I Call BS on PU2

Is this some kind of joke I don't get? I doubt you're illiterate.

I think it's safe to assume that NC players aren't any better or worse than VS players so the question why Vanguards are mostly 1/2 is indeed interesting. They already have the best gun, best armor, they also have the Halberd (which is awesome). The Enforcer isn't a bad weapon either (more dps than the Halberd). They're only 5 kph slower than Prowlers. So what is it?

Wait, what? ZOE users get a chance to re-cert into other stuff? What about the things you said?

******** SOE, ******* ********

I'm just gonna do this to all the threads that have popped up today, because the outcome is inevitable.

I forgot how ridiculous the price for that modified enforcer piece of trash was.

At least now, the gun is just bad rather than being the worst joke in PS2 existance. Does it make you feel better?!
...
It shouldn't.

I don't get your hostility... Perhaps I'm reading wrong, but my understanding is you linked http://dota2.gamepedia.com/Invulnerability and stated that it showed there were downsides to invulnerability. I said I can't see where it does... For clarity's sake, here's the text of the article in its entirety:

"Invulnerability is a status effect that renders the target completely immune to all disables and damage, with the exception of direct HP removal. Most friendly effects, such as healing and teleports, are unaffected by invulnerability.
Invulnerable units cannot be targeted by attacks or abilities, and will often have their health bar temporarily hidden.
Invulnerability itself is not granted explicitly by any effects or spells, it is instead granted as a secondary effect to other abilities. Consequently, invulnerability is often only granted for very short periods of time.

...being hidden
Certain effects that hide or banish their caster will make them invulnerable and untargetable for a time. While they cannot be damaged in this state, they can still be killed in certain circumstances, such as in the case of Primal Split and Supernova. Unlike most banish effects, some heroes are still able to act in this state, although their actions are usually limited.

...disables
Some disables, notably banish, cyclone, and some sleep effects, will grant invulnerability for part or all of the disable's duration. Some of these disables can also be cast on friendly units or the casting unit itself.

...blink
Some blink abilities grant invulnerability while the unit is between destinations. The exact duration of invulnerability is dependent on the speed and range of the blink itself.

...transformation
Transformation, or metamorphosis, abilities grant a very brief period of invulnerability. When timed correctly, they can be used to dodge projectiles. Mirror image abilities will also grant a short period of invulnerability."

Forgive the off-topic moment. But I really don't see a single downside?...

I've learnt no lesson from that, only that I'm bad at any kind of trade

god this gif is so funny

The rule is:

"If it was OP then no SC!"

But ZOE got a refund.

Yeah, sounds like a whine post trying to get credibility by calling itself a PSA.

It's hard to differentiate between sarcasm, jokes, stupidity, or hostility here, especially with the current patch outrage. I don't mean to be hostile.

There is not a single ability that grants 8 seconds of invulnerability without a downside. It's much (much, much) shorter or you can't attack during invulnerability or you can even be killed during invulnerability (weird). It's not even an explicit "I-win-button", ever.

My understanding was that the shield collapses once enough damage has been applied.

I don't see much of a downside to the "lockdown" ability either since tank turrets aren't stabilized and shooting on the move is 90% luck based unless you are on perfectly flat terrain.
Personally I'd take the Prowler over the Vanguard any day.

While I wouldn't complain about a cert reset, it's really not necessary in PS2 because certs are unlimited: just keep playing and you'll get more certs (and you still have all that other stuff you already certed into in case you ever need to use it).

Because in most cases, two 1/2 Vanguards are better than one 2/2 Vanguard.

You can nerf the shield when vanguards can deal with infantry even 3/4 as good as prowlers and mags .
Right now vanguards are complete ****e for infantry farming/suppression and the stats are abysmal. So please shuthe piehole about the shield until the tanks are even close to being even in spm, kills, deaths etc
Vanguard is dead last in every single category.
So is the reaver, but who knows eventually the dev team might wake up.....

Being hidden...
"Certain effects that hide or banish their caster will make them invulnerable and untargetable for a time. While they cannot be damaged in this state, they can still be killed in certain circumstances, such as in the case of Primal Split and Supernova" (so that's not exactly Invulnerable)
Example: Phase Shift from Puck, you can be invulnerable for 3 seconds but you are completely IMMOBILIZED which means you can't move if you move then you are vulnerable again (Vanguard can move all it wants). Or, Brew Master's ultimate Primal Split, make him invulnerable from being damaged but put him at RISK of being killed, if all 3 spirits are killed.

blink...
As for this ability, I can give you example of Anti-mage or Queen of Pain, they can DODGE projectile or incoming attack during a SPLIT of second (.5-1 second); this requires a REALLY good concentration and timing, because it all happens under 1 second.

Transformation...
For example, Alchemist or Sylar Bear can transform through his ultimate skill that grants him, like above, A SPLIT of second that is under 1 second to DODGE any incoming projectile or damage.

Most of these things require VERY HIGH level of awareness since everything happens between 0.5 - 1 seconds, meanwhile PS2 Vanguard.... press F and done; not mentioning the invulnerability of ALL DAMAGE lasts up to 8 seconds; there's no such thing in Dota 2, either you're invulnerable to spell or invulnerable to Physical attack, even then heroes like Beast Master still able to go through Magic Resistance or Diffusal Blade that is used to cancel Invulnerablity. Everything in Dota 2 has counter (There's no counter to Vanguard's shield). There's a reason why LoL and Dota 2 are the top played modern games, and dota 2 alone is the most played game on Steam of ALL time.

wow it requires some skill? woah, is instalockons not enough?

It's the logic of the nerf that I didn't quite get: "AP is too good. So we're nerfing Lockdown."

This game needs a respec option, and they should give one out for free whenever there's a rebalance pass. Hardly an unusual idea since just about every MMO in existence runs with that policy. I know they screwed up trying to do that in the past, but doing it wrong once isn't a reason not to do it right later.

(they must have changed the rule to: "If it's OP then no SC...... unless it's ZOE!".

Can you imagine if they had a burster max on that thing?

It's a completely different weapon to use than when I spent on it. Having to maintain lock has put it beneath the annihilator in effectiveness in most situations. I'm not sure what about the striker gets people up in arms about it post-nerf, the damage isn't that good anymore and the projectiles still take a less effective path to their target making them easier to LoS, and of course now the user has to maintain the lock instead of getting a second lock while the first volley is on its way.