Why do maxes "ruin fights"?

Discussion in 'MAX' started by xboxerdude, Apr 9, 2014.

  1. xboxerdude

    Why do you think they ruin a fight? IMO they add depth to the gameplay and add a "boss" element to the game. I also enjoy the strategy behind using them such as positioning, flanks, back and forths with other maxes etc.
    They also give someone a good amount of health so you don't insta-die to stuff (such as spawn camping).


    I'd like to hear logical rational explanations, I'm honestly of the opinion that people just don't know how to deal with a max, get owned over and over and then complain about it without thinking that they might have to change tactics.

    There are plenty of top players that have countered me in a max (in HAs) they know how to , and they aren't lonewolfs just running blindly through doorways.
    • Up x 1
  2. Konfuzfanten

    And thats the problem, a FPS should be about skill: accuracy, reflexes and situational awareness. Not who got the best crutch.

    The MAX suit reduces a lot of the need for reflexes and situational awareness compared to normal infantry, as you say yourself:
    Another problem with the current MAX is that its a small fight killer, a good player in a MAX suit is nearly unbeatable if running flak armour.

    With that said i do enjoy rolling around solo in my TR skillsuit and rarely dies, even when im running autorepair.

    Ofc, if we are talking +48vs+48 battles, then i dont see a huge problem with the current MAX, its mainly for small scale and ofc the offensive power of the suit.

    As i have said before, cut the dmg output by 50% and double the health = they will still be able to breach a heavy fortified position, but solo MAX's will be gimped.

    The fact that around 40000 of your 66000 total kills are in a MAX suit, i think you opinion is kinda subjective ;)

    But thats a really impressive kill number with the Hacksaws! :cool:
    • Up x 6
  3. Jaedrik

    MAXes seem to 'ruin' fights because they are the most versatile and inevitable power multiplier one can encounter. By inevitable, I mean one sees them able to go anywhere and be effective. I, personally, do not like this inevitability. As a HA who runs AV grenades at all times and has a decent arm, I can say it's not that easy to take MAXes, groups of MAXes, out. Subjectively, I just want to fight other squishy targets, not hard targets like the MAX. MAXes are simply a straight upgrade from all other infantry classes the vast majority of the time. This is why I think they 'ruin' fights.
    • Up x 2
  4. Crucifos

    It's on a timer, costs slightly less than a lightning, but can be scrapped by SAF. It's the intimidation factor more than anything, I think - I've been more useful as mid-range sniper or mine-sowing handyman - MAX suits aren't strict upgrades. When they show up in a fight, they're tanks. Now, if it could capture points, carry C4, and requisition a Lightning or MBT? Yeah, I'd be crying foul.

    But they don't.

    To be honest, I'd rather fight three good MAX pilots than a Liberator with an experienced crew. Treat them like what they're supposed to be - tiny vehicles. Which is to say, avoid their front and pump a few roman candles into their rear. Barring that, toss a brick and make MAX-fetti.

    Had a NC MAX zerg on Waterson earlier, 12-15 of the 40+ man group in a max, half that as engies and medics. I hopped into my sneaky pants, and, with a little help, took out their support line. Rock beats scissors, scissor paper, and paper rock.
    • Up x 4
  5. Iridar51

    Why MAXes ruin fights? That's a good question, I too wonder about it sometimes.
    Indeed, why do you MAXes keep ruining fights? Please, stop it! I don't want my fights ruined, but you keep doing it.

    I remember this one time, I had a good fight, and then a MAX came and ruined it. "Please, stop! Don't ruin my fight!" - I screamed in despair. But MAX didn't listen. And then another MAX came, and another, and they all ruined the fight until nothing was left of it.
    • Up x 6
  6. NoInstructions

    Because people like you who aren't very good at infantry pull them every chance they get.
    • Up x 4
  7. Jaedrik

    My sentiment remains regardless, as strong as ever. MAXes feel dirty, like spawn camping with my prowler, and I want to fight other squishies in bio labs/bases, not mini tanks.
    This is my opinion, of course.
  8. Posse

    This, and I'd add that because of MAXes, when a faction decides to do a MAX crash, the only possible counter is another MAX crash, you can't call that "deep gameplay", if anything, MAXes make the gameplay more shallow
    • Up x 2
  9. Kriegson

    Obviously you might consider me biased, but MAX's don't really "Ruin fights" Imo any more than liberators. It sucks for people who haven't bought direct counters (C4, AV grenades, etc) but they do provide a method for those with weaker twitch skills to contribute to an infantry fight, either by playing as a max or supporting one.

    Alternatively they can be excellent stalemate breakers, which I can see some people seeing as "A good fight" but overall just kind of holds everyone up on the same base for hours.
    Not unlike tanks, they are very easy to kill without support. Even the dumbfire rockets you start with can kill them in two shots, and if you keep your head on right you can easily hit them with a rocket, run back into cover, reload, and pop out for another. Dead max.

    Max crashing is an issue though. Hopefully the new supply system can at the very least make this difficult to pull off logistically.
  10. Ivalician

    There are a lot of things wrong about MAXes atm. Right now, AI MAXes essentially just function as straight upgrades to infantry, but otherwise with identical mechanics. A bunch more HP and a 900 RPM, 200 rd. per mag., stabilized LMG. They aren't different enough to require an entirely different approach ( such as light assault vs. heavy assault ) so they're easy to pickup, and as a straight upgrade to standard infantry act as a significant enough force multiplier that in a fight with initially close enough to equal numbers, the only real answer to a MAX crash then becomes an opposition MAX crash because only another MAX crash has the staying power to make sure some medic ball doesn't roll in and rez everything.

    Konfuzfanten has it right that MAX's should have greatly reduced damage output so they can't simply chew up infantry, but way more durability as a tradeoff. This will allow them to assist in pushing lines and breaching, but will remove their ability to operate as independently as they do. Right now, it's literally, I'll turn a bad corner, and they'll be an AI max around the corner and I get instagibbed. Or at least I'll be back around the corner, but due to lag compensation, I'll still be dead. Essentially removing their ability to actively hunt down targets as hunter killers.

    Another thing: a stalemate is fun. There's no downtime in the action. No downtime in travel or sitting at a cap point in a mostly empty base. A stalemate is a good fight, and right now, good fights are a dying breed. The dwindling population can't really support huge, SIZE MATTERS, battles that Planetside is supposed to be all about as well as it used to. Furthermore, at this point, plenty of players, heck, entire outfits, have heavily invested into vehicles and MAXes to the point where there's no reason to pull infantry when you can farm from a vehicle, so the moment a good fight gets rolling, some #MLGPROYOLOSWAG outfit will just come along and HE spam / MAX crash all the infantry into oblivion, pop the sunderer, and it's back to the crappy grind of non-satisfying gameplay and Standing Around Twiddling My Thumbs Simulator 2014.

    Finally, infantry will always be the big draw. There exists and there always will exist the "brave fighting men of the infantry vs. everybody else" mentality. You can say what you want about combined arms, but just go look up viewership counts on twitch for infantry players vs. vehicle players. Infantry will always be the core and the main draw. Nobody cares about the ********* in the skillsuit. When there's no infantry, there's no fight. Or at least no fight that anybody cares about. Dogfighters get the lone exception.

    The fights on release, while arguably not better, were at least HUGE ( as promised ) and frequent ( as implied as promised ). Now? Not so much.
    • Up x 4
  11. oherror

    They dont really ruin too many fights. Sure they help one side push or hold a point but a few rockets and they are down. I think they more or less enhance the fight. In my experience most MAXes go into tunnel mode with kills so multiple people can take them down with ease. Only few max users can really own a squad.

    That being said atm I have less issues with maxes then i do with hovering libs.
    • Up x 2
  12. Dethfield


    That is a load of BS. The counter to a MAX crash is.. get this... recon darts and general intelligence on the enemy. If you see the MAX crash coming, its exponentially easier to prepare for and stop it. Just about an hour ago, a platoon of VCO completely crushed (and i am not exaggerating here) a TR MAX crash at Tawrich. We were able to because we saw them streaming through the tunnel leading to the vehicle pads.

    We waited for them (they actually got out of the vehicle bay and were heading up the grav lifts) and just unloaded everything we had.... and it worked. Very few deaths on our side, and the tech plant was ours. We didnt even set any traps with C4, proxy or tank mines, etc. But using those would have made it even easier.

    You have to tools to kill MAX's. Use them
    • Up x 1
  13. Posse

    AOD doesn't count, even a 5 year old kid can counter an AOD MAX crash, also, what were the pop numbers?
  14. Dethfield


    Fairly even, they had around a platoon there as well.
  15. Stromberg

    I wasn't there but I'm gonna assume you simply outnumbered them by a huge margin. there's no way in hell you could stop a MAX crash with infantry while even numbers on each side.
    • Up x 1
  16. Posse

    Considering the terribad outfits in Mattherson TR, yes, you can, but that's not because the MAX crash isn't OP.
    • Up x 1
  17. vilehydra

    I never find maxes that much of a problem, sure I get killed by them but so what? I can kill them just as easy with a HA or LA using c4/rockets/conc nades. When fighting maxes especially in smaller fights its about situational awareness. You will almost ALWAYS have the upper hand on a max in terms of initiating a fight because you can hear them walk really easy.

    I believed that maxes are balanced because they cost resources and can be used as an amazing force multiplier BUT can also go down extremely easily if they are playing poorly.

    More than I can say for vehicles, but that is a different thread.

    Of course this is my subjective opinion so take it with a grain of salt.
    • Up x 1
  18. Get2dachoppa

    I think MAXes get hate for similar reasons that vehicles can be a problem. 1). They can be spammed too easily. 2). They can make smaller engagements feel excessively lopsided when a MAX or two shows up
  19. Scr1nRusher

    I don't like maxes because you Don't need much skill to use them.



    More so I hate how they can shrug off a decimator at close range.
  20. ExarRazor

    people who ask why fighting maxes sucks are usually NC. they don't have to deal with trying to take a base with 4-5 scatmaxes camping every corner and doorway.

    at least with Tr and VS maxes, you have a possibility of taking them out

    scatmaxes instagib infantry at this ranges, and nobody likes being instagibbed