I might be wrong.. but are NC weapons better than TR?

I'm a TR player, BR 63.

It occurred to me today that NC weapons being slower firing and harder hitting may actually be better than TR weapons and here is my logic.

So TR have higher fire rates which means that you have to land more bullets on target, now I know generally they have a higher rate of fire but 1 headshot with an NC weapon does more damage than 1 headshot with a TR weapon, and given the recoil factor of both it's less likely that you will hit a second headshot with either however the NC weapon will have done significantly more damage, which leads me to think that an NC weapon in the hands of someone who can get atleast 1 headshot on target is better than a TR weapon?

Any thoughts?

NC weapons punish misses harder and are affected more by Nanoweave. TR weapons have weaker headshots and (usually) more horizontal recoil.

I think they're balanced for the most part. I personally prefer 167 guns over 143 because it's easier to get into the "rhythm" of placing each shot. Were I a highly skilled player rather than above average, I would probably favor 143 guns for the superior raw DPS.

It evens out as your rate of fire allows you more chances for headshots. It is also more punishing to miss with a lower rate of fire weapons but at the same time they are, usually, more controllable so it evens out here as well. It really comes down to getting used to and finding what works for you.

For many players, they will start out feeling great about a new weapon but after awhile *most* players will fall into a lull where they aren't into the weapon or focus as hard making the weapon seem less. Similarly, if you only play one faction for a short will you lessen the chance to end up with terrible situations. By this I mean, if you roll with an outfit or try to play the objective you are likely to get worse performance than if you run as a lone wolf since this means players focus solely on personal performance, i.e. can withdraw, farm, or generally put themselves in favorable positions without abandoning a squad.

You will frequently hear or stories of players logging over to another faction, getting a killing spree and concluding that "OMG, this faction is so much stronger!!!"

The TL;DR version though, it comes down to what you enjoy more. A high rate of fire weapons tends to be better in CQC and low rate of fire at range. You have to take into account damage model here too, so a 167dmg/600rpm and 143dmg/750rpm+ is a solid choice for closer range and can be muscled to work well at mid-range too.

Though depending on who you ask you might get a lot of different answers. Best bet is to find out for yourself and not get too hung up on what the other faction has.

NC guns are far better.

<looks around for Liewec>

Anything that kills faster is better.

I am not talking about "theoretical" time to kill, but actual in game results. Don't give me this: "If the moon is in Sagittarius and Jupiter aligns with Neptune during the Harvest Moon phase, then the TR TAR medic weapon's TTK is 0.0000098 times faster than its equivalent NC medic weapon.

Example that proves, via 100% science, that NC weapons are > TR weapons:

TR guy wields a small hammer.
NC guy wields a huge sledgehammer.

Who wins? Who do you want to be?

Another example:

TR guy and NC guy compete to cut down trees.

TR guy wields a pocket knife.
NC guy wields a huge double bladed axe.

Who wins? Who do you want to be?

Just like putting more of a delay on C4 so NC MAXs don't die as quick, yup. Game is Sooooooo leaning towards NC....... as always.

I'm sure you're not very serious, but just in case got any evidence for why you feel the NC's generally harder and less forgiving weapons with often near-to-identical TTK weapons somehow manage to consistently kill faster than their TR equivalents?

And remember, we're not talking about theoretical TTKs here either.

Looking at the performance stats the NC's weapons do not surpass those of the TR. Some weapons are better, some are worse. If you look at the average NC weapon you will even find they are more punishing.

NC weapons have similar DPS as TR one's. They also have similar TTK. But when an NC weapon misses it takes slightly longer to fire the next round and finish the job than for a TR weapon, allowing the higher ROF weapons to win more with equal accuracy.

This is usually the part where people go "but it is well documented that NC has all the newbs and hillbillies!" this is a myth that already existed at launch, when experienced players were far and few between and almost everyone was a newb. It also doesnt fit with NS and carbon-copy weapons like Lightning Guns, sniper rifles and shotguns. NC scores just as well (and in many cases slightly better) with such weapons as the TR and VS, which debunks the "they be newbs and hillbillies" rethoric.

Try to play NC for a while, play them till BR67 as well and then compare your achievements to those of your old character (which is kinda unfair as you will skip the newb fase).

Only half serious.

I play TR most of the time, I do have an NC, and my play time with that character is no where near my TR, but when I do play him, I am AMAZED at how fast I kill people. They die so fast I am often left just standing there, wondering what happened.

The damage profile of NC weapons far exceeds any lower rate of fire. And the supposed advantage of TR having more ammo per clip? That is illusory. I'd rather kill an enemy and reload as NC than spray and pray as TR.

Anecdotally, it seems more of the ****t3r types go NC, and NC heavy specifically. KDR is there focus and TTK is important there.

A nice comparison is NC's EM1 vs TR's T16, and for the sake of comparison, VS's VX29. On the surface all these weapons look the same sporting a 143 damage per bullet before 20m, and 112 damage after 65m. All three guns fire at 659 RPM with a 100 bullet magazine, so for the untrained eye, they are all the same.

EM1 is often called NC's worst LMG, and I will argue T16 is worse, with the implication that NC has better weapons than TR in a worst case LMG scenario, i.e. if you choose the worst LMG of the relevant faction. Why is T16 worse? This boils down to reload times, accuracy stats, and available attachments.

Reload
T16 (and VX29) have reloads = 3.9s/4.9s, EM1 have 3.5/4.4. So EM1 is better by ~0.5 secs

Hipfire Accuracies
T16: 3.5, 4, 4, 4.5
EM1: 3, 3.5, 3.5, 4
VX29: 2, 2.5, 2.5, 3.25
So EM1 > T16, but VX29 dominates

Attachments
Soft-Point Ammo is available to both EM1 and VX29, High-Vel Ammo is available to T16. On a CQC weapon SPA > HVA.
Advanced laser sight is available to both EM1 and VX29, T16 can only equip a regular one.

Clearly EM1 is superior to T16, being better at both reloading, hipfire, and through attachments. If anything points in favor of T16 it is recoil values, but those are kind of subjective in any case.

How the game works :

Hard hitting vs. Fire rate.
The Emissary vs. The Commissioner

Which one is more popular and successful?

idk know about that i feel im always getting destroyed by tr weps, especially that bloody minigun.

and on briggs it seems like tr have the best squads, the most organisational skills the list could go on.

It depends on what you're looking at. If you only compare the best weapons that the factions have per class, then there is a nice balance in most regards. When comparing meta LMGs, TR even has somewhat of a competitive advantage with the MSW-R over the NC's Anchor and the VS's Orion.

Things become less equal when looking at the total arsenal. NC has the great advantage of having many good choices per weapon class, where TR and especially VS often have 2-3 good choices and a lot of obsolete guns that aren't worth using. Reason for this, among other things, is that NC damage models actually make their mid-to-long range weapons competitive, where as TR/VS range variants are often very underwhelming.

Basically my post from the last time this was brought up.

It really depends on who gets the drop on who.

You can get more alpha damage out sure, but in the long run DPS is king, it doesn't matter if you can do 999 damage in 1 bullet every 5 seconds if it doesn't kill the guy.

That is to say, cough cough sniper rifles, depend on that headshot to win the fight, so does the NC trying to triple plink your skull across the biolab, however the damage system is so closely knit into the 1000HP bar standard that alpha doesn't mean as much as you might think.

When it comes to the high RPM damage variants, the angriest gun in the game and the GR22 it comes down to who is in more optimal position to fight and then it's anyones game.

stats are stats!
stats don't care where the moon of Sagittarius is,
stats are not theoretical, a faster ttk is a faster ttk.

you said it yourself! "anything that kills faster is better".

and when that weapon with a faster ttk is also a bullet-hose it is just an added bonus,
taking less skill to do more damage, best of both worlds!
who cares if you miss a shot, you have a million more heading at the guy!

High RoF generally favors the less skilled player.

It's all very case-by-case though. All three factions have a 167 damage model gun. Once you depart the standard guns, things also get far more interesting. TR for example dominates anti-air. Striker, Lockdown bursters, and a formidable ESF but is weak in other areas.

Faction balance is pretty darn good overall and a good player can dominate with any of the three.

Play all 3 factions to experience the diverse arsenal, and see what works better for you, and perhaps more importantly, what's more fun.

TR infantry weapons tend to fail me more often than others, I'm not sure if it's related to drops in FPS or not having enough FPS for high RoF, or shots not registering as reliably as slower firing guns, or the CoF RNG, or network nonsense, or whatever else, but TR infantry guns are still my favorite for their hidden potential and aesthetics. Horrible attachments though and TMG-50 desperately needs a buff.

NC guns seem to have a bit of everything. I still call them slightly OP already owning a good bunch (Anchor, Gladius, Promise, Railjack, more to come). They have no downsides, it's just win-win, be it controllable recoil patterns, accuracy, hard hitting at range, mag size, ammo pool, CoF. Just strongly dislike NC faction aesthetics, but some quite nice sound effects, with my fav the standard pistol.

VS guns, sure I find them more reliable than TR, but they are very bland and in some cases simply underwhelming in comparison to their counterparts. Get rid of unstable ammo gimmick, no one asked for this. I used to like VS guns till learning to use TR's arsenal better, and now NC's.

The guy with he small hammer. Imagine how much faster I could strike and dodge. During the other guy's necessary wind-up, I'd already be smashing him across the sensitive points.
[/quote]
TR guy wields a pocket knife.
NC guy wields a huge double bladed axe.[/quote]
If you want to be specific, I would rather be the guy with a chainsaw. The weapons/tools that fit the description "double sided axe" rarely are designed for serious wood chopping.

You got it backwards, NC have the worst weapons all around.

A faction using guns that deal slightly more damage than other factions guns is a moot point in a first person shooter. It's like being the player who can kick the soccer ball the hardest on the field.

TR on the other hand have a meaningful edge. Higher RoF weapons are a hell of a lot more versatile than low RoF. Unlike the low RoF counterpart. High RoF weapons do not need to be burst-fired all the time to be effective. You can go full auto in CQC and do fine, or burst for long range battles. That's why Low RoF weapons are fundamentally worse than high RoF. Low RoF isn't able to do this and be effective at both. That is why I argue TR is without a doubt better than NC. As for VS? I don't know how any sane person can say weapons that have no bullet drop, low recoil, and high RoF is not OP in any sort of way.

YES nc have best weapons but only if you are GOOD.

Nanite system, problem solved.