Is NC underpowered or harder to learn?

Agreed, compared to the TMG-50 the carv is junk, and the TMG-50 is basicly a nerfed Gauss Saw.

In regards to the SAW - amazing weapon, but it has some weaknesses you need to account for:

• Compensator and foregrip are mandatory.
• Burst fire between 5-10 rounds. Do not hold down the fire button unless the guy is within like 10 m.
• Don't move while precision shooting. The while-moving accuracy is significantly worse. Do of course move if you're taking fire back.
• Don't engage in CQC. The SAW is one of the worst weapons possible for CQC due to terrible hipfire and moving accuracy, coupled with low firerate.
• If you want a cheap, weaker, but easier to handle weapon, get the GD-22S which is like an Assault Rifle/LMG lovechild.
• Get the restoration kit if you play HA (this goes for any faction). C4 is of course also an option, but I'm thinking you want to save some certs.

The reaver has a bigger hitbox than the other ESFs, but it has good vertical thrust and slightly more damage per shot on its rotary, making it good for hover fights.

• Get at least two levels in your airframe of choice. I recommend hover or racing. Otherwise the Reaver will handle like a flying brick house.
• Get the rotary. Default ESF weapons suck.
• Learn to hover fly, only using the space bar.

The Vanguard is awesome, has more front armor than other MBTs, good damage per shot and can be kitted out as an anti armor menace

• Get the shield. Just do it, it's awesome and will save your life.
• Get the 250 certs enforcer secondary (the halberd clone). I run this on my anti armor setup and the kobalt on my anti infi setup.
• DO NOT get the Enforcer C85, canister thing. It's among the most useless weapons in the game.

Neither really. NC probably has the best spread of infantry guns in the game right now (though not overpowered). Having said that, maybe the GD22 should be the starting LMG. Saw is fantastic, but is slightly (and only slightly!) harder to get used to when first learning.

Wait, so default LMG DOES suck at close range?.....Wat?
Though I didn't plan on getting Foregrip and Compensator since it made the hipfire even worse, plus can't burst fire at close range, and I think I use HA mostly for rushing in to close range.
GD-22S? would it be better for close range?

So it IS more like a helicopter than an air superiority fighter? I don't know to hover tho.... I mostly use AB and try to make hard turns to get other ESF, and hovering seems slow for that.

Ok, thanks!

Yeah, the Assault Rifle seems pretty cool, Don't know that much about the carbines but I got a Gauss Rifle Burst and it pwns a lot. GD-22? Would it work better for close range?

I only blame mass incompetence.

Gauss Saw / EM6 is pretty undeniably THE best LMG's game, so that point is moot.

The Reavers strength I believe is the fastest AB. And the shape is 2nd best IMO, Mosquito being the best, and Scythe being the worst. You have to consider that the majority of the time when you fight an ESF in dogfighting, you're not looking straight forward or straight from the back. The majority of your shots will be from coming out from above them where the Sycthe has the largest hitbox, or hitting the top of the scythe as they go into a turn. The Mosquito's slim frame makes them the most desirable for dogfighting. The same goes for G2A, as Inf you'll be seeing far more of the underside of an ESF than the front/back. Though this isn't claiming that the Scythe is UP because it's not, ESF's are perfectly balanced between eachother right now, as they're all so similar with very minor differences.

The Vanguard is fine. It has the strongest gun, great elevation, and the best tank ability out of all factions, which is the shield - making them extremely awkward to pop from the air, and means they can absorb a lot more damage than the other two tanks.

The NC is fine, it's not UP, it's no harder than VS or TR, if you feel that way then it's you not the game.

Yeah except we can compensate for recoil. You can't compensate for ADS accuracy bloom.

Eh.... Not undeniably and not moot, Default NC LMG's recoil is pretty horrible and many people mentioned how it sucks at Close range, don't know how it's the "best" when it sucks at something like that, I think I found it easier to use a Carv for close range.

Reaver's shape's not exactly the 2nd best, if not actually just plain worse, Scythe's shape is the 2nd best, it's flat.... Really really flat, aiming at it would be somewhat tricky, of course, when aiming from above and below it would have trouble, but from every other side....
Reaver is a box though, from whichever side you aim it would be easier to aim at.

Vanguard's fine, I think I like it.

But I don't think NC is not harder than TR or VS, TR has accuracy in close range but has low damage, VS has lots of accuracy with no disadvantage except it's accuracy being it's bane at Close range, found it easier to aim with TR's stuff so I don't think it's just me.

So which one is it now? Make up your mind already, NC.

Yes undeniably, good luck finding a majority that say otherwise. Who said anything about default? Why would a default weapon ever come into an argument about balance, within a few days you should have most of the upgrades to it anyway, and the Gauss in particular has the best selection of upgrades available, such as Adv foregrip. So, moot. Shall I make a thread saying that the VS got shafted because our default LMG (Orion) can't get Adv Foregrip but NC can? LMG's are supposed to be rounded for all roles, which they are, but the Carv is going to be better at CQC because of the RoF which is part of TR's trait. 90% of HA's would still take the Gauss as it excels at mid-long range, and does just fine in CQC, whereas the Carv is trash at long range, reasonable at midrange and CQC. What would you suggest? Everyone have things EVEN MORE similar than they already are? Each faction is so similar with most guns just reskins already, that the differences between factions that are supposed to have entirely different routes of technology and ideologies that it's negligible, even if you were correct, the only solution would be exact replicas. As someone who has a BR 40 odd NC, and a br 68 VS, I would take the EM6 over any other LMG EVERY DAY OF THE WEEK, and if I couldn't have that, I'd take the Gauss SAW instead.

You're going back to the "it's flat" argument, but you obviously don't dogfight. Majority of your shots will be in scenarios I mentioned. The Reaver is the medium between the Mosquitos and the Scythes shape, it's not flat nor sleek, it's in the middle ground between two extremes, whats the problem.

I'm finding it hard to debate with you when you repeat your arguments and say things like "VS has lots of accuracy with no disadvantage" - this alone just kind of makes me wonder why I'm bothering to post at this point if you've already convinced yourself that NC is hard, it really just looks like you're fishing for people to agree with you so you can blame your sub-par performance on the tools.

I love NC and how they think idiotic things like this.

No, the easiest to learn and to master. As for OP, no, all 3 factions are fairly balanced, though I'd say VS have the least fun and unique items other than the Magrider.

But for a faction that has 200 damage LMG's, the easiest ESF to do reverse maneuvers in, the easiest to use yet hardiest MBT (Primary easier to use than VS/TR due to velocity, and the simple fact it has the highest alpha strike and the only tank to 1 shot ESF's - secondary the best in the game) with also having Phoenix's that allow you to hide away cowardly and press LMB to receive xp, and ravens being absolutely easy as anything to use - Wire guided and camera guided crap that should never have been implemented due to how damn easy the AV turret is, oh and lets not forget hackmax's - Press LMB/RMB instant gib someone unfortunate enough to turn a corner, any other max you can get away from. Oh and while getting the best starter LMG they also get the best Sniper (and no, having to spend 400 certs is NOT an excuse, because 1 - their easy as **** to get, and 2 - You balance a game around the END game, not what you start with, but even then, the SAW is still a beast)

I won't neglect to mention, while TR/VS don't have access to any 200 damage weapons, NC do have access to high RoF weapons and equivalents like the GD-7F.

Hell, I'd even mention the jackhammer because I seriously fail to see the whine NC give, it just pretty much sums up the mentality, but I won't mention it as I don't have a great deal of experience with the chain gun so I can't compare the 3.

Oh, and really, do you HONESTLY think this generations gamers all flock to the "hard mode" faction? No, there's a reason NC have been having the highest population for quite some time over the majority of servers. hell, even yesterday it was 61% NC and 19% VS 20% TR - at prime time. No, people flock to the easiest faction.

Again, I'll state clearly, the game is pretty balanced across factions, NC just have easy, cheap and cheesy weapons.

Carv = Saw = Orion. But let me guess, statistics mean nothing, right?

Yes, the default NC LMG is much better at medium to long range than close range. If you want to be better at that range, you'll need a different gun or different class.

The Reaver has stronger vertical thrust. This does between jack and $hit to make up for the bigger target, slower speeds, and less maneuverability. Good luck.

The Vanguard is too slow, in both reloading and movement. It simply can't earn EXP very fast. In most instances a Lightning will earn you as much or more EXP, despite being a numerically inferior vehicle.

In comparison between the 3 factions, NC vehicles never come in first.
In fact, I believe the only NC specific item that was best between the 3 was the MAX. This has been nerfed in two successive patches, so I would expect it to now place 2nd or 3rd.


What this means to me:
Your best chances of consistently earning experience will be the common pool items. i.e. Sunderer, Lighting, NS-11, Decimator, and Burster MAX. Faction specific weapons are usually too situational to be consistently successful.
NC infantry weapons all favor more space between you and the enemy, which will tend to reward a "camping" type of play.
NC has the simplest weapons, which many people confuse with being easy to use. One look at the stats will show you the truth. Understanding them and using them are two very different things.

No, they're not the same guns.

And I guess you didn't read the part where I said "not default weapons" as attachments make them even more different weapons.

If you think the SAW is anything like the Orion or the Carv you're plain delusional and haven't used either.

Not like I were the entire faction, but thanks for the heads up, could check that out too

That doesn't make it undeniable, that's ad populum and preaching to the choir, don't know much about that LMG, but Default one has lots of recoil AND slow rate of fire, plus it's attachments not only are just for medium to long range, but actually make Close range worse (worse hip-fire accuracy), so not moot.
Carv is pretty much the best imo, high rate of fire, low recoil, it's dps is a lot higher; haven't tried Orion, but it holds both accuracy and a rate of fire higher than NC at close range. Most fighting is done at close range, so I don't really see the point of a machine gun being Medium-to-long range. if there would be a game-wise solution, either make hipfire have less spread or make their bullets hit harder, but hitting 1 or 2 bullets at a distance of 3 to 5 meters seems pretty bad, ADS makes you slower so it would be terrible to do at Close Range.

You're calling for Ad nauseum too soon, I DID dogfight, and Reaver isn't a "medium" between them, Mossy's shape is long, their disadvantage's mostly above and front, Scythe's disadvantage would from above and below on the wings, Reaver? it's a box, anywhere you aim at it it's the same, it's disadvantage's simply the main box-shaped area which covers a lot of it, a lot easier to hit since it's constantly big. Scythe has the advantage of agility, when it's chased? it's hitbox's as flat as a pancake, and repeating it doesn't make it invalid, it points out how it isn't a point to be dismissed.

It's funny you accuse me of that when you're pretty much doing it yourself

VS have Scythe too, best ESF hands down
Don't know what do you mean by "reverse maneuver", do ESF have a reverse thrust button or something?
I don't still know how is it the "best" LMG, I mean, it's recoils' ruthlessly extreme, and their rate of fire's kind of small, doesn't help much at close range, best sniper? haven't played infiltrator that much, but isn't it the only bolt-action default sniper? why is it the best? Don't know that much about carbines tho.

Don't know if this generation does but I do, though I'm not sure but I think I've mostly seen NC around 30% or sometimes even 20% and another faction taking over with 40% and taking the maps.

@IIPendragon So.... their only advantage's looking cool? oh ok
I still like Gauss rifle burst tho, and it hits pretty hard, plus Van has damage and I'm not exactly sure but I think it has also more armor?

Under powered ? No

Harder to learn ? Not in general .. But I do feel we do get the least " new " player friendly starter LMG .. Once you get used to the Gauss its a great gun but it can be a bit unforgiving for new players.

We should have really had the GD22 or EM1 as a starter weapon

Definitely not.

And to be shot down by the other smaller, faster, more agile ESFs.

And the MBT with the least success statistically.

The Phoenix rocks, not going to deny that. It's also very situational in that it turns incredibly slowly, has a very limited range, and leaves you wide open for counter attacks when you're using it. If you don't have a good hiding spot, you're as good as dead when the rocket is in flight. I actually prefer the Devastator in most situations because I can fire and forget.

That's very debatable. The SAW is quite potent at Medium to Long range, but it's a horrendous CQB weapon because of its slow fire rate and poor hipfire accuracy. The TR's CARV, for example, is infinitely better at CQB. And where do most of the game's important fights take place? That's right, indoors. There are few, if any crucial control points that aren't located indoors -- where SAW users had might as well not even attempt to go. Don't get me wrong, the SAW isn't a bad gun, but you're stuck at using it at long range in which case you'll have fewer opportunities to tear people up and make a big difference versus more CQB-oriented LMGs.

I don't think it has anything to do with it being the "easiest" faction, but rather the faction that so many people can relate to, especially since they have the most basic designs that match those found in the real world and in games like Battlefield 3. The NC is no easier to play than TR or VS, I'll tell you that right now.

Every faction has cheap and cheesy weapons. The NC has some, and the TR and VS have some.

In terms of performance, they're even, was my point.

My impression is that the differences between factions is not as vast as some claim. There are things that make each factions better in certain situations but, mostly, it comes down to player skill.

NC traits are high damage for low rate of fire and high recoil. So, to be good with NC, you really have to make your shots land. This takes time to learn how to do. Each weapon has it's quirks.

I have found that the other factions are a little easier to pick up and adapt to. Both TR and VS weapons as more forgiving. They either have better hipfire accuracy or more bullets to spray with.

More than anything, however, I just find the NC has more dumb scrubs. On Waterson, anyway. I often check out other NC outfits and, sadly, the vast majority of 'em are terrible. It's rather frustrating to see. It seems that the other factions have more skilled, smarter players (and more overall: TR)

It has to be organization and skill....for MBT at the top ranks, there is no curve up. I think your chi squared is too low. You need a bigger dataset.