If you want Gatekeeper nerfed, then...

How about just copy Enforcer or Saron stats.
Lets Gatekeeper spits differently colored and shaped bullets(probably red) and you will still see complaints from Nerflings..
cos da red ones goez fasta...

Except you are completely ignoring the fact that this secondary is attached to the Prowler. The reason the Saron "overperforms" is because it is attached to the MBT with the worst main gun, this is part of the reason why Prowler Halberd always seemed to underperform compared to the VS & NC Halberd. The justification for the Prowler's main gun outperforming the other MBT's was always because it lacked in other areas. A secondary that manages to perform equally to the other faction's "equivalents" while the main gun still outperforms its equivalents is in fact "overperformance".

I somehow doubt that adding the Lancer and both arms of the Vortexes together is going to outweigh the effect of the GK + GK-H. Considering, the GK-H is after only 14 days of data the biggest single killer of Q4 VS Harassers in the entire previous 30 days, while the Lancer and Vortexes have even less users and play time than the apparently useless Striker and Fractures respectively.

Sure dude, sure.

Or maybe I just lost the desire to try and reason with someone who is perfectly content sitting in The Cave, because the Sunlight hurts so much.

The Gatekeeper just needs a few adjustments; as the current iteration has such an incredibly low skill ceiling it's silly.
The Velocity should have never been boosted to 166% of it's counterparts. Drop the velocity down to Saron / Enforcer levels, so at least some leading has to be done.

You could throw whole package arguments at it all day, (Prowler is more dps! with now good secondar-- whatever) but the heart of the matter is: (Really this just needs to be in my sig at this point.)

It's not overperforming, it's just easy to use!
-Gatekeeper, 2015.

It's not overperforming, it's just easy to use!
-PPA, 2014. It's now nerfed to worst in category.

The GateKeeper is not overpreforming AV wise and the "new and shiny" & overhype effects are going down.


Are you going full R-Trd trying to push this agenda?

You cannot compare a ES AI weapon with a ES AV weapon.

I think you missed the part where I said this exact thing.

You seemed to miss the ES !!

The VSForumarmy does not want the TR having something fun and unique to use which is perfoming really well. They will jump this gun until its nerfed to the ground.

I give it a resounding Meh.
Sure it's arguably effective, great even on a Harasser; but nothing about crushingly low skill ceilings shouts FUN! in my book.
It just gives a platform for people to complain about it.

tl;dr:

• Stop comparing weapons of different classes. Compare GK/Saron/Enforcer/Halberd, or make no comparison at all.
• The GK isn't OP, but it's much too easy to use, could be deadlier at the cost of accuracy, raising the skill floor.
• I would like to see it tweaked ( NOT nerfed ), so that it is a little less controllable and accurate with a buff to damage or something that doesn't have to do with accuracy.

Full version:
I find it funny that people are comparing apples and oranges with the GK.
You can't compare the GK to Vortexes, or Lancers because they are not the same class of weapon, just like it can't be compared with Pheonixes or Ravens.

Yes, TR needs a long range Vehicle-Based AV. I'll be the first to defend that point, but you can't hold up the stats of any old weapon that fills a similar role as proof of balance, thats just not how it works. By comparing weapons of separate classes, you're essentially spinning the data and providing an incomplete picture. Either compare like weapons, or don't make any comparisons at all. Even anecdotal evidence holds more value than skewed statistics.

See: (Emphasis mine)
Lying with Statistics:
Using true figures and numbers to “prove” unrelated claims. (e.g. "College tuition costs have actually never been lower. When taken as a percentage of the national debt, the cost of getting a college education is actually far lower today than it was in 1965!"). A corrupted argument from logos. (See also Half-truth, Snow Job, and Red Herring.)

It's easy to find what you want to see in the numbers, but it's alot harder to defend them if you don't provide an accurate picture.

Comparisons should be between the GK, Saron, Enforcer, Halberd, and nothing else. If those other options are imbalanced, its because of a separate problem. Personally, I think the GK needs a tweak, and will continue to defend that point, but that doesn't mean I want it directly nerfed. It's not OP, but it isn't balanced either, the skill floor is just far too low. Hell, I'd be content with them making it more powerful while lowering the accuracy, anything that would take it from the easy-mode point and click that it is in it's current state.

We get assymetrical or symmetrical balance. We don't get both.

Halberd deserves a mention at least.

You're right! Completely left that one out. Sorry about that. Fixed.

The point still stands though, compare within the class, or else the comparison is useless.

NO I didn't...YOU DID!!! feel free to show me where you wrote "ES" in your original post...

You wrote "TR complaints about VS/NC long range weapons have been waved away by the factions time and again, time and again, time and again"

OK, let me say it again...The TR have ALWAYS had access to a long range AV weapon, The Halberd, that performs both statistically and functionally nearly identically to the Enforcer and Saron and at NO time where the TR ever at a disadvantage or lacking long range AV, only an ES variant.

The TR now have an ES long range AV, but unlike the enforccer and Saron which are by virtually every measure a side grade to the halberd, the gatekeeper due to its projectile velocity, extremely small OF and DROP and no Recoil, is an upgrade not a side grade as supported by player experience and actual performance statistics...

Villanuk said: ↑

“But now we have an ES long range like the NC and VS, so 2 options like every other faction.”

TR always had a long range AV option...It was called the Halberd, which performs on par or even better then the Enforcer/Saron...Only person you should be yelling out is yourself for not using the Halberd, if you needed a long range AV secondary.

Really, you even quoted me !!! So funny, so so so funny..................

I failed? Please go over what I responded to from the original post, quoted below, line by line and please highlight where "ES" is anywhere...

I didn't miss the "ES" part because it was never there...learn to read

I agree, basilisk should be given a small buff. Maybe a slight increase in projectile velocity or RPM.

Utilizing your logic, let's go further.

I vote that we have the devs delete the Ravens, Phoenix and Enforcer from the game.

After all, NC has the Annie, Decimator, Halberd and other universal NS gear. They don't need these NC specific things at all, they can just make do!

I have no input on the GK balance, but, from an outside perspective, you sound completely unreasonable. Game balance is frustrating, that doesn't mean you should post something so provocative. This is counter-productive, you're just fueling the "nay-sayers" with even more will to get the weapon you are defending nerfed.

I do NOT want to make its accuracy like the fracture's,i just want to eliminate its pin point accuracy because its so easy to use (OoD even shows that).
And 160 rof is considered high compared to such accuracy,saron trades 2 things for its dmg,accuracy and clipsize.while the only thing that the GK trades is dmg.and again,a low rof wepon with a sniper's accuracy will always win no matter how hard hitting the saron is because the weapon will simply be firing from extremely long distance(range beats damage)also,i want you to fight TR more (since you are VS now) and see how they are abusing this thing when it comes to infantry fights which really reminds of how we were using the PPA:
1) get your GK vehicles
2)sit 300 metres away from infantry fights
3)spam the area
4)get wrekt
5)end of the fight

that's what we want,whats the problem in this?

Why not just lower the damage, but increase the magazine size and reload speed? Ease of use can be tempered if the item works within niche or restrictive conditions (Lasher, Lancer, Locks-Ons, etc.). The higher TTK makes it only optimal for long range while the increased magazine retains the overall DPM (and a bit higher reload since 1.75s is pretty short). Let the GK excel at range like the Vulcan did in its time for short range. Medium ranges get dominated by the Halberd, Saron, Enforcer, and short ranges go the ES-Vulcans.