational. Not all bases have turrets, be it air, or tank, and furthermore, the Infiltrator has to get to the turret, hack it, all the while hoping someone doesn’t prevent him from doing so…and let’s be realistic here, turrets don’t last very long Infiltrators can hack weapon terminals and change classes: again, this is about the *Infiltrator* not other classes. The fact will still remain, Infiltrators, as a class, still won’t have an option to deal with heavy armor, yet every other class does. What about just hacking vehicles: this option is up for debate. The Devs originally said no, yet a lot of people think it should be an option (if the vehicle is unmanned). As it stands, it’s not an option until the Devs make it so. The ammo damage seems too high: This argument can be easily answered. Because of the way Nanoweave is (thanks SOE for not fixing it to the way it’s supposed to work), all classes except the Infiltrator can survive a headshot from distance. I personally know, and have witnessed this multiple times. Second, because there’s no penalty to dying, a medic can easily revive you where you lay. It’s not like you *can’t* be picked up (unless you’re running solo, but that’s the risk you take). Third, the ammo costs resources, making it somewhat situational, so it’s not an infinite use weapon. Not *another* way to damage tanks: It’s not our fault that the class wasn’t included when the Devs decided that all the other classes could. Most Infiltrators aren’t asking for anything extra, just an option to be able to do what everyone else can do already. The idea still seems OP: Mind you, this would be our “primary” weapon. All the other classes already have the option as their second (or tertiary) ability. I think all the limitations already speak for themselves. I'm sure there are other arguments, but these are probably the most common....
This weapon would be either totally OP, or stupid useless, I'll explain. In your weapon description, you forgot to mention one important thing- muzzle velocity, and it's funny you did, because it will be the make-or-break for this rifle. Given current sniper rifle muzzle speeds, whenever I'm just fooling around with my SR-7, I can hit vehicles from just about render range (you can see the sparks caused by the hit). You're basically giving Infiltrators a super fast, slightly weaker dumbfire launcher, with more ammo, mind you, and up to a 12x zoom option. Now, if you bring down the muzzle speed on the rifle, and put it up with dumbfires/Engi Turret shots, you've basically created the most useless AT weapon ever, since it's basically a dumbfired Engi turret with a scope. If I had 1000 certs to spend, I would spend them on a wire guided AT option, or a lock on launcher to counter vehicles. Personally, I'm against AV damage for the Infiltrator, but I they do add something, I wish it would be less direct, like crippling the vehicle in some way, or, if it's a damage option, then make it an up close (Medics have to run up without cloak to put C4 on tanks) option.
Lol, I was just thinking this game needs a single shot heavy sniper rifle the other day. But instead of giving it crap loads of damage I had it ignore armor, and my vision of the rifle was intended to drop MAXes; but capable of damaging tanks.
Hey Hell! Nice of you to pick this topic up again! Though I have to say that I am a very much for an anti-vehicle rifle I have come to the conclusion that anything remotely useful would be instantly seen as stupidly overpowered. Given how people react to Strikers, having an AMR that can engage tanks at very long range... yeah, people will get their panties in some serious twists. As a sort of how it could work, the devs did that on the Javelin. Just imagine that every shot is full charge and then get hit in an instant. That's the only logical way this weapon could work. And I will then prepare for QQ. Because with the AMR it is going to be epic. I hold out hope that at some point we can get an AMR, but the numbers and how it works will be up for the devs. I don't think it's likely they haven't thought of this or have some sort of a concept in a folder, ready to be pulled out when they feel the time is right. We will be getting more ES sniper rifles in the next GU, so lets see what brings us. I do wish they made EMP grenades work like PS1.
MrMurdok - muzzle velocity is a tricky thing, but 800 (which is 50 faster than the current fastest) should be fine. Why 800? Because it's a new, more powerful bolt-action, and I just came up with it for ****zs and giggles. To address your other points: the rifle wouldn't be OP, nor is it an AV weapon. It's a bolt-action rifle, with different ammo types. Depending on which ammo type you use, obviously depends on the damage. AV turrets are free, and have infinite ammo to use. Rocket are also free, and merely require an Engie to resupply them to make them endless spam. This particular rifle cost resources for ammo, and you'd need a terminal to resupply your ammo, just like everything else in the game that costs resources does. Now let's compare numbers courtesy of the VR training room Vanguard Front -7 Decimator shots (14000 damage) Side -6 Decimator shots (12000 damage) Rear - 3 Decimator shots (6000 damage) Magrider Front -6 Decimator shots (12000 damage) Side -5 Decimator shots (10000 damage) Rear - 3 Decimator shots (6000 damage) Prowler Front -6 Decimator shots (12000 damage) Side -5 Decimator shots (10000 damage) Rear - 3 Decimator shots (6000 damage) Now let's compare the ammo types: Vanguard Front- 11/16/28 Side - 10/14/24 Rear - 5/7/12 Magrider Front - 10/14/24 Side - 8/12/20 Rear - 5/7/12 Prowler Front - 10/14/24 Side - 8/12/20 Rear - 5/7/12 The average; AV ammo is 8 shots, 12 with standard ammo, and 20 with AI ammo. So with the according ammo; 2.5 MBTs, 1.6 MBTs, 1 MBT. Not stupid useless, but not an AV weapon as I stated. All these numbers are easy to compute, so what's my point... My point is, this rifle will enable the only class in the game to damage things that *every* other class in the game can already do. This rifle will also enable the user to damage things to varying degrees (AV, Standard , AI), giving it utility. You also mentioned, "...basically giving Infiltrators a super fast, slightly weaker dumbfire launcher, with more ammo, mind you, and up to a 12x zoom option". If we're talking ammo expenditure, then we're talking Infinite v.s. Limited, which really isn't a fair comparison, and since it would be dumbfire, you still have to line up, and hit your target. If you hit great, if you miss, you just wasted your shot, and resources.
I can agree that Infiltrators could use an AV weapon, but I just don't like the idea of a sort of long range sniper rifle for vehicles. Personally I see more a mid/short range EMP/microwaves weapon that can jam / disable / debuff / slowdown vehicles and at the same time cause minor damage. That should be a tactical weapon to use temporarily weaken your enemies so that the rest of the team can make the job.
Sorry, I gotta be on the vehicle hacking side of things. Outright direct damage to a vehicle isn't characteristic of an infiltrator's role, IMO. Rather, turning its strength into its downfall is more characteristic. Yes, the devs stated that they wouldn't do it. What really got me, though, was their WHY. They said they wouldn't for two reasons. One, they "didn't want it to become THAT kind of game", and secondly, they didn't want it to take up time that they wanted to spend on other things, like the NS7-PDW (which I almost thought was a bit funny). With that in mind, to be truthful, I don't think an anti-material sniper rifle will stand any better of a chance. What I can say is that this would have a lot going for it. It doesn't seem in any way overpowered because it replaces the primary weapon, does low damage relative to other rockets, costs resources, and can't be shot from the hip. It seems like a typical high risk high reward option. I have one critique, however. Because of the way render distance works in the game, you'd be better off lowering the velocity to 600 (800? way too fast) and limiting its range. It's a sniper rifle, yes, but there's a problem with vehicles now being destroyed by anti-vehicle turrets that don't render for them. A good way to limit its range would be to limit it to 4x scopes.
I main an inf, and to be honest, I DO NOT want any way to deal with vehicles. I would much rather see us far more effective at what we are designed to do. Kill infantry. To do that I would like to see our class become far more stealthy, and deadly, via weapons and abilities. If we are going to get any vehicles options, I would prefer that it was things like radar jamming, and debuffs instead of damage.
Hotspoon - but Nanoweave helps prevent us from doing just that, killing infantry. How many times have you lined up a headshot, only to hear "plunk", and they run away and get healed. For me, probably happens about 50% of the time on non-Infiltrator targets. But what about CQC? Well that's only *half* of what the class is capable of. Why limit yourself to half of your potential? As I mentioned in my post, I'm not looking for the Infiltrator to be better than other classes, I'm asking it to be brought up to par with the other classes; give headshots the ability to OSK like they should do, and give Infiltrators a way to damage (albeit it minor) heavy armor.
A Rifle or Ammo like that would be fun. Always wondered why we cant equip specialized ammo like AP...
Please, please no. No more ways for infantry to kill vehicles from long range. There are far, far too many already.
Oh hey, 1000 damage for anti-infantry bullets. How can I say NO in a way that makes the striker seem like a good idea in comparison?
No, just no. -1hit kill with bodyshots on infantry? OP. -Strikers and AV turrets are already breaking vehicle gameplay in a very negative way. No need to add yet another 600m AV option to that. "IF" Infiltrators should have something versus vehicles, i would suggest a disruptor of some sort. You plant it on the enemy tank, and it starts emiting a sound. After 10 seconds, the HUD of the effected vehicle starts being disrupted (like a EMP effect). ~5 seconds after the start of the EMP-like effect, the driver and gunner(s) get kicked out of the vehicle and cant enter the vehicle while the device is active. The device itself can be destroyed by regular weaponfire, knives and explosions. This would be a option that actually compliments the infailtrator gameplay without being extremly OP. It just gives the infiltrator a means to deal with the driver(s) of the vehicle. The vehicle itself wont die, but the owner has a fair chance of dying.
OHK on bodyshot...meh, that would be lame but ammo that deals increased damage against light vehicles like flash and harasser, or against MAX units, with decreased bulletspeed or something like that? as long as they wont work against tanks, turrets, liberators etc...what would be wrong about this?
I have seen every idea there could be for this type of weapon since beta. Each and every time someone tries to do this they propose something silly and OP. You do realize that 1400 damage is equal to or MORE than the damage the lightning AP cannon does to armor? Do you not think giving a weapon that can do this to a tiny little infantry man who can see tanks further out then they can see him, and on top of that turn invisible, seems a little OP? I mean couple that with the fact you can get on top of biodomes, cliffs, or places tanks can't even aim. No, I would suggest just sliding past any idea of making the infiltrator a physical powerhouse against vehicles. The best way to give the infiltrator a way to deal with armor is giving them the ability to hack vehicles. If you find an enemy camping somewhere launching prowler/vanguard/mag shots somewhere then you should beable to hack the vehicle. This will take twice the time of turrets or even more. But there ya go, either you get control of the vehicle or it just locks up and can't move...or makes the controls all crazy and backward. *Shrugs* Should be interesting way of watching a tank die.
With my bolt action rifle? NEVER....parallax always kills OHK on headshot. I never have an issue...unless the heavy has his shield on. But I just don't aim at them...or wait till they are in combat with someone else. If you are having this issue, take a look at your tactics, or guns and see where the problem is.
What about a weapon that you deploy(like an engineer turret), yet control it by remote. You wouldnt be able to move far from it without it turning off, is -very- easy to destroy, noisy, and still costs resources like grenades and the such. That, IMO, would still play to the infiltrator role as being sneaking/causing confusion, and still be a hard hitting weapons. After all, if they break it, its on you. Granted that there would need to be a way to pick up said equipment after use and keep track of its ammo supply while deployed or otherwise. One shot, reload. Etc etc.. (The movie 'Jackal' comes to mind. :3 )
The statistics show that if someone is wearing nanoweave, they will survive a headshot if you are nailing them from an extended range exceeding a specific number that I, personally, do not know. When it comes to Infiltrators like yourself, I find myself confused as to why you aren't encountering the problem if you are working from those long ranges when so many others are. The only thing I can possibly think of is that the popularity of nanoweave differs upon different servers and possibly even the time of day. This isn't a statistic I can look at to confirm, but I can see specific outfits talking about the best suit slot to wear...saying it's nanoweave...and spreading that information on a certain server while another server may have had people with a different mentality that spread those views. The fact remains that nanoweave is a hard counter that will stop a one hit kill headshot. We know this to be true. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- With that said, I don't have a desire to see our class obtain the capability to directly damage vehicles. The most direct method I may have enjoyed seeing implemented would be the ability to hack them, but the development team has already stated that this is not going to happen. So, we need a more indirect way to influence vehicles without it being something extreme...despite how frustrating it might be to come across a Sunderer and have absolutely no means to destroy it yourself. They have enough to deal with from the other classes... Someone suggested the ability to hack ammunition towers a while back, and I completely agree with this. If they gave us the ability to hack ammunition towers, this would make the resupplying of vehicles that much more difficult. Furthermore, it would give us something new to hack and were the development team to maintain the invulnerability of these towers...an exclusive mechanic that only we can influence. This is something that hacking needs before it becomes viable and important in PS2, and this is a perfect mechanic to provide the first step. Now you would have Infiltrators on both sides seeking to ensure control of the tower without someone just coming along to blow it up and end the mechanic for the duration of that battle. This would be the first step to ensuring that Infiltrators are needed. If a tower is hacked, you would hear someone say: "We need an Infiltrator now!" If a base is being bombarded, you would hear someone say: "We need an infiltrator to go hack their tower to try and thin out this armor!"
