Complete frustration. Changes have done it: Im worried about PS2's future.

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Vanus Aran, May 29, 2013.

  1. Vanus Aran

    Hey folks. If you have fun playing the game thats fine. Im still doing good as well.
    But when I realize what the later, big chances brought to the game, my mind darkens inevitably.
    One of the main reasons why I was totally thrown out of my normal rhytmus of non-expectation comming from videogames in the last years was that they didnt carry much potential.

    In terms of that you find your own imagination failing you, when you try to grasp what can be possible.
    No rather your imagination doesnt calm down and you have so much ideas how to make PS2 even more enjoyable and big in variety.
    After all the Slogan was "Seize always matters" and unlike the many different interpretations of this line, whats happening is that true depth is constantly removed from the game, step by step and with more and more comming changes.
    True balancing of what is possible and what not, is what kills a game or to be more accurate, if player notice that they cant escape to be forced into pathetic ways of playing that have no real depth and feeling of archievement. Because other players would be hopelessly left in the dust due to themself just being to lazy or rebellious against what they know have to be done.
    But the noobs and haters are always numerous. And they will somehow force SOE to take action against the rewarding of deviantbehaviour, so that they cant play out their supreme ways of playing.

    So many games are more and more adapted to the playstile of lazy players, just so that those noobs dont stop playing, that the true quality and depth of game is likely to be never reached. Maybe 1 game out of 100 is reaching 80% of its dormant potential.
    Or at least so much that even you wouldnt know how to make it any better. Rarely the case, isnt it?


    The changes that make me worry are as follows.
    While there are quite a few features in the game that allow tactical gameplay, they are simply not or never comming into use, because SOE is simply removing their reasons to be used. They still can be used (!!) but their efficiency is not very high and the 'disadvantage' of not using them is compensate by what else could it be...
    ... the ZERG.
    For everyone wondering about the origin of the word: There was once a game called Starcraft and it had an insectoid alienrace in it, composed out of many different kinds of drones and fighters, all fighting for 'the Swarm' and their name was literally "Zerg".
    While the other race ingame could have many units to attack as well, the Zerg simply outmatched them when it came to simply overrun the enemy with NUMBERS.
    And it looked frightening and impressive as well back then. When an "ocean" of insectoids engaged your base and simply swamped over it.
    Everyone of use knows the punchlines like " Quantity beats Quality ", " What they lake in skill they make up for in numbers " and countless other phrases similar to them.


    • Camping helped out by lattice.
    And this is about to kill the innovate actions ingame and a rewarding, calculated flow of battle.
    More and more the gamemechanic is about to simply not care about timing, every halfasleep zerger cant be too late to another zergparty and even uncreative zerging itself will most probably solve all their problems.
    In a match between hundreds, the many different superior or inferior skills of a player doesnt matter at all, the one's who are already in camperpositions are more effective, there is just no room for anything because any kind of "approach" is already being camped to death.

    Since the undeserved and unrealistic knowledge of perfectly knowing where your enemy will strike next, will create new meatgrinders and campspots WHEREVER the side with balls goes. With balls? Yeah... the people who are actually moving and therefore "not camping", who else?
    Thanks to moving people, the game is even functioning at all. But moving becomes more and more unattractive and campers are strenghtened more and more.
    Different types of Infantry are getting even more and more tools at hand to destroy approaching vehicles, on longer growing distances and with more and more weapons. First it was only air but that was ok (?) since you could strill approach from ground.
    Now even ground is simply not worth the risk of giving your enemy xp, whenever there are more as 30 players present.

    Outfits dont even specialize on amazing kinds of attacks, they are all just campers!!!
    A villain who calls names... Goo ... hgoo... ghooo- *cough*.
    The one who is first in position wins, the one who acts, loses. Seriously... the new Maxweapon needs to make much less damage over ranges.


    • Making bases more and more zergfriendy
    While good changes came along and vehicles cannot surround spawnrooms anymore like Infantry does, real fortressesare removed from the game. I could bite into my keyboard sometimes about what kind of pain it was to take a hex, even inside of a zerg. But I realized soon that this was a valuable experience.
    Who wants to win just by SPAMMING after all? Only true pitiful beings who have already given up could enjoy that forever.

    Techplants: ... made me hate little backdoors. You know... those 2 doors that lead in the direction of the spawnroom. There had not been many Lightassaults back then who simply bypassed Hangarshields with their jetpacks and the balcony on the frontside (?) of the Techplants had not existed back then. The balcony with even MORE doors to enter in the building.
    Ok if we stay realistic, Tanks could blow the whole buildings to shreds after enough time, or at least there should be the option to blow holes in walls and such (after shooting down a massive bar of health that makes galaxys look like Quads in comparisation).

    But putting the Hangarshield-generator(s) outside was a headshot to most the Shielddefusor-feature. An already existing element of strategy that rewarded people who used it in a coordinated group.
    I still hope there will be bases in the game that are protected by Shields not avoidable with Jetpacks or pathetic sideways that are "build" in the walls who are supposed to protect the base against Infantry! (yes im talking about AMP-Stations)
    Of course im not disliking the idea of getting over a forcefield or something by using a Jetpack. The Lightassault should have its meaning too, that is not just consisting out of landing directly beside enemys with a Shotgun. Spamming... remember? Spamming and tactic are not the same.

    AMP-Stations: ... and their unreliable 'Antivehicle'-shields. The removing of the Gens in charge of them was another removement of stratetical depth. Alltough I wonder about this grave consequences and if they even really exist. I mean the walls had holes at their 'backside' after all. And Infantry could herpyderpy walk through the Antivehicle-shields anyway.
    In relation to the silly distance of the Shields to their Generators, I wonder if we really lost something that wasnt moronic anyway? Thats like playing cards with someone and having a mirror behind you that shows your hand to some extend.

    Biolabs and Jumppads in itself:
    There are so many bases that give the player a feeling of an unrealistic lack of security, with Biolabs in the lead. The war on Auraxis is raging for years, right? We can expect the Empires to turn ANY BUILDING of value into a version that allows defenders to defend the building in an easy fashion against enemys from outside.
    The very idea of giving your enemy Jumppads to easily reach your landingpads is outrageous. In combination with that you can spawn Air- and Groundvehicles in the Biolab itself.
    The surrounding outposts are a nice bonus for every Biolab but only the Lab itself is the true treasure and able to turn into a fortress at any time.
    The energylift and Teleporterrooms should be enough to enter them.
    -Interior and way inside: ... and the Teleporters should belong to the Biolab only. To give more of the sensation that its the Lab that is in charge of everything and not the surrounding outposts.
    Its too late to remove Jumppads now. They are a doubleedged sword anyway. But there should be more landingpads and in different heights too!
    The Biolabs need more floors! So that its not rewarding "to camp just one floor".
    Indeed im only accepting defenders as defenders as long as they are moving. While its not unthinkable that 2 floors can be camped as well with just enough people availabe, the chance of that happening is very low.

    ALSO since its a Biolab, one floor could be a pure botanic floor, with lots of plants, branches and leaves blocking the view every 10 meters. A true floor of surprise, action and thrilling battle!
    Maybe there cant be that much strategy beside zerging in Biolabs but you can at least dress it in ACTION and the excitement of the unknown!!
    You will never know whats awaiting you and every Max suddenly walking through the leaves will be a shock to all who arent! Biolabs are so boring compared to what they could be right now - its like they are still Alpha-status.


    • Only with 'this' features
    Im not sure if there should be bases accessable only with Shielddefusors.
    But what im sure about is, that there should be bases only accessable by air. ONLY by air.
    ... or by someone putting up a Spawnbeacon nearby its cliff. Im still thinking Squaddeploy is the biggest noobsupport for coordinated groups since testing.

    The Crown was destroyed as the fortress that it was. One of the few bases that was enraging to take, just by its natural geology. And what is it now? Another Noobpad(Jumppad) is there, leading to a bridge that should have no connection to the Crown at all and another Bridge got a Spawnpoint out of no logic.
    I thought the Crown was something only idiots would attack since there was no good way of attacking it at all. BUT THATS NOT TRUE!!
    You can still try to hold parts of the Crowns plateau with a coordinated Hotdrop sponsored by Spawnbeacon, or try a Galdrop. And what is it now? Right - more zergfriendly. Oh who would have thought?


    • Outfit, why?
    SOE's not implanted subforums or ingame-sides, featuring Outfits, their preference of language, prior focussed gameplay and stuff - may be at fault for people turning out to be the boring zerglings that they are.
    But instead of adding THIS into the game, they are constantly removing any real use of them in the game.
    That is if you want to have more out of it except of chatting with people you may come to like.

    I laughed at Outfits, for I have rarely seen ones that could do other stuff as gathering just a big number of people under their name, trying to imitate a Zerg - or specialize in camping environments.
    But why am I even looking down on them for that when its really the only thing 'worth' organizing? The only thing rewarding? The only thing at least able to face a Zerg with?
    Tactic in itself is spit upon and the Empire with the highest populations wins any alert anyway, the only thing ingame that has really giving a player a reason to coordinate SOMETHING.


    • Zerg always matters
    Im so frustrated by it. Bit by bit I see the overall potential of Planetside2 trampled over to appease the most boring kind of gameplay and the most uncreative and just disgusting kind of gamers.
    People who I must discover at looking down ON ME for wanting more, for doing else, for playing different, for following a plan and trying to work out at advantage in the game.
    For even having the desire to beat a Zerg with wits instead of just letting myself get farmed up around spawnrooms in hope of a few lame kills for myself.

    A game that has no advantages for being smart is a game with an everychanging playerbase that will never be something truly epic. A game that collects hatred and grudges, creates griefplayers and trolls.
    Around a day I suddenly had this burning desire to start teamkilling people that had not even given me a reason to be angry on them. Why? ... well, why not - because they are the own Zerg that I couldnt get away from and became an provocing sight.
    The increase of idiots shooting me in the back out of being too stupid to aim is increasing too.
    But without them your efficiency sinks in the lowest cellar.


    • Overall Empire-feeling
    Never before I had the real desire to get away from 'allys'. Not in one single game that I had played in 20 years or such. Only Planetside2 is the first to give me this feeling, unknown to any other kind of game.
    And the realization is a dry one. We arent real allys. We just happen to have overlapping interests. Similar goals.
    We could very well be enemys as the ones we are fighting. We just dont happen because we dont like the Agenda of the other Empires, or like the own of the Empire we have chosen.
    But maybe the guy next to you doesnt even respect you in the slightest? He hates you maybe more as most "enemys" you are fighting together? Maybe he wants you to suffer for you being yourself?
    In fact he may not accept you at all. He sees you as some necessary annoyance as you see him.
    Wow... thanks SOE?

    Potential ruined by lazyness and disrespect. Tactical depth sacrificed for "cheap big battles".

    The hexsystem didnt forced anyone to play in a certain way. It forced at best those who wanted to be someone or to have the hexes in ones one hands, to MOVE ones god damn *** and kill the true-meaning-of-word-Infiltrators trying to turn a base into the hands of their Empire "from the inside" of another Empire.
    Valuable objectives that arent defended by anyone - dont deserve to remain in their hands.
    Anyone to stupid to realize that, should just go and hang themself or rather stop playing a competetive kind of game.

    This is the first time in my life that I have seen unlogic to be celebrated, realism be looked down upon and detested. Cheapest thrill to be desired no matter how artificial its circumstances and never had allies been connected by less worth fighting for.
    All with just one big patch. Oh no. The potential of a game so big, about to be ruined for nothing.

    All just because there
    is no support to found and
    find Outfits that suit your tastes?
    • Up x 7
  2. Eyeklops

    A glance says it's about the lattice, nice to see totally new and original topic.

    Nevermind..not really sure what you're on about.
    • Up x 15
  3. Seranov

    I got like four paragraphs in, and could not tolerate your writing anymore.

    If you have a point to make, TL;DR it. If it's just "I don't like the lattice because reasons" then don't bother.
    • Up x 10
  4. ZoeAlleyne

    Engrish is hard.
    You don't even have a point to this post.
    I read a few paragraphs and after saying you like the game to talk about how every aspect of the game is fail, I do believe you sir are the one full of fail.
    • Up x 3
  5. sigur

    Crown was just lame. It's plenty of other defensible and fun bases, crown wasn't fun, for both sides.

    I stopped here. Obvious troll is obvious, even if he's hiding behind a wall of text
    • Up x 2
  6. MorganM

    That was deep man. Im gonna go meditate on this...
    • Up x 1
  7. Vanus Aran

    You are proud to tell that you have not read it all.
    Ah man im so moved by your words. Thanks for reading even a bit of it. No... really.
    • Up x 2
  8. MFP_TK_01

    Lattice thread with a touch of PS2 is dying. Could use a dash of basedome I think.
    • Up x 6
  9. Vanus Aran

    Because SOE is too lazy to implant real Outfit-supporting features, the potential of the game is dying.
    Cause people dont got into Outfits and SOE is simply observing how dumb they play - they support this dumb way of playing even more and turn the depth of the game into nothing.
    • Up x 1
  10. Seranov

    BASEDOME WILL RUIN MUH PLANETSIDES

    THERE WILL BE NO SURVIVORS
  11. sigur

    Well, actually i read it all, but the other two points were a complaining about the zerg, something you already stated in the very beginning, and that "overall empire feeling" that I found to be too anecdotal and subjective to be worth discussing
  12. f0d

    the slogan was "SIZE ALWAYS MATTERS" not seize - show me one place where it says "seize"
    http://www.pcgamer.com/2012/07/17/planetside-2-cgi-teaser-declares-that-size-always-matters/

    just letting you know because they are completely different words and you have got it wrong in the past a few times
    • Up x 2
  13. Corporate Thug

    This was rather long and did not quite make it all the way through but from what I did read I do agree somewhat.

    My thoughts: This game has the cheesiest players ever. Most people want to play in some large zerg which is basically a camp fest. Most of these guys have no skill and not even a positive K/D because they simply suck at this game. The majority of people in vehicles are in them because they suck at infantry and just want to farm. SOE gives them more and more tools to be effective but simply allow them to play even cheesier. SOE listens to the players who whine on these forums and make changes to help those players who simply refuse to learn to play better.

    I'm just a slightly above average player and most of my toons have 2-3.0 K/Ds but almost 100% infantry gameplay. Most people do not try to get better or even understand why they suck, they just want someone to fix their problem and I wish SOE would stop trying to make this game so easy for everyone.
  14. Seranov

    It's physically impossible for the average player to have an above-1.0 K/D. Not that such a number means a damn thing, but I needed to point out how your entire argument is hinging on something meaningless and therefore is equally meaningless.

    The lattice is an amazing change that means the primary form of combat on Indar is now actually fighting the enemies of your faction, not running around in empty territories where, if you are unlucky, you'll see four enemy combatants and spend most of your time messing around with generators and flags. With the implementation of the lattice system, you are much more likely to run into resistance in those empty territories, and this is where there is fun to be had for groups of all sizes (except the lone wolves, of course).
    • Up x 2
  15. DreamlessLiberty

    This looks like a resume for alpha forum troll. I haven't read it but the format is impressive. There will always be disagreement. Communism/Capitalism. Pro-life/Pro-choice. Gravity points up/Gravity points down. The OP looks like Everything/Everything else. But there is something that is always constant in this game. It's meant to be profitable. Any one single view isn't going to be more relevant than profits. Maybe you should be a game designer or buy out the company and implement your strategy.
  16. NavSpec

    In regards to the OP, I think you're being a bit emo about the whole thing. I don't necessarily entirely disagree with you but you're being over-the-top about it. I read the whole thing and I think you need to just play and quit over-thinking it.

    See, I get this point about the lattice. I understand where you guys are coming from on this as I always felt that playing peek-a-boo with an enemy infiltrator who's ghost capping, or a squad of guys doing it, was annoying. But do you not feel that the lattice just turns 2 or 3 places on Indar into massive meat-grinders? This is the problem that myself and some of my mates are having with Indar and the lattice system, finding something that isn't just a meat-grinder to fight in. We avoided the Crown in days of yore because of that very same feeling and now, most of the time, it feels exactly that way again but instead of being one place you could avoid, it's three places where all the action is.

    Because of this feeling, we've mostly been playing on Amerish and Esamir. Not to ghost-cap, but to feel like we have some choice on where to go and where to fight and that we're not being funneled around by engineered mountain ranges that sprung out of no-where over night (ridiculous change, btw..)

    Please, help me/us understand how this lattice is better by forcing meatgrinders. I want to like it because I enjoy Indar but I'm having issues with it and with it already planned on the other continents, it's either get to like it or find another game. If you have any insight, please share.
  17. Corporate Thug

    Your argument makes no sense. If you can not kill at least as much as you die then you are below average gaming in a first person shooter. 1.0 I see as a balance in which every person you kill you die, which I will simply state as being below average. This is my opinion but also take note that I did not call those people average. Average would be the balance between the good and the bad players averaged out. So those glorins who maintain 4.0+ k/ds will help to balance the other 3 people who have like .2 k/ds but those people are definitely NOT average.

    My argument is that SOE tries to help these BELOW average players by making things easier so that they can compete with more skilled players which only breaks the game further IN MY OPINION. I understand where you got confused though, next time I will try to use pictures instead of numbers.

    My bad.
  18. Seranov

    You aren't always killed by enemies. People with above 1.0 K/D ratios exist. There are plenty of other ways that a 1.0 K/D ratio is quite a bit above the average.

    The number still doesn't mean anything worthwhile, though. Your argument is based on bias, hearsay and no solid evidence.
  19. GhostAvatar


    From what I read, before I got bored, he is complaining that the current trend of development is turning it into CoD for dummies.
  20. Basti

    Thanks for the TL:DR. Just another rand of a dude whos mad that he cant ghostcap anymore.



    Fun tho. They moan about the lattice, but yet cant bring a single valid point how to fix the hex. Thats propably why they cry about the lattice: They have no clue. :p
    • Up x 1