Medics can move round pretty energetically while performing their job - to no detriment. You will get medics who decide for some reason (laziness) not to move around while healing/reviving, but you can't balance around that. Given nanoweave, the ability to heal themselves, and the general difficulty in hitting the target 3 or more times in quick succession and you have problems. Now add in a few medics so that they can revive each other as well...
I'd be the last person to argue that this somehow isn't an issue, but there are times were it's worth it to just nail them with a body shot if it can be managed. At the very least there's a good chance that they'll scatter before they can finish their revive if they take that much damage at once. I'm looking forward to the straight bolt and the Advanced Shield Capacitor buff. Theoretically the ASC should be the best suit item a medic can get since it will cut their downtime almost in half, maybe we'll see a bunch of them making the switch when the time comes.
Yup. Remove nanoweave from the situation (even if just for medics) and a cascade of benefits arise. That said, I am not sure they will necessarily go for ASC over nanoweave - it really depends on whether they expect to have more trouble from snipers or from anything else. In a way, LA helps us here since they are the other likely candidate for troubling medics (they also flank the main force). This is of course assuming the strength of the ASC change is significant; less than a 5 second recharge and there might be a chance (with each further reduction of a second increasing that chance immensely), more than that and I think people will still prefer nanoweave over it.
If I recall correctly, unupgraded shields begin recharging after about 10 to 12 seconds, I'm not sure which one is right. I'm thinking that the buff to ASC will wind up being a little on the weak side, but maybe that just means they'll buff it further in the future. We can hope, anyway. I know I'd like to be able to use it on my medic. It would be great to be able to stick myself out there to revive more often.
My kinda logic with the ASC is...."What good are shields if you're dead?" I mean 500 shields may tank...two to three bullets perhaps? I'm not sure how much good this buff will do for us, because I think that Nanoweave will continue to be superior to ASC, but hey you never know what the future may hold for us infiltrators or the game itself.
I see no point in using ASC as an infiltrator, as medic and HA yes but for the rest of the classes no. Nanoweave is probably the best choice for infiltrator, unless you like going on killing sprees then ammo belt is your other option. I know some that runs with flak but those stupid AP mines are easy as hell to spot now.
Start learning how to hit a moving target. Also, it should never take you more then 2 hits. There is something wrong if it takes more, even if they begin healing themselves. Hit hard and hit fast.
It takes three shots with a SASnR if you are not right on top of them and they get some healing in with nanoweave if two of those shots are headshots. If only one is a headshot it goes up to four shots needed (or more if they get in more healing). Bolt-actions take a headshot and bodyshot if the target has nanoweave, but the time between those shots can allow the medic (or any target with a medkit) to heal past the minimum needed to survive the bodyshot too, which can bump it up to three shots. Two headshots will always do it, but getting a headshot on a target moving erratically at some range with slow velocity bullets with a slow firing gun is very difficult, never mind getting two. Hitting a headshot on a moving target that is moving predictably at some distance I can do. Not with 100% accuracy, maybe not even 50%, but it is enough to say I can do that with some reliability if I only need to do it once in a short time period. Hitting a headshot on a moving target that is moving erratically at some distance is far far more problematic. I doubt most of the best snipers could achieve a 20% accuracy rate at a distance of 200m for a headshot on an erratically moving target. If you don't hit headshots the number of shots needed goes up dramatically, especially on a target that can heal. As I mentioned, medics (and engineers) can move erratically and perform their job to no less effect. I think it would be a lot fairer to snipers if those two classes had to go ADS with the medic/engineering tool to be at their most effective (just like everyone else has to), thereby slowing them down to more reasonable speeds. They could heal/repair outside of ADS, but at a lesser rate thereby giving snipers more time (and therefore more chances) to get them before they finish what they are doing.
Got to agree with the general gist of this sentiment. However, it will take more than two hits. The trick is to make those times the minority and when they're not? Relax, breath, work on the next shot... Assuming we're sticking in one spot, hitting running targets at medium to long range should be the norm. With a bolt action, killing them. The qualifier to this statement is, of course, after a few sounding shots, with which we can gauge drop and drag. And yes, the more we practice the quicker it becomes an intuitive, reliable response. Medics are a problem and yes we can live with it. They resurrect but that doesn't mean it's undoing our work. We can still take them out and yes and can be tricky if they're bobbing around and no not every time. Still, we've slowed down the assault, pinned two attackers ready to be mopped up by the team. And when we do drop them, it's even better. The alternative would be medics who can never use a key class skill because it leaves them viscously exposed, unless their allies have had the decency to die behind cover... Personally, on a moving target, I'll aim for two shot drop with the intent of landing the hit in the top 1/4. If there's a head shot, all the better., which of course it easier if they're running on a stable trajectory. Now, someone moving with no rhythm (perhaps so as not to attract the worm -.o) is always going to be a PITA to hit. Then it comes down to doing the best we can do with the tools we've got. The I find scuppers many folks it.. stress. Personally, if I get stressed, I tense, which in turn affects play. And it amazes me how resistant some folks can be to moving into a better position!
ASC will really only be good for medics, who can duck behind cover after taking hits and heal up. That's one thing that really bugs me on my Medic, I'll take huge damage and heal it in a few seconds, but it seems like it takes forever for my shields to start recharging. I've always wanted to use the ASC, but even with the buff it's getting I'm not sure it'll be good enough to switch out from my grenade bandolier. Assuming they aren't changing the cert cost of the ASC, It'll be far cheaper than Nanoweave to fully upgrade - 1/10/30/100/200 for a total of 341 certs for the ASC, versus 1/10/50/150/1000 for a total of 1211 for Nanoweave. This might influence a few people who haven't already invested in Nanoweave to go with ASC instead. We'll see on that. Another change I approve of is the new cert cost per level for Ammunition Belt. It will be much more affordable per level than it is now - 1/10/100/1000 instead of the current 150/200/400/500. It brings the overall cost down by about 150 certs as well, so I have a feeling we'll see people switching to this, at least to try it out for a little while.
Personally I play close-quarter Infiltrator all the time and I don't feel the class is such a mess as you say. My only concern at the moment is actually the Scout Radars that are huge kick between legs for our class: they do the same thing as our secondary skill (recon dart) and they completely deny our primary skill (cloaking). This is not acceptable, it has never been! Concerning all the rest I really don't see the problem. AP mines are more visible than they used to, but still most of people does not check the floor: place them on doors, behind corners and on staircases and they will do the job. And if they don't die immediately just cripple them down with guns or SMG. Also the IFF change didn't affect my gameplay so much I can say: Yesterday I managed to kill 51 just using the full automatic Scout Rifle (sh***y weapon!), which means that after all enemies do not pay so much attention to shimmering and colours. Then I don't know which terrain changes your talking about but new Esamir bases are full of covers, places where to hide and nice snipers spots. Drone, deployable sensor and recon darts are just three tools to do the same thing in a different way, just like LA have to different types of jetpack, HA have different types of nano-shield.... even medics are going to have their own deployable healing turrets. It's the same as the healing tool but it's deployable, so what? The recon device is deploayble and it's permanent, darts are not permanent but can be spammed covering a large area, drone is remote controlled and can follow enemies. We're just going to have more choices about how scout the area.
We've had this argument before, but I'll say it again. Redundancy is all well and fine as long as it is not at the expense of things that would not be redundant. Being that SOE is whining about the time it would take to put some color changes into vehicles (which would only be the MBTs and ESFs, since the rest are universal anyway) and are using that as an excuse for why they can't implement vehicle hacking, I really really don't think the time to create a whole new drone and coding for it would be insignificant to them. Thus, the drone has taken away time (and a lot of it) that they could have used to implement things that would actually serve a purpose that we don't already serve perfectly well. Again, same thing with the motion sensor. Since we are getting the drone this update, maybe next infiltrator update they could add in a ground robot that we can use to spot with. Then the update after that they could add close-range helmet radars that make a whiring noise (can't have it actually be useful!). Of course, sadly, we wont get other things we need because of the time spent on these things - but we need that redundancy, right?
I see this thought process echoed on many a forum. The time invested into something like the drone does not detract from other work, unless SOE has a significantly different approach to software development than other modern software developers. Allocating a team of more than a certain number of people to handle any one project simply can't be justified, unless it involves a critical element, say, something that would cause the game to totally fail. Imagine, if you will, that we have a group of 500. Out of that group, the maximum we will assign to a project is 10. Anything more is simply not efficient, as the gains from having the work done by 11, as opposed to 10, are outweighed by the costs. Out of our imaginary 500, we can have 50 projects running at once. Now, for your rational to be accurate, we'd have to believe that out of the many projects undertaken by the teams, developing the drone has been approved while quality of life has been refused. This seems unlikely. What seems more likely is that both are operating at the same time. That's not saying it's impossible though and, if within a very specific, somewhat unlikely context, SOE had the choice of 'add a drone' versus 'do multiple QoL passes on the Infiltrator' then I would prefer the latter. Do I wish they'd commit all their resources to creating the perfect gaming experience? Sure! And it will never happen, not the least because the experience is on going and cannot be developed in isolation. It must respond to the market and the trends of the player base. ..and if we agree that 'perfect' is lofty ideal, then we'll probably have to settle for less-than-perfect. Which is, highly subjective and probably why we have so many different opinions running around this forum and the internet! As it stands, the flaws with the Infiltrator class are minor. The class functions very well and many, many people are having a great time playing it. As a result, pulling all the staff to focus on a few elements within a well functioning class would seem to be unlikely, even if I wish they would! Above and beyond the above: Adding something 'redundant' requires much less testing and development than something that hasn't already existed within PS2, like Vehicle Hacking, or something that potentially affects all the other classes and how they interact, say like Nanoweave.
What you are saying is not taking into account that the developers themselves have told us that these things take up valuable time and resources that they are in very limited supply - just look at their reasons for not even looking at vehicle hacking. This justifies to me without a doubt that if something as basic as a color-shift for a few vehicles is akin to a resource-consuming bomb then something far more complex as creating the artwork and the coding for a drone, followed by testing and then QA, is going to be akin to a resource-consuming nuke. If your line of reasoning could be proven then the devs are basically lying to us when it comes to vehicle hacking - one way or the other, they are doing something wrong. Either they have the resources free or they don't. This tells me you have been paying no attention to the infiltrator forum or the official statistics, which in turn tells me you probably don't see why putting devs on creating a redundant drone instead of fixing the many other problems that exist is a problem.
The drone can be implimented. Quality of life can be addressed. At the same time. They are not automatically mutually exclusive, as I explained previously. However, I agree, they could both be competing for resources, in which case, the addition of a proven constant is going to be favoured over adding unknowns, like moddifying nanoweave or vehicle hacking simply because one can be finished and the other will be ongoing. As a consequence, it is normal to see things being added like the drone or a new cloak before larger, more profound changes. This does not mean that the work on larger, more profound changes is not ongoing, as I explained previously. The infiltrator will recieve the exact amount of resources the developers deem it requires and has available. As it stands, the class does function very well. Yes there are some issues and yes the class is still enjoyed by many many people. Let's also not forget that enjoyment is not mutually exclusive from complaining/wishing things were better!
Again, you demonstrate a lack of understanding of words - the developers have told us themselves this is the case. I don't know how to make it any clearer. If your argument is that they do not share competition for the same resources then I would heavily disagree: Vehicle hacking would require some small coding (mostly copy+paste from turret hacking). Vehicle hacking would require some artwork changes (just colour-shifting of a few vehicles, nothing drastic) Drone would require a lot of coding. Drone would require a fair bit of artwork additions (so not just changes but actual new artwork, including texture, colour, and 3D-modelling) You can see that if anything vehicle hacking would require not only the same resources, but a lot less of them. So if vehicle hacking is too resource-costly... I'll let you figure out the rest. You have said this twice now, when all the evidence points to the exact opposite of this. You are going to have to provide evidence if you want to make that assertion.
Are you saying the class doesn't function very well? It seems we have totally different experiences then! If the state of the infiltrator was enough to make the game unplayable, it would receive serious attention. As far as 'evidence' - if people evaluated any game based on the activities of the minority of players that frequent their forums, we'd probably not buy any games! If someone can direct me to data showing the number of people enjoying or not enjoying the various classes, that would be very helpful. The devs recognise areas that can and should be improved. Everything can be improved, we know this - and people still enjoy the class! ..and yes, we can enjoy a class and recommend improvements. If you're not happy with the class, that's also fine! If you're not having fun then.. Regarding vehicle hacking: Tell me, which do you believe would have a greater impact - adding another source of recon or vehicle hacking? The *impact* of a change, the testing and evaluation. Introducing a feature is more than simple implementation - it's testing it's impact on the larger system. ..and now do you see why the drone is easier to implement?
Easier to implement? How easy something is shouldn't even be a consideration before how important it is to game balance. If SOE had stated that vehicle hacking would be too powerful for the Infiltrator, or provided any other reason beyond "it's hard to do", we wouldn't be having this conversation at all. The fact remains that it would be far more useful to our class than a redundant recon device in a game which is already oversaturated with recon. If it takes more people and/or time to implement vehicle hacking, I'm certain that the people who want this class to have an impact would gladly wait even longer for their class update even if it also meant missing out on features that they never needed in the first place.
As I said, you are going to have to provide evidence to backup your assertions. I am happy to accept that you feel this way, and I am happy to accept that others will too, but the majority of players that have played the game? Perhaps I should clarify some. Are there things about the game I enjoy? Yes. Are there things about the class I enjoy? Yes, sort of. Are there things about the class that I do not enjoy? Yes, very much. Especially when I have knowledge (especially from Planetside) of what the class could be capable of doing. You can read some of the other threads, especially the hacking related threads to get an idea of this. Ideas like hackable doors, shields, lights, auto-infantry-turrets, cameras, ramps, power reserves, etc. Other things that could be far more enjoyable include long-distance sniping, which has gone to pot with the nanoweave problems. Cloak visibility being poor is another very frustrating issue, as is the short duration which makes everything a dash rather than a calculated journey. Another issue is sensor redundancy from non-class sources (the recon drone doesn't effect this in any way; it is merely redundant within the class). As for well-functioning, I know this is not true - the statistics have shown this. I could spend my next hour searching the link down for you, but quite frankly this burden is not on me. If you want to see them for yourself then you can search for them. As it stands, just know that a lot of people would be very happy to prove me wrong if I was lying and the statistics were actually good for us. If you are still in doubt, and don't wish to search for them, then just ask people if they exist and if they know what they are - they'll say the same as I have. In many ways I can make assumptions on the how people feel about the infiltrator from: The number of people that play it (very low, comparatively). How well it is performing (not very well, comparatively). The number and content of the Infiltrator Forum posts comparative to other Class Forums (much higher number, many complaints). All of these tell me that people are not happy about the class. Your move. You can't just implement things that you know will have no or very little impact; this is especially true on a class that is under-performing. The update has been in the works for ages now and has kept getting pushed back. They certainly aren't in a rush to get it out, yet they don't have time to do meaningful things? For vehicle hacking it wouldn't comparatively take that much time as it is mostly copy+paste of the applicable coding and a colour-shift in some of the textures of some vehicles (which programs like photoshop can do in mere minutes if you know what you are doing). Certainly less time and resources than creating the recon drone. Regarding the impact of vehicle hacking, Dr. Euthanasia did a poll in the general forums (which should be less favourable to infiltrators) on whether people would like some form of vehicle hacking in the game and the result was an outstanding show of support. Vehicle hacking in Planetside has been tested before - very extensively, and was considered very balanced. However, if necessary they could always start off cautious in Planetside 2 by making vehicle hacking weak to begin with (very long hacking times, etc) and see what the results are. So, they know the impact, they know the support, the only thing left to do is dedicate resources to make it a reality (again). This is why they gave the statement that it would be "too hard" for them to do (i.e. they don't have the resources) instead of balancing or desire issues. So, I ask, why instead are they able to commit the same resources (actually, a lot more of those same resources) into creating the recon drone which was redundant before it was even thought up? Things simply do not add up.
Everything the OP said is true.... I've given up on this game... for now at least. I'll still be looking in the forums to see if anything changes.
