[Suggestion] Battle Rifle Overhaul

Discussion in 'Engineer' started by Joexer, Sep 9, 2014.

  1. Erendil

    Hmmm, sounds like you want to turn them into Scout Rifles? Meh, I like the current rapid RoF and action of Battle Rifles and wouldn't want that changed much except to have the pull to the right removed since it makes it hard for new users to accurately fire followup shots.

    A damage increase would be a good buff for it tho. :cool: Say from 250/225 max/min to 300/240. That'd reduce its STK by 1 against Nanoweave 5 at all ranges, while extending its 4-shot kill against non-Nano targets out to 50-60m.

    But a corresponding RoF decrease wouldn't be needed. They need a straight buff, not a buff/nerf rebalance. Out of all primary weapons (beside BASRs which cant' be compared due to OHK), Battle Rifles have:
    • the lowest DPS
    • the slowest TTK outside of the Corvus w/in 8m,
    • the lowest KPH outside of the 3 starter carbines (new player bias) and Gauss Compact S (only the Eidolon is Higher)
    • the lowest KDR outside of the 3 starter carbines (new player bias)
    So they're the lowest damage, slowest killing, worst performing primary weapons in the game. No nerfs necessary. :cool:
  2. Togamek

    Why not just add new BRs into the game instead of changing the current ones?
    Make a few burst variants. (two rounds per and 3 rounds... maybe even 4?)
    Personally I like the semi auto types just fine.
    • Up x 3
  3. tf2hero

    hmmm i like the idea of saber-13 BR to replace the AMR66 (*** magic rifle 666:eek:)

    a shadow (or whatever the higher damage scout rifle is) stats for the warden

    hmm not to sure what what to do with the eidolon kinda keep it as it is but give a a faster reload 1.5 seconds no bullet drop?

    and all BR's should get a velocity increase of 50-100 for all BR's
  4. SJAC

    BRs are fine, killer weapons. Don't touch them
  5. Erendil

    All data I've seen, plus my own extensive experience, state otherwise. They're the slowest killing, worst performing (KDR, KPU, KPM) primary weapons in the game. How is that in any way fine?

    Remove the pull to the right, tighten the ADS CoF, and give it a damage or RoF buff and then maybe they'll be fine.
    • Up x 3
  6. Joexer

    Yeah. I have changed my opinion. We need more. The current may need a damage, recoil and rof buff. But nothing else. Other variants would be nice so we can give infils a nice es auto scout rifle with an extended mag or somthing.
    • Up x 1
  7. Popper100

    A note on the BR reload differences, that picture was made on 9/8 of pictures taken on 9/8. And I remember, but can not find, the change note in the August patch notes. So, right now, the Warden is better than the AMR-66. This is confirmed with a little non-scientific testing with the Warden and an NS-15M, which have the exact same reload time now.
    • Up x 1
  8. ATRA_Wampa-One

    First off, I like the idea that the TR BR gets a few extra rounds per clip, which means the NC one reloads faster, the VS one has no bullet drop, and the TR one gets a few more shots before reloading.

    Second, I think introducing ES burst fire BR with similar burst stats to the SABR because it's the only functioning burst rifle.

    2 round burst, 167 damage, almost non-existent FSRM. TR's would have a few more rounds per clip, VS would have no bullet drop, NC would have a shorter reload time. If you wanted to have NC's burst BR be 200 damage but lower ROF (so they have the same TTK) and less rounds per magazine that's fine as well.

    Then introduce an NS version of the stock and burst battle rifle variants (either lower ROF for 0.75 ADS or better damage loss stats) for directives since auraxiuming scout rifles for the directive battle rifle sucks.

    Now all the dev team would have to do is make a directive scout rifle.
  9. Jaedrik

    I would rather they made a new scout rifle and just made scout and battle rifles cross-class available.
    • Up x 1
  10. Joexer

    Yes! but more burst imo. Just no scouties/brs for light assults. Awesome Ideas guys.
  11. Erendil

    I couldn't find any patch notes on this either, but I went into VR last night and sure enough, the Warden does seem to reload faster than the AMR-66/Eidolon, and about the same as the NS-15M. :eek: At least on short reloads (I didn't test long reloads).

    This sounds almost like an accidental buff. Like maybe they were using the Warden as a template when making the Directive Battle Rifles and just forgot to change this back once they were done testing. Else why not give it to the AMR-66 too? OR all three for that matter.

    It's also quite an odd change, since reload speed isn't an issue with the BRs at all. DPS/TTK at close-medium range, and accuracy/reliability at long range are the issues that need addressing. Speeding up the reloads seems completely random and arbitrary. :confused:
  12. Popper100


    It is weird, isn't it? I made that post with the picture to rip the Devs a bit and hopefully get one of the CMs here to let them know "Uh, guys? Something slipped through in the last update, maybe it should be fixed." But alas the word has gone unheard and NC wins again.
  13. Joexer

    Yeup... And shouldnt they have long reload. The idea of a ns Battle rifle is making me tear up. That audio would be awesome.
  14. Nehlis

    Hopefully give better faction distinction. Currently they're nearly carbon copies.
  15. Lord_Avatar

    Oh no way - the SABR-13 stays in TR hands. ^^

    BRs seem fine to me to be honest. The only change I'd introduce across the board is a miniscule hipfire buff and a very slight ROF increase.
  16. Naivuud

    I'm using the Warden even at close ranges with a 6x scope because it's an overlay. Once the other scopes are fixed I'll switch back to a 2x or 3.4x for close range fights. Using non overlay sights sends shots where the scope isn't on live servers, especially when moving.

    I like it because it's decent at all ranges, though it's not outstanding at any when compared to weapons that are specialized. I like the Warden as it is but there is one change I'd like for battlerifles.

    That change would be reducing or removing the side to side recoil on it when firing as fast as possible. At very long range it's best to let the recoil reset between every shot because full speed firing will send some if not most of your bullets around either side of the target even with the foregrip. At close range you already can fire as fast as you can and the bullets hurt.

    Perhaps that change would make them too strong though, I don't know if they are balanced at long range by requiring recoil resets.

    Maybe semi auto snipers could use the same kind of treatment as I usually allowed those to reset before firing again, though I haven't used one in a long time.
  17. Nakar

    Semi-auto snipers and scout rifles have a "soft" limitation on spamming shots because they have extensive COF bloom per shot that makes it worthless to keep firing after 3-5 shots. Battle Rifles have the COF bloom of your ordinary weapon, higher than an automatic per shot but commensurate with the expected bloom for their ROF over time, meaning you actually can spam shots from one. This is its primary distinction over a scout rifle and why people who think BRs should be turned into SRs are smoking something.

    They just need to bring in the recoil some and fix the scopes. They're doing half of that. Also it wouldn't hurt a thing if all three BRs had the quicker reload figures listed for the Warden, honestly. Maybe that was a buff they were planning to do and they just kinda forgot? It wasn't in any patch notes.
  18. OldMaster80

    Personally I've quit using High Velocity Ammo and replaced forgrip with the Laser Sight. The idea was to have a more flexible loadout viable fot urban combat / hipfire.
    Guess what? It rocks.
    Now that I tried to play this way I disagree with the OP: BR do not need any change!
  19. Erendil

    Yeah I've stopped using HVA on BRs for anything but my Ninja setup (3.4x/Suppressor/Laser/HVA). The added recoil forces me to slow my RoF in order to maintain the same accuracy. Not worth it for an extra 35-40m/s.

    Weapon stats show that BR's perform very, very badly in literally everyone's hands except for a select few. And I mean, very few.

    They have the slowest TTK, lowest DPS, lowest KDR, lowest KPU, and lowest KPH of any primary weapon in the game (except the 3 starter carbines, whose KDR/KPH are barely lower due to new player bias skewing the numbers). And you're okay with this? :eek:

    Don't get me wrong. I love BRs and I do fairly well with them. But I have no delusions about how they perform in the hands of your average (or even above average) player.
  20. MajiinBuu

    Of all the heavy/engineer/medic primary weapons, the battle rifles are by far the best at the edge of infantry-render-distance.