Let's look at what GU9 REALLY is: A blatant NC Nerf

Well WoW just loved to nerf the hell out of warriors on a near constant basis over several years. But at least there changes overall allowed game to keep growing. SoE on the other hand has a record of nearly constant population declines on its games sense EQ peaked.

I tried to give this guy benefit of a doubt he might have some key points, until I read this.

You can not do this anymore, they revamped major areas.

As an NC player I mostly disagree with the OP. The Aegis Shield is okay in some situations. Is it as good as ZOE? No. But its better than Lockdown in most situations. Also when talking about air, I do feel the Reaver is the worst ESF, but flying hasn't changed that much with the new max abilities. If you were getting hit by a burster you ran and had life left and the same is true now.

When it comes to armor the Vanguard is still an awesome tank and the Enforcer change was actually good in most situations since it does more DPS vs tanks and allows for OHK on infantry still.

Honestty GU09 wasn't even the patch that I though effected the NC the most. It was GU08 when they made all the attachment changes. I really felt those changes on all of my Infantry weapons and not in a good way.

SO is the NC the weakest faction...maybe. But is it so weak that we are at significantly gimped in all fights, absolutely not.

I have no problem with the new Saron except it needs close to the same delay as the Enforcer and not because of Infantry kills but because its DPS is crazy when fighting other tanks.(close up it devastates enemy vehicles.)

Let the OHK on infantry stay for both since I get tons of infantry kills with it.

sorry stopped reading after the first sentence ... "First things first, TR acquire the Striker"

bad way to start your nc is nerfed thread ...

The new enforcer is amazing.
I dont play MAX but my friend who does is happy about the shield.
Anchor mode and ZOE together with bursters might be the only good argument because flying is harder especially for NC pilots, everything else is babbling.
The 4th faction is slowly abandoning us, thats the best buff we could ask for.

I love the OP's name.

Yes I did. Like I said in my other post, I killed plenty of VS Max's, as well as played my VS Zoe Max.

I find it funny how some NC are raging over it. Boo Hoo we cant even fight VS now. Baby.

i stopped reading after = reaver is worst esf

after statements like that i know the rest is gonna be all opinions

I've never played VS or NC until GU09. I have a nearly fully certed TR max. I was inspired by the MAX update to put some hours into my NC and VS alts that I've been farming free daily certs on but had never played outside some short testing in the VR. I have quite a bit of playtime in my TR max and have dual bursers, dual mutilator, and dual pounders so I'm pretty versatile with him. I have both flak 4 and self repair 3 specced and I switch as needed. In large fights I'll always go flak, in small fights I'll often take self repair as sometimes engis can be scarce and that gets very frustrating.

For my NC MAX I bought Flak 3, about half way up the acquisition timer, and slugs for my default shotgun, and used it in tandem with the default AT weapon. This setup felt really strong at anti infantry, shockingly so. TTK at out to 40 yards or so is the lowest I've ever experience in the game. BR100 HA's with resist shield couldn't survive a rocket to the chest and followup slug to the head. Instant death for anything that came on screen. This setup is also quite effective at wearing down enemy MAX at medium range, but was a bit lackluster in CQC vs enemy MAX. Overall I find NC MAX play to be the most enjoyable of all 3 factions by far, and all I've used for it is basic starter gear that anyone could have on day one without paying a cent. I played him up from BR1 to BR8 in 45 minutes and spent most the time trying to break into a biolab SCU shield room which had a death wall of TR lockdown MAX. One of the best experiences of my PS2 career and I'm glad to have finally tried NC.

My VS experience wasn't so great. I bought ZOE 1 and flak 3 and used the default AI and AT weapons together. It was pretty effective against infantry but nowhere near the insanely low TTK I could achieve with the NC max with starter gear. VS MAX probably shines a bit better with the premium weapons, but my biggest issue was survivability. It seemed everyone knew my core weakness, even with flak 3 a direct hit from a dumbfire rocket gets me so low that they can finish me off with a pistol before I can DPS them down. VS max feels incredibly weak to explosives. Perhaps it's better at flak 5 but I was dying so often to the dumbfire and quarter mag double tap from HAs that I was always strained for resources or waiting on acquisition timers. I played my VS MAX in this configuration for about 2 hours and just couldn't fall in love.

So all in all, I find the NC MAX to be the strongest, the TR MAX to be nearly equal, and the VS MAX a bit lacking. I didn't bother with the NC shield ability yet outsite the VR room. I do kind of agree that it's probably the least useful of the 3, but I didn't find it even the remotest hinderance to the NC max as a class. I still kind of prefer charge on all 3.

Do those numbers include hackers, people standing at the warp gate, people repairing towers, resuplying vehicles at the warp gate, passive certs, resuplying eng at the warp gates, medals, ppl who get to capture points after the fight, hacking turrets in empty basis, hacking terminals in empty basis, etc? Or are those real battle field numbers?

Why, yes they do. And because we don't just take a handful of characters but thousands we can assume that the effects of these are more or less even across the three factions.

I've said it in several other threads, making detailed posts, spending 20-25 minutes proof reading whatever i wrote down during my extremely long posts..
Here's another one. I apologize in advance for the length and most likely the spread out sections of my post, shifting between things every few phrases or whatever. Ahem.

NC MAX dominated indoor fights and CQC for multiple months until the nerf to the shotguns came.
The reaver is not the worst ESF, it's just the ESF that requires the highest amount of skill to use as successfully as the other two ESF's.
You have a higher damage gun, higher velocity than the VS's nose gun, better vertical thrust allowing you to perform equaly or better than the other two ESF's in a hover fight with some practice and it has the best AB's.

The offset on the ESF takes time to learn how to aim your gun, but once you learn it, you're more lethal than a scythe in every possible way.
I do not know about how it would compare to a Mossie, since i've never felt like using one.
I get enough dogfights in my reaver and my scythe, dont need a third option of that..

Oh and remember the Airhammer before the nerf? Capable of annihilating any other ESF at close range with 6-7 shots?
Or a maximum of 12 shots between 25-55 meters distance?
I do, i used it every day.
The reaver sure as hell didn't feel UP until the nerf and it still doesn't.
It simply takes longer to learn how to fly that thing that it does with a scythe.
Again, dont know about the mossie, but im guessing its pretty easy to use compared to the reaver.

Your default weapon, the SAW, coupled with 300 certs spent into it, was amazing as hell until the nerf to the forward grip.
200 damage, with very easily controlled recoil due to the attatchment's and a massive magazine size needed that nerf.

The NC weapons had their recoil reduced by a LOT in.. February?
I remember when i played NC at that time, controlling the recoil was quite frustrating and took a bit of time to get used to for each weapon.
As the weapon recoil for the NC weapons are now, it is infinitely better than it was before.

The vanguard is still a monster of a tank to go up against, especialy when it has the shield ability ready to be used at the press of a button.
Minimum of what, 6 seconds of invulnerability for 100-200 certs every 60 seconds, allowing you to put yourself at higher risks than the other tanks can and reap the rewards for doing so?
With practice a good vanguard driver can perform as well as the Prowler does with a full Anti-tank setup, personaly i dont drive tanks anymore since i switched to the VS because of the crowded NC population and i despise the magrider.


The NC shield could use a buff to the amount of damage it can absorb and it NEEDS the bug's fixed where it sometimes blocks things and other times does NOT block damage at all.
It's supposed to increase your survivability, not just make a massive blue sign of 'My shield is super buggy and breaks too easily, kill me please!!'
Buff it.


Now allow me to put forward the VS side of these things, starting from the same areas.

The VS MAX was the worst MAX for several months in the AI department, due to the.. What was it, CoF?
Being horrible, accuracy at range being horrible.
It was buffed after several months of pleading and praying, it then began to perform the same as the TR MAX did.
The NC MAX still dominated the two other MAX's until the much needed nerf to the shotguns.
It's still a monster in CQC, it will always be a monster in CQC, because.. SHOTGUNS.

The fact that the NC dominated most parts of the game (CQC fighting which is a LOT of the game) with their OP Hacksaw MAX's with extended magazine's should not be overlooked.
You might complain that its UP now, but it is not.
I still own my own personal Hacksaw's, i still murder everything that is not a MAX within 20 meters. (yes, 20. Because i use Slug ammo on one arm and the other is buckshot. Target running away? Slug him in the ***)
Because that's its trait, sacrifice range for increased CQC ability.
Coupled with your shield, in CQC you do not and probably will not need the kinetic armor anymore.
Where-as the VS and TR MAX's WILL against the NC MAX, due to their shotguns.
Mind you, NC MAX against the other MAX's is not entirely dead.
You just require someone to cause a bit of damage for you now to take down the other two MAX's in one magazine.

The magrider was without a doubt for a few.. weeks? a month or two?
The best MBT in the game because of its insane strafing ability and cliff climbing ability.
After many cries and pleads, it was nerfed to hell for several months, now its slowly getting a bit buffed again.
I'd hardly call the Magrider OP now.
The increase in armor values affected ALL tanks, not just the magrider.

Dont even attempt to claim the vanguard is UP beyond saving, it has the highest armor, the highest hp (due to the armor value), the best ability for staying in a fight and avoiding getting taken down (the shield) and the highest damaging cannon per shot.
It is not worse than the other two MBT's, its just slightly slower because of its extreme amounts of armor.



On your point about the VS ZOE ability, i agree, its very powerful, however it is well deserved for the VS MAX considering how long it took until the blueshifts and other weapons of the VS MAX to actualy become as good as the TR equivelent.
Ah yes and as i've mentioned earlier, remember the Hacksaw MAX pre-nerf?
You complain that the VS MAX has become as good at killing infantry like the Hacksaw MAX used to be.
But at better range.
Why should we NOT be able to kill infantry easier than the NC can currently?
Remember how long the pleads and begging took for SoE to nerf the Hacksaw MAX's ability to two shot any infantry and murder all MAX's without a reload?
Over 3 months.
Please try to understand that ZOE has only been out for a few days, you will learn what to do against it with time.
Just like everyone had to learn not to ever ever ever get close to the NC MAX before the nerf and to some extent, even now.

About its speed increase.. Did people from the NC in particular become unable to lead on their target anymore?
Surely there must be more than just you around to battle the VS ZoE MAX?
And im sure those other people are not ALL NC MAX's with SHOTGUNS for CQC?
If you can lead on a regular HA or infiltrator sprinting, harm and kill them by leading on them, you can and should do so on a VS MAX using ZoE.
It takes more damage when using ZoE, dont avoid using your bullets just because it has the same speed as a sprinting infantry.
Shoot the thing until it friggin drops to the ground then laugh to your hearts content its dead! Hell, park a friggin sundy on its corpse for good messure if you feel like it.

The AA balance i somewhat agree on.
Its unfair towards the NC and should be fixed, i do not need more damage on my bursters when utilizing ZOE, but the glowing effect on it should stay!
Glowing things are quite.. Pretty. And it makes leading on a target slightly easier due to the 'tracer' the glow gives off.
Also makes it easier to find the ZOE using MAX, so yeah. Problem?


Now if you excuse me im gonna get some much needed sleep here in sweden.
Its sunny, my computer screen is hard to read on with the sun shining on it and its over 7 AM.
Time to sleep and have pleasant dreams of funnest fights ever in PS2, which was when i WAS in the NC by the way.
I shall remain VS.. For now.


Oh and sadly My NC main only has a KD of 2... something.
I happen to be quite suicidal and very very agressive during my NC sessions so, yeah, i have low KD. Does.. KD matter nowdays?
First i ever heard of it.

If you're familiar with the phrase 'blow a raspberry', I'm sure you can imagine the sound most ppl will make when reading you post.

Bring it on, I say! If we're the worst now it means the 4th-factioners leave and I get the underpopulated, outgunned, underdog-status NC I used to know and love.

I fail to see the problem.

http://redwing.hutman.net/~mreed/warriorshtm/klaxon.htm

you go do that

The idea that the Enforcer change was in any way ever a nerf in any situation in any multiverse ever is absolutely new to me.

Have been, thanks. Loving it.

Im 4th faction now VS